Talk:Decline of the secular left

Sigh, really?

"The Alt-right, or alternative right, is an emerging faction of the right-wing-"

Seriously? We're going with the narrative, peddled by both National Socialists and neo-Marxists, that the "alt-right" is right-wing? The movement embraces vanguardism, a Leninist concept (fascists and Nazis, rather than opposing core Marxist–Leninist tenets, often use them to compete with Communists), supports the abortion genocide, embraces Roman paganism, essentially can be described as "racial socialists," and places Progressive Movement figures such as Theodore Bilbo, Lothrop Stoddard, and Madison Grant as their ideological figureheads. —LT ^{(Mark 8:36)} Saturday, 00:30, January 7, 2023 (EST)

Times change. I will delete it. Conservative (talk) 00:35, January 7, 2023 (EST)

Thanks. Now, it's important to understand: what are the origins of the alt-right? This detailed article by FascinatingPolitics about Willis Carto is a good read. My understanding is that in the post–World War II era, defining factors of political ideology changed drastically. Obviously in the wake of the Holocaust, Marxists desperately had to quickly rebrand fascism and Nazism as "far-right," because imagine what would happen to their own reputations if everyone knew that they're in the same socialist camp as the perpetrators of the Final Solution.

Long story short, the "orthodox" leftists made sure that their movement won't be overtly associated with Nazism, and with National Socialists kicked out of the mainstream left for desperate expediency reasons, it's not hard to see why they would turn to infiltrating the right. Thus, the neofascist movements that coalesced into the "alt-right" embrace the label of "right-wing" and "reactionary" as part of their scheme to sneak into the political right as a parasite and turn it into a hegemony of white identity politics using core neo-Marxist tenets. Unfortunately most actual right-wingers nowadays, from my personal observation, are too idiotic to notice the larger picture, and moronically embrace collectivist propaganda pushed by the "alt-right," resulting in increasing factions of the conservative movement moving away from authentic right-wing principles and becoming syncretized with elements puppeteered by far-left National Socialists. The "alt-right" knows exactly how to fool the right, and so they deem their movement a "nationalist," "patriotic," "populist," "anti-establishment," and "anti-globalist" cause to make right-wingers think they're one of them.

In Mein Kampf, Hitler said that if Nazis failed to emphasize race, they would "compete with Marxists on their own ground." Well, isn't that what Nazis do anyways? One will notice that rather than rejecting Marxist identity politics, the "alt-right" simply reshapes it into a collectivist worship of "Aryans" rather than multiculturalism. Instead of opposing Leninist-rooted vanguardism, they reshape it into an ethnonationalist concept to compete with Marxist vanguardists on their own ground. When I notice political extremists on the internet who use the label "vanguard," it's sometimes difficult to determine whether it's Marxists or Nazis until I actually dig very barely to see the content, usually in the preview descriptions on the search engines. Yes, they really are that alike sometimes.

Basically, in summary, the "alt-right" are racial socialists, and by inherent nature are far-leftists. —LT ^{(Mark 8:36)} Saturday, 00:43, January 7, 2023 (EST)

In short, nature abhors a vacuum. So liberal journalists and academics (given the fact that there are more literary figures on the so-called "left" than the so-called "right"), invent terms like "alt-right" or "rightwing populism" to explain their own failures and defections from the so-called "leftist" camp, which than so-called "right-wingers" or "conservatives" accept, adopt, and swallow wholesale as gospel truth. RobS^{Give Peace a chance} 00:57, January 7, 2023 (EST)

It's a consistent pattern throughout history, left-wing movements splitting up and the orthodox faction branding the dissidents as "right-wing." In the early days of Weimar Germany, the socialists were divided between revolutionaries and reformists, with the Communists branding Social Democrats as reactionaries. Similarly, the hilariously idiotic usage of the term "real socialism," used today by Marxists to deny the socialist roots of Nazism, has been around in variations for a while. I ought to find a better source than Kershaw, though get a load of this—in 1919, insurgent revolutionary Communists branded the failed socialist Bavarian government of Kurt Eisner as a "pseudo–Councils Republic," and they instead promised a real Councils Republic! —LT ^{(Mark 8:36)} Saturday, 01:07, January 7, 2023 (EST)

In historical reading and research, it is important to understand the Zeitgeist. In 1919, with defeat of the aristocracy (19th century capitalist oligarchs), socialists believed themselves to be the "enlightened" "democratic" victors. "Enlightened" is a dogwhistle for atheist. Today's socialists are indeed reactionaries, cause they too believe themselves "enlightened", and dismiss the horrors and lessons that "enlightened" socialism brought us in the 20th century. RobS^{Give Peace a chance} 01:24, January 7, 2023 (EST)

The Zeitgeist of our times is horrifying: Nazis are considered heroes. Any writer in these times needs to proceed with extreme caution. RobS^{Give Peace a chance} 01:29, January 7, 2023 (EST)

[EC] [EC] The core means of defining "reactionary" is simply vague and only corresponds to "reaction against the contemporary system in seeking return to the status quo ante," and thus it's hilarious to see leftists arbitrary applying it solely to whatever fringe element they seek to associate "right-wing" with while pretending like it never applies to them. You know, psst, since something like protesting the overturning of Roe v. Wade, in the hope of returning to legalized abortion on the national level, wouldn't fit that definition or anything, right? Right? —LT ^{(Mark 8:36)} Saturday, 01:31, January 7, 2023 (EST)

How can anyone criticize Ukrainian nationalists? Their leader, Zelensky, literally has Jewish heritage, so there's no way he could be helping Nazis! He's actually opposed to Nazism, so opposed, in fact, that he and his compatriots are probably working hard to fulfill the legacy of the guy who killed Hitler! Er, wait a sec... —LT ^{(Mark 8:36)} Saturday, 01:34, January 7, 2023 (EST)

So opposed the bodyguards for him and his family are Nazis (he is in effect a hostage; as soon as he stops being able to bring home the bacon for the Nazis, he's out). RobS^{Give Peace a chance} 01:40, January 7, 2023 (EST)

Let's look momentarily at the Western globalist propaganda lie that Putin is trying to resurrect or recreate the Soviet Union, Or that Russia is some kind of communist bastion. From the Russian perspective, Marxism came from the West, and it took Christian Russia 70 years to throw off the "enlightened" Western communist yoke (in academia, you'll find the fact that Marx wrote his treatises for revolution in industrial Germany, and not revolution in agricultural Russia. That's why Lenin and the early Russian revolutionaries had such a hard time in Russia - there were no factories for workers to "seize the means of production". Furthermore, there were no organized industrial trade unions for workers to organize and rise up. All this ideology, and its modern derivatives like gay marriage, came from the West. The Russians are well familiar with Western efforts to remake society. Even the CCP rejects Western hegemony and substitutes it with Socialism with Chinese characteristics.) RobS^{Give Peace a chance} 01:53, January 7, 2023 (EST)