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Exodus 1-7 (Translated)

2009-12-03T19:16:18Z

Danielitld: /* Chapter 7 */

==Chapter 1==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| Now these are the names of the children of Israel, which came into Egypt; every man and his household came with Jacob.
|These are the names of the children of Israel who went into Egypt, every man and his household who came with Jacob.
|"Household" referring to both the family, the servants, the livestock, etc.
|-
|2
| Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah,
|Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah,
|
|-
|3
| Issachar, Zebulun, and Benjamin,
|Issachar, Zebulun, Benjamin,
|
|-
|4
| Dan, and Naphtali, Gad, and Asher.
|Dan, Naphtali, Gad, and Asher.
|
|-
|5
| And all the souls that came out of the loins of Jacob were seventy souls for Joseph was in Egypt already.
|In all, this was seventy souls which had descended from Jacob, for Joseph was already in Egypt.
|
|-
|6
| And Joseph died, and all his brethren, and all that generation.
|And in time Joseph died along with his brethren, and all of the generation.
|
|-
|7
| And the children of Israel were fruitful, and increased abundantly, and multiplied, and waxed exceeding mighty; and the land was filled with them.
|The children of Israel were fertile, and their numbers increased greatly as they multiplied, and they grew mighty, and the land became filled with them.
|
|-
|8
| Now there arose up a new king over Egypt, which knew not Joseph.
|There arose a new king in Egypt, who did not know of Joseph.
|
|-
|9
| And he said unto his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are more and mightier than we
|And saying to his people, "Behold, the descendants of Israel are more in number, and stronger than we are.
|
|-
|10
| Come on, let us deal wisely with them; lest they multiply, and it come to pass, that, when there falleth out any war, they join also unto our enemies, and fight against us, and so get them up out of the land.
|Let us deal wisely against them, lest they multiply more, and join our enemies in war and fight against us. Thus we must get them out of our land."
|
|-
|11
| Therefore they did set over them taskmasters to afflict them with their burdens. And they built for Pharaoh treasure cities, Pithom and Raamses.
|Therefore, they set taskmasters over the Israelites to make them do work. And they were made to build for Pharaoh the treasure cities of Pithom and Ramses.
|
|-
|12
| But the more they afflicted them, the more they multiplied and grew. And they were grieved because of the children of Israel.
|But the more the Egyptians persecuted the Israelites, the more they multiplied and grow. And the Egyptians were grieved because of the children of Israel.
|
|-
|13
| And the Egyptians made the children of Israel to serve with rigour
|The Egyptians made the children of Israel server harder labor,
|
|-
|14
| And they made their lives bitter with hard bondage, in morter, and in brick, and in all manner of service in the field all their service, wherein they made them serve, was with rigour.
|and they made their lives bitter with hard bondage, laying mortar and bricks, in the fields, and in all other kinds of service, they were made to labor.
|
|-
|15
| And the king of Egypt spake to the Hebrew midwives, of which the name of the one was Shiphrah, and the name of the other Puah
|The king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, whose names were Shiprah and Puah,
|
|-
|16
| And he said, When ye do the office of a midwife to the Hebrew women, and see them upon the stools; if it be a son, then ye shall kill him but if it be a daughter, then she shall live.
|saying to them, "When you perform your duties as a midwife to the Hebrew women, and see on the stools: if it is a son, kill him, but if it is a daughter, let her live."
|Hebrew women gave birth on stools at the time.
|-
|17
| But the midwives feared God, and did not as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the men children alive.
|But the midwives feared God, and so did not do as the king of Egypt had commanded, but saved the male children alive.
|
|-
|18
| And the king of Egypt called for the midwives, and said unto them, Why have ye done this thing, and have saved the men children alive?
|The king of Egypt called for the midwives, and said to them, "Why have you done this, saving the male children alive?"
|
|-
|19
| And the midwives said unto Pharaoh, Because the Hebrew women are not as the Egyptian women; for they are lively, and are delivered ere the midwives come in unto them.
|And the midwives said to Pharaoh, "Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women, for they are lively, and deliver the infant before the midwives come in to them."
|
|-
|20
| Therefore God dealt well with the midwives: and the people multiplied, and waxed very mighty.
|Therefore, God dealt will with the midwives, and the people multiplied, and grew very strong.
|
|-
|21
| And it came to pass, because the midwives feared God, that he made them houses.
|It came to pass that, because the midwives feared God, he made them houses.
|
|-
|22
| And Pharaoh charged all his people, saying, Every son that is born ye shall cast into the river, and every daughter ye shall save alive.
|And so Pharaoh instructed all his people, saying, "Every son that is born to you, you shall cast into the river, and every daughter, you shall keep alive.
|
|}

==Chapter 2==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| And there went a man of the house of Levi, and took to wife a daughter of Levi.
|There was a man of the house of Levi, who took as his wife a woman of the house of Levi.
|
|-
|2
| And the woman conceived, and bare a son: and when she saw him that he was a goodly child, she hid him three months.
|The woman conceived, and bore a son: and when she saw that he was a good child, she hid him for three months.
|
|-
|3
| And when she could not longer hide him, she took for him an ark of bulrushes, and daubed it with slime and with pitch, and put the child therein; and she laid it in the flags by the river's brink.
|When she could no longer hide him, she made for him a basket of bulrushes, and covered it with slime and pitch, and put the child within; and she laid it in the reeds by the river's bank.
|
|-
|4
| And his sister stood afar off, to wit what would be done to him.
|The child's sister stood far off, to witness what would be done to him.
|
|-
|5
| And the daughter of Pharaoh came down to wash herself at the river; and her maidens walked along by the river's side; and when she saw the ark among the flags, she sent her maid to fetch it.
|The daughter of Pharaoh came down to wash herself in the river, and her maidens walked along by the river's side; and when she saw the basket among the reeds, she sent her maid to fetch it.
|
|-
|6
| And when she had opened it, she saw the child and, behold, the babe wept. And she had compassion on him, and said, This is one of the Hebrews' children.
|When she opened it, she saw the child, and the babe wept. She had compassion for him, saying, "This is one of the Hebrews' children."
|
|-
|7
| Then said his sister to Pharaoh's daughter, Shall I go and call to thee a nurse of the Hebrew women, that she may nurse the child for thee?
|Then the sister of the baby said to the Pharaoh's daughter, "Shall I go and call to you a nurse of the Hebrew women, so that she may nurse the child for you?"
|
|-
|8
| And Pharaoh's daughter said to her, Go. And the maid went and called the child's mother.
|Pharaoh's daughter said to her, "Go." And the maid went and called the child's mother.
|
|-
|9
| And Pharaoh's daughter said unto her, Take this child away, and nurse it for me, and I will give thee thy wages. And the woman took the child, and nursed it.
|Pharaoh's daughter said to her, "Take this child away, and nurse it for me, and I will pay you wages." So the woman took the child, and nursed it.
|
|-
|10
| And the child grew, and she brought him unto Pharaoh's daughter, and he became her son. And she called his name Moses and she said, Because I drew him out of the water.
|The child grew, and she brought him to the Pharaoh's daughter, and she adopted him as her son. And she named him Moses, because she drew him out of the water.
|
|-
|11
| And it came to pass in those days, when Moses was grown, that he went out unto his brethren, and looked on their burdens and he spied an Egyptian smiting an Hebrew, one of his brethren.
|It came to pass that when Moses was grown, he went out among his people, and looked on their burdens, and witnessed an Egyptian hitting a Hebrew, his kinsmen.
|
|-
|12
| And he looked this way and that way, and when he saw that there was no man, he slew the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand.
|And he looked around, and seeing there was no witness, he killed the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand.
|
|-
|13
| And when he went out the second day, behold, two men of the Hebrews strove together and he said to him that did the wrong, Wherefore smitest thou thy fellow?
|When he went out the next day, he saw two Hebrew men fighting, and he said to the man who started it, "Why have you struck your fellow Hebrew?"
|
|-
|14
| And he said, Who made thee a prince and a judge over us? intendest thou to kill me, as thou killedst the Egyptian? And Moses feared, and said, Surely this thing is known.
|And he said, "Who made you a prince and judge over us? Do you intend to kill me, as you killed the Egyptian?" And Moses was afraid, thinking, "My deed is surely known."
|
|-
|15
| Now when Pharaoh heard this thing, he sought to slay Moses. But Moses fled from the face of Pharaoh, and dwelt in the land of Midian: and he sat down by a well.
|When the Pharaoh heard this thing, he wished to slay Moses. But Moses fled from Pharaoh, and went to live in the land of Midian, and sat by a well.
|
|-
|16
| Now the priest of Midian had seven daughters and they came and drew water, and filled the troughs to water their father's flock.
|The priest of Midian has seven daughters and they came to the well to draw water and fill the troughs of their father's flock.
|In 3:1, identified as Jethro.
|-
|17
| And the shepherds came and drove them away but Moses stood up and helped them, and watered their flock.
|Shepherds came to drive them away, but Moses stood and helped them, and watered their flock.
|
|-
|18
| And when they came to Reuel their father, he said, How is it that ye are come so soon to day?
|When the returned to Reuel, their father, he said, "How come you are home so early today?"
|
|-
|19
| And they said, An Egyptian delivered us out of the hand of the shepherds, and also drew water enough for us, and watered the flock.
|And they said, "An Egyptian saved us from the shepherds, and drew enough water for us, and watered the flock."
|
|-
|20
| And he said unto his daughters, And where is he? why is it that ye have left the man? call him, that he may eat bread.
|He said to his daughters, "Where is he? Why have you left the man? Call him, that we may feed him bread."
|
|-
|21
| And Moses was content to dwell with the man: and he gave Moses Zipporah his daughter.
|And Moses was content to dwell with the mean, who gave to Moses his daughter Zipporah as a wife.
|
|-
|22
| And she bare him a son, and he called his name Gershom: for he said, I have been a stranger in a strange land.
|She bore him a son, named Gershom, for he said, "I have been a stranger in a strange land."
|
|-
|23
| And it came to pass in process of time, that the king of Egypt died and the children of Israel sighed by reason of the bondage, and they cried, and their cry came up unto God by reason of the bondage.
|It came to pass in time that the king of Egypt died, and the children of Israel sighed under their bondage, and they cried, and their cry reached God.
|
|-
|24
| And God heard their groaning, and God remembered his covenant with Abraham, with Isaac, and with Jacob.
|And God heard their groaning, and God remembered his covenant with Abraham, with Isaac, and with Jacob.
|
|-
|25
| And God looked upon the children of Israel, and God had respect unto them.
|And God looked upon the children of Israel, and God has respect for them.
|
|}

==Chapter 3==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| Now Moses kept the flock of Jethro his father in law, the priest of Midian and he led the flock to the backside of the desert, and came to the mountain of God, even to Horeb.
|Moses tended the flock of his father-in-law, Jethro, the priest of Midian, and he led the flock to the far end of the desert, coming to Horeb and the mountain of God.
|
|-
|2
| And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
|The angel of the Lord appeared to him in a burning bush, and as he looked, the bush was not burnt by the fire.
|
|-
|3
| And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
|Moses thought, "I must turn to this bush, and examine it, to learn why the bush is not burnt."
|
|-
|4
| And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.
|And when the Lord saw that he was coming, God called to him from the bush, and said, "Moses, Moses." And he said, "Here I am."
|
|-
|5
| And He said, Draw not nigh hither put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.
|He said, "Do not come closer before you have taken off your shoes, for the place you are now standing is holy ground."
|
|-
|6
| Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.
|He said, "I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob." Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.
|
|-
|7
| And the LORD said, I have surely seen the affliction of my people which are in Egypt, and have heard their cry by reason of their taskmasters; for I know their sorrows;
|The Lord said, "I have seen the suffering of my people in Egypt, and have heard their cries under their taskmasters, and know their sorrows.
|
|-
|8
| And I am come down to deliver them out of the hand of the Egyptians, and to bring them up out of that land unto a good land and a large, unto a land flowing with milk and honey; unto the place of the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites.
|I have come down to rescue them out of the hand of the Egyptians, and to lead them out of that land to a better one, a land flowing with milk and honey, the place of the Canaanites, Hittites, Amorites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites.
|
|-
|9
| Now therefore, behold, the cry of the children of Israel is come unto me and I have also seen the oppression wherewith the Egyptians oppress them.
|I have heard the cry of the children of Israel and I have seen the cruelty with which the Egyptians treat them.
|
|-
|10
| Come now therefore, and I will send thee unto Pharaoh, that thou mayest bring forth my people the children of Israel out of Egypt.
|Come now, and I will send you to Pharaoh, so that you may rescue my people the children of Israel out of Egypt."
|
|-
|11
| And Moses said unto God, Who am I, that I should go unto Pharaoh, and that I should bring forth the children of Israel out of Egypt?
|Moses said to God, "Who am I, that I should go to Pharaoh and rescue the children of Israel out of Egypt?"
|
|-
|12
| And he said, Certainly I will be with thee; and this shall be a token unto thee, that I have sent thee When thou hast brought forth the people out of Egypt, ye shall serve God upon this mountain.
|And He said, "I will be with you, and this shall be a sign to you, that when you have rescued the people out of Egypt, you shall serve God upon this mountain."
|
|-
|13
| And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
|Moses said to God, "Behold, when I get to the children of Israel, and say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you,' and they'll say to me, 'What is his name?' what shall I tell them?"
|
|-
|14
| And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
|And God said to Moses, "I AM THAT I AM," and he said, "You shall tell them, "I AM has sent me to you."
|See [[Tetragrammaton]]
|-
|15
| And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
|And God said to Moses, "You shall tell the children of Israel, 'The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, has sent me to you' - this is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations.
|
|-
|16
| Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say unto them, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, appeared unto me, saying, I have surely visited you, and seen that which is done to you in Egypt
|Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say to them, 'The Lord God of your ancestors, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, appeared to me, saying 'I have visited you, and seen what is done to you in Egypt.'
|
|-
|17
| And I have said, I will bring you up out of the affliction of Egypt unto the land of the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, unto a land flowing with milk and honey.
|And has said, 'I will bring you out of the affliction of Egypt to the land of the Canaanites, Hitties, Amorites, Parizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites, to a land flowing with milk and honey.'
|
|-
|18
| And they shall hearken to thy voice: and thou shalt come, thou and the elders of Israel, unto the king of Egypt, and ye shall say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath met with us and now let us go, we beseech thee, three days' journey into the wilderness, that we may sacrifice to the LORD our God.
|They shall listen to you, and you bring the elders of Israel to the king of Egypt, and you will say to him, 'The Lord God of the Hebrews has met with us and we request you let us go three days' journey into the wilderness to make sacrifice to the Lord our God.'
|
|-
|19
| And I am sure that the king of Egypt will not let you go, no, not by a mighty hand.
|And I am sure that the king of Egypt will not let you go, not by a long shot.
|
|-
|20
| And I will stretch out my hand, and smite Egypt with all my wonders which I will do in the midst thereof and after that he will let you go.
|I will reach out and strike Egypt with all my powers, and after that he will let you go.
|
|-
|21
| And I will give this people favour in the sight of the Egyptians and it shall come to pass, that, when ye go, ye shall not go empty:
|I will make the Egyptians like my people and when you go, you will not go empty-handed:
|
|-
|22
| But every woman shall borrow of her neighbour, and of her that sojourneth in her house, jewels of silver, and jewels of gold, and raiment and ye shall put them upon your sons, and upon your daughters; and ye shall spoil the Egyptians.
|Every woman shall borrow from her neighbor, and of those in her house, silver and gold jewelry, and clothing, and you shall put them on your sons and daughters and so take the spoils of Egypt."
|
|}

==Chapter 4==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| And Moses answered and said, But, behold, they will not believe me, nor hearken unto my voice for they will say, The LORD hath not appeared unto thee.
|Moses answered, and said, "They will not believe me, nor will they even listen to me, for they will say, 'The Lord has not appeared to you.'"
|
|-
|2
| And the LORD said unto him, What is that in thine hand? And he said, A rod.
|The Lord said to him, "What is that in your hand?" And he said, "A staff."
|
|-
|3
| And he said, Cast it on the ground. And he cast it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses fled from before it.
|So He said, "Throw that on the ground." So he threw it on the ground, and it turned into a snake, and Moses ran from it.
|
|-
|4
| And the LORD said unto Moses, Put forth thine hand, and take it by the tail. And he put forth his hand, and caught it, and it became a rod in his hand
|But the Lord said to Moses, "Grab it with your hand, by its tail." So he grabbed it with his hand and it became a staff as he held it.
|
|-
|5
| That they may believe that the LORD God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath appeared unto thee.
|"This will make them believe that the Lord God of their ancestors, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, has appeared to you."
|
|-
|6
| And the LORD said furthermore unto him, Put now thine hand into thy bosom. And he put his hand into his bosom and when he took it out, behold, his hand was leprous as snow.
|And the Lord said more to him, saying, "Put your hand into your shirt." And he put his hand into his shirt, and when he took it out, his hand was dead and white like snow.
|
|-
|7
| And he said, Put thine hand into thy bosom again. And he put his hand into his bosom again; and plucked it out of his bosom, and, behold, it was turned again as his other flesh.
|He said, "Put your hand into your shirt again." And he put his hand into his shirt again, and brought it out, and it had returned to living flesh.
|
|-
|8
| And it shall come to pass, if they will not believe thee, neither hearken to the voice of the first sign, that they will believe the voice of the latter sign.
|"If they do not believe you, and are not convinced by the first sign, they will be convinced by the second.
|
|-
|9
| And it shall come to pass, if they will not believe also these two signs, neither hearken unto thy voice, that thou shalt take of the water of the river, and pour it upon the dry land: and the water which thou takest out of the river shall become blood upon the dry land.
|If they do not believe either of these signs, then you shall take water from the river, and pour it upon dry land, and the water you take out of the river shall become blood on the land."
|
|-
|10
| And Moses said unto the LORD, O my Lord, I am not eloquent, neither heretofore, nor since thou hast spoken unto thy servant: but I am slow of speech, and of a slow tongue.
|Moses said to the Lord, "My Lord, I am not eloquent, either before now, or even now that you have spoken to me, and I speak slowly, with a slow tongue."
|
|-
|11
| And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the LORD?
|The Lord said to him, "Who made men's mouths? Who makes the dumb, the deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? Was it not I, the Lord?
|
|-
|12
| Now therefore go, and I will be with thy mouth, and teach thee what thou shalt say.
|Now go, and I will be with you, and guide your mouth, and teach you what you to say."
|
|-
|13
| And he said, O my Lord, send, I pray thee, by the hand of him whom thou wilt send.
|And he said, "My Lord, I implore you, send your message by another."
|
|-
|14
| And the anger of the LORD was kindled against Moses, and he said, Is not Aaron the Levite thy brother? I know that he can speak well. And also, behold, he cometh forth to meet thee and when he seeth thee, he will be glad in his heart.
|And the Lord grew angry at Moses, saying, "The Levite Aaron is your brother, I know that he can speak well. He will come forth to meet you and you see him, he will rejoice.
|
|-
|15
| And thou shalt speak unto him, and put words in his mouth and I will be with thy mouth, and with his mouth, and will teach you what ye shall do.
|You will speak to him, and tell him what to say, and I will be with both of you as you speak, and will teach you what to do.
|
|-
|16
| And he shall be thy spokesman unto the people and he shall be, even he shall be to thee instead of a mouth, and thou shalt be to him instead of God.
|He will be your spokesman to the people, almost as your mouth, and you pass to him My words.
|
|-
|17
| And thou shalt take this rod in thine hand, wherewith thou shalt do signs.
|Take this staff in your hands, with which you shall do miracles."
|
|-
|18
| And Moses went and returned to Jethro his father in law, and said unto him, Let me go, I pray thee, and return unto my brethren which are in Egypt, and see whether they be yet alive. And Jethro said to Moses, Go in peace.
|So Moses returned to his father in law Jethro, and said to him, "I implore you to let me leave, and return to my people in Egypt, and see if they are still alive." And Jethro said to Moses, "Go in peace."
|
|-
|19
| And the LORD said unto Moses in Midian, Go, return into Egypt for all the men are dead which sought thy life.
|The Lord said to Moses in Midian, "Go, return to Egypt, for all the men who wished to kill you have died."
|
|-
|20
| And Moses took his wife and his sons, and set them upon an ass, and he returned to the land of Egypt and Moses took the rod of God in his hand.
|So Moses took his wife and his sons, and rode with them on a donkey to Egypt, with the staff of God in his hand.
|
|-
|21
| And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.
|The Lord said to Moses, "When you go to return into Egypt, see that you do the miracles before Pharaoh, with the staff I have put in your hand. I will harden his heart, and he will not let the people go.
|
|-
|22
| And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn
|You will say to Pharaoh, "The Lord says, 'Israel is my son, as my firstborn.
|
|-
|23
| And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn.
|I say to you, 'Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if your refuse to let him go, I will kill your son, including your firstborn.'
|
|-
|24
| And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.
|
|
|-
|25
| Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to me.
|
|
|-
|26
| So he let him go then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision.
|
|
|-
|27
| And the LORD said to Aaron, Go into the wilderness to meet Moses. And he went, and met him in the mount of God, and kissed him.
|
|
|-
|28
| And Moses told Aaron all the words of the LORD who had sent him, and all the signs which he had commanded him.
|
|
|-
|29
| And Moses and Aaron went and gathered together all the elders of the children of Israel|
|
|
|-
|30
| And Aaron spake all the words which the LORD had spoken unto Moses, and did the signs in the sight of the people.
|
|
|-
|31
| And the people believed and when they heard that the LORD had visited the children of Israel, and that he had looked upon their affliction, then they bowed their heads and worshipped.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 5==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| And afterward Moses and Aaron went in, and told Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Let my people go, that they may hold a feast unto me in the wilderness.
|After this, Moses and Aaron wen to Pharaoh and said, "The Lord God of Israel has said, 'Let my people go, that they may hold a feast for me in the wilderness?'"
|
|-
|2
| And Pharaoh said, Who is the LORD, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go? I know not the LORD, neither will I let Israel go.
|The Pharaoh said, "Who is the Lord, that I should obey him and let Israel go? I do not know the Lord, nor will I let Israel go."
|
|-
|3
| And they said, The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go, we pray thee, three days' journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword.
|And they said, "The God of the Hebrews has met with us: let us go, we beg you, three days' journey into the desert, and make sacrifices to the Lord our God, lest he fall upon us with disease or war."
|
|-
|4
| And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens.
|But the king of Egypt said, "Moses and Aaron, why have you allowed your people to stop working? Get to your work!"
|
|-
|5
| And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many, and ye make them rest from their burdens.
|The Pharaoh said, "There are many Hebrews, and you are letting them rest."
|
|-
|6
| And Pharaoh commanded the same day the taskmasters of the people, and their officers, saying,
|So that same day, the Pharaoh commanded the taskmasters of the Hebrews,
|
|-
|7
| Ye shall no more give the people straw to make brick, as heretofore let them go and gather straw for themselves.
|"Don't give them any more straw to make bricks with. Let them get it themselves!
|
|-
|8
| And the tale of the bricks, which they did make heretofore, ye shall lay upon them; ye shall not diminish ought thereof for they be idle; therefore they cry, saying, Let us go and sacrifice to our God.
|But they still have to make as many bricks as they used to. If they have a moment's rest, they'll use it to beg, 'Let us go and sacrifice to our God.'
|
|-
|9
| Let there more work be laid upon the men, that they may labour therein; and let them not regard vain words.
|So make them work more, and keep them busy, so they won't think of such things."
|
|-
|10
| And the taskmasters of the people went out, and their officers, and they spake to the people, saying, Thus saith Pharaoh, I will not give you straw.
|And so the taskmasters went out, and told the people, "The Pharaoh has told us not to give you any more straw.
|
|-
|11
| Go ye, get you straw where ye can find it yet not ought of your work shall be diminished.
|So go, get the straw yourself, we don't care from where, but don't make any less bricks than you used to."
|
|-
|12
| So the people were scattered abroad throughout all the land of Egypt to gather stubble instead of straw.
|So the people went all around Egypt to gather stuff to use as straw.
|
|-
|13
| And the taskmasters hasted them, saying, Fulfill your works, your daily tasks, as when there was straw.
|And their taskmasters commanded them, saying, "Do your work every day, just like you used to when there was straw."
|
|-
|14
| And the officers of the children of Israel, which Pharaoh's taskmasters had set over them, were beaten, and demanded, Wherefore have ye not fulfilled your task in making brick both yesterday and to day, as heretofore?
|The leaders of the Hebrews, which Pharaoh's taskmasters had appointed, were beaten, and asked, "Why haven't you fulfilled your quotas in making bricks today and yesterday, like you have before?"
|
|-
|15
| Then the officers of the children of Israel came and cried unto Pharaoh, saying, Wherefore dealest thou thus with thy servants?
|Then the leaders of the children of Israel asked of Pharaoh, saying, "Why do you treat your servants in this way?
|
|-
|16
| There is no straw given unto thy servants, and they say to us, Make brick and, behold, thy servants are beaten; but the fault is in thine own people.
|You give no straw to us, your slaves, and tell us, 'Make bricks,' but then beat us - but the fault lies with your people, not ours!"
|
|-
|17
| But he said, Ye are idle, ye are idle therefore ye say, Let us go and do sacrifice to the LORD.
|But he said, "You are lazy, which is why you ask for leave, saying, 'Let us go and do sacrifice to the Lord.'
|
|-
|18
| Go therefore now, and work; for there shall no straw be given you, yet shall ye deliver the tale of bricks.
|So get to work - we won't give you any straw, but you shall meet your required number of bricks."
|
|-
|19
| And the officers of the children of Israel did see that they were in evil case, after it was said, Ye shall not minish ought from your bricks of your daily task.
|And the leaders of the Hebrews saw that they were in dire circumstances, once it was said, "You cannot make any fewer bricks than you did before."
|
|-
|20
| And they met Moses and Aaron, who stood in the way, as they came forth from Pharaoh
|They met with Moses and Aaron as they left Pharaoh, for they were waiting outside.
|
|-
|21
| And they said unto them, The LORD look upon you, and judge; because ye have made our savour to be abhorred in the eyes of Pharaoh, and in the eyes of his servants, to put a sword in their hand to slay us.
|They said to them, "The Lord will judge you, because you have us smelly to Pharaoh and made him give swords to his lieutenants to kill us with."
|
|-
|22
| And Moses returned unto the LORD, and said, Lord, wherefore hast thou so evil entreated this people? why is it that thou hast sent me?
|So Moses went back to the Lord and said, "Lord, why have you treated your people so poorly? Why have you sent me?
|
|-
|23
| For since I came to Pharaoh to speak in thy name, he hath done evil to this people; neither hast thou delivered thy people at all.
|Ever since I've come here to Pharaoh, to speak for you, he has just done cruel things to these people, and hasn't let us go."
|
|}

==Chapter 6==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| Then the LORD said unto Moses, Now shalt thou see what I will do to Pharaoh for with a strong hand shall he let them go, and with a strong hand shall he drive them out of his land.
|The Lord replied to Moses, "Now you will see what I'll do to Pharaoh, because it takes harsh dealings with him for him to let you go, and he shall drive you out of his land harshly."
|
|-
|2
| And God spake unto Moses, and said unto him, I am the LORD
|And God said to Moses, "I am the Lord,
|
|-
|3
| And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.
|who appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. They knew me as God Almighty, but you may call me Jehovah.
|
|-
|4
| And I have also established my covenant with them, to give them the land of Canaan, the land of their pilgrimage, wherein they were strangers.
|I promised to give them the land of Canaan, where they were once strangers.
|
|-
|5
| And I have also heard the groaning of the children of Israel, whom the Egyptians keep in bondage; and I have remembered my covenant.
|I have heard the groaning of the children of Israel, who the Egyptians keep as slaves, and I have remembered my promise.
|
|-
|6
| Wherefore say unto the children of Israel, I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, and I will rid you out of their bondage, and I will redeem you with a stretched out arm, and with great judgments
|That is why I say to the children of Israel, 'I am the Lord, and I will rescue you from the Egyptians, and I will free you from slavery, and I will redeem you with great judgments.
|
|-
|7
| And I will take you to me for a people, and I will be to you a God and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God, which bringeth you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.
|And I will take you as my people, and you will worship me as a God, and you will know that I am the Lord your God, who rescued you from slavery under the Egyptians.
|
|-
|8
| And I will bring you in unto the land, concerning the which I did swear to give it to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob; and I will give it you for an heritage I am the LORD.
|And I will bring you to the land I promised to your ancestors Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and I will give it to you for all time, for I am the Lord.'"
|
|-
|9
| And Moses spake so unto the children of Israel but they hearkened not unto Moses for anguish of spirit, and for cruel bondage.
|So Moses told these things to the children of Israel, but because they were weary from work and of poor spirits, they didn't listen.
|
|-
|10
| And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
|The Lord spoke to Moses and said,
|
|-
|11
| Go in, speak unto Pharaoh king of Egypt, that he let the children of Israel go out of his land.
|"Go speak to Pharaoh and tell him to let the children of Israel go."
|
|-
|12
| And Moses spake before the LORD, saying, Behold, the children of Israel have not hearkened unto me; how then shall Pharaoh hear me, who am of uncircumcised lips?
|Moses replied, "The children of Israel haven't listened to me, what makes you think Pharaoh will, since I'm not circumcised?"
|The issue is that since Moses was raised Egyptian, he is not circumcised, so Pharaoh will not consider him to be Hebrew and thus will not consider his words concerning Hebrew freedom to have much merit.
|-
|13
| And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, and gave them a charge unto the children of Israel, and unto Pharaoh king of Egypt, to bring the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt.
|The Lord gave Moses and Aaron leadership over the children of Israel, and the responsibility of freeing them from Egypt and Pharaoh.
|
|-
|14
| These be the heads of their fathers' houses The sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel; Hanoch, and Pallu, Hezron, and Carmi: these be the families of Reuben.
|There were the heads of their fathers' houses. Reuben, the first child of Jacob, had Hanoch, Pallu, Hezron, and Carmi.
|
|-
|15
| And the sons of Simeon; Jemuel, and Jamin, and Ohad, and Jachin, and Zohar, and Shaul the son of a Canaanitish woman these are the families of Simeon.
|The sons of Simeon were Jemuel, Jamin, Ohad, Jachin, Zohar, and Shaul (who was conceived by a Canaanite woman).
|
|-
|16
| And these are the names of the sons of Levi according to their generations; Gershon, and Kohath, and Merari: and the years of the life of Levi were an hundred thirty and seven years.
|The sons of Levi where Gershon, Kohath, and Merari, and Levi lived 137 years.
|
|-
|17
| The sons of Gershon; Libni, and Shimi, according to their families.
|Gershon's sons were Libni and Shimi.
|
|-
|18
| And the sons of Kohath; Amram, and Izhar, and Hebron, and Uzziel and the years of the life of Kohath were an hundred thirty and three years.
|And the sons of Kohath were Amram, Izhar, Hebron, and Uzziel, and Kohath lived 133 years.
|
|-
|19
| And the sons of Merari; Mahali and Mushi these are the families of Levi according to their generations.
|Merari's sons were Mahali and Mushi.
|
|-
|20
| And Amram took him Jochebed his father's sister to wife; and she bare him Aaron and Moses and the years of the life of Amram were an hundred and thirty and seven years.
|Amram married his aunt (father's side) Jochebed, and her children were Aaron and Moses, and Amram lived 137 years.
|
|-
|21
| And the sons of Izhar; Korah, and Nepheg, and Zichri.
|Izhar's sons were Korah, Nepheg, and Zichri.
|
|-
|22
| And the sons of Uzziel; Mishael, and Elzaphan, and Zithri.
|Uzziel's sons were Mishael, Elzaphan, and Zithri.
|
|-
|23
| And Aaron took him Elisheba, daughter of Amminadab, sister of Naashon, to wife; and she bare him Nadab, and Abihu, Eleazar, and Ithamar.
|Aaron married Elisheba, who was the daughter of Amminadab and sister of Naashon as his wife, and their children were Nadab, Abihu Eleazar, and Ithamar.
|
|-
|24
| And the sons of Korah; Assir, and Elkanah, and Abiasaph these are the families of the Korhites.
|Korah's sons were Assir, Elkanah, and Abiasaph.
|
|-
|25
| And Eleazar Aaron's son took him one of the daughters of Putiel to wife; and she bare him Phinehas these are the heads of the fathers of the Levites according to their families.
|Eleazar, the son of Aaron, married a daughter of Putiel, and their children were Phinehas.
|
|-
|26
| These are that Aaron and Moses, to whom the LORD said, Bring out the children of Israel from the land of Egypt according to their armies.
|These are the families which the Lord commanded Aaron and Moses to rescue from Egypt.
|
|-
|27
| These are they which spake to Pharaoh king of Egypt, to bring out the children of Israel from Egypt these are that Moses and Aaron.
|
|
|-
|28
| And it came to pass on the day when the LORD spake unto Moses in the land of Egypt,
|On the day when the Lord spoke to Moses in Egypt,
|
|-
|29
| That the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, I am the LORD speak thou unto Pharaoh king of Egypt all that I say unto thee.
|He said, "I am the Lord; you must repeat to Pharaoh all that I tell you."
|
|-
|30
| And Moses said before the LORD, Behold, I am of uncircumcised lips, and how shall Pharaoh hearken unto me?
|And Moses said before the Lord, "I am uncircumcised, so why would Pharaoh listen to me?"
|See Exodus 6:12
|}

==Chapter 7==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
| And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
|The Lord said to Moses, "See, I render you a "god" to Pharaoh, and Aaron shall be your "prophet."
|
|-
|2
| Thou shalt speak all that I command thee and Aaron thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the children of Israel out of his land.
|You shall tell him all I command you, and Aaron, your brother, will speak to Pharaoh, that he should free the Hebrews.
|
|-
|3
| And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt.
|I will not give Pharaoh empathy, and I will make many miracles in the land of Egypt.
|
|-
|4
| But Pharaoh shall not hearken unto you, that I may lay my hand upon Egypt, and bring forth mine armies, and my people the children of Israel, out of the land of Egypt by great judgments.
|Pharaoh will not listen to you, and so I will come down upon Egypt and bring forth my powers, and lead my people, the children of Israel, out of Egypt.
|
|-
|5
| And the Egyptians shall know that I am the LORD, when I stretch forth mine hand upon Egypt, and bring out the children of Israel from among them.
|The Egyptians will know that I am the Lord, when I use my powers against Egypt and bring forth the children of Israel from there.
|
|-
|6
| And Moses and Aaron did as the LORD commanded them, so did they.
|Moses and Aaron did as the Lord commanded.
|
|-
|7
| And Moses was fourscore years old, and Aaron fourscore and three years old, when they spake unto Pharaoh.
|Moses was 80 years old, and Aaron 83, when they spoke to Pharaoh.
|
|-
|8
| And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying,
|The Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying,
|
|-
|9
| When Pharaoh shall speak unto you, saying, Shew a miracle for you: then thou shalt say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and cast it before Pharaoh, and it shall become a serpent.
|"Pharaoh will ask you to show him a miracle; then you will say to Aaron, 'Take your staff, and drop it before Pharaoh,' and it shall become a snake."
|
|-
|10
| And Moses and Aaron went in unto Pharaoh, and they did so as the LORD had commanded and Aaron cast down his rod before Pharaoh, and before his servants, and it became a serpent.
|Moses and Aaron went in to see Pharaoh, and did as the Lord had told them to, and Aaron dropped his staff on the floor, and it became a snake.
|
|-
|11
| Then Pharaoh also called the wise men and the sorcerers now the magicians of Egypt, they also did in like manner with their enchantments.
|But Pharaoh called the wizards and sorcerers and magicians of Egypt, and they performed the same feat with their enchantments:
|
|-
|12
| For they cast down every man his rod, and they became serpents but Aaron's rod swallowed up their rods.
|every man dropped his staff to the floor, and all became snakes - but Aaron's staff swallowed theirs.
|
|-
|13
| And he hardened Pharaoh's heart, that he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said.
|The Lord did not allow feeling into Pharaoh's heart, and so he did not listen to them, as the Lord had said.
|
|-
|14
| And the LORD said unto Moses, Pharaoh's heart is hardened, he refuseth to let the people go.
|The Lord said to Moses, "Pharaoh has no feeling in his heart, and refuses to let the people go.
|
|-
|15
| Get thee unto Pharaoh in the morning; lo, he goeth out unto the water; and thou shalt stand by the river's brink against he come; and the rod which was turned to a serpent shalt thou take in thine hand.
|Go to Pharaoh in the morning, when he goes to draw water. Bring your staff (the one that got turned into a snake) and stand by the river bank.
|
|-
|16
| And thou shalt say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath sent me unto thee, saying, Let my people go, that they may serve me in the wilderness: and, behold, hitherto thou wouldest not hear.
|Say to him, "The Lord God of the Hebrews has sent me to you, saying, 'Let my people go, so they can worship me in the wilderness,' and you still haven't listened.
|
|-
|17
| Thus saith the LORD, In this thou shalt know that I am the LORD behold, I will smite with the rod that is in mine hand upon the waters which are in the river, and they shall be turned to blood.
|So the Lord has said to you through me, "You shall now know that I am the Lord," now watch, I will strike the staff to the river and it will turn into blood.
|
|-
|18
| And the fish that is in the river shall die, and the river shall stink; and the Egyptians shall lothe to drink of the water of the river.
|All the fish will die, and the river will stink, and the Egyptians will not be able to drink the river water."
|
|-
|19
| And the LORD spake unto Moses, Say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and stretch out thine hand upon the waters of Egypt, upon their streams, upon their rivers, and upon their ponds, and upon all their pools of water, that they may become blood; and that there may be blood throughout all the land of Egypt, both in vessels of wood, and in vessels of stone.
|
|
|-
|20
| And Moses and Aaron did so, as the LORD commanded; and he lifted up the rod, and smote the waters that were in the river, in the sight of Pharaoh, and in the sight of his servants; and all the waters that were in the river were turned to blood.
|Moses and Aaron did as the Lord has told them, striking the water with the staff as Pharaoh and his lieutenants looked on, and all the water in the river turned into blood,
|
|-
|21
| And the fish that was in the river died; and the river stank, and the Egyptians could not drink of the water of the river; and there was blood throughout all the land of Egypt.
|and all the fish died, and the river stank, and the Egyptians could not drink the water, and there was blood all throughout Egypt.
|
|-
|22
| And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments and Pharaoh's heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said.
|But since the magicians of Egypt could do the same thing with their enchantments, Pharaoh was not impressed, and did not listen to Moses and Aaron, just as the Lord had said.
|
|-
|23
| And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also.
|Pharaoh turned and went into his house,
|
|-
|24
| And all the Egyptians digged round about the river for water to drink; for they could not drink of the water of the river.
|and all the Egyptians had to dig wells for water to drink, since they couldn't drink the river water.
|
|-
|25
| And seven days were fulfilled, after that the LORD had smitten the river.
|Seven days passed.
|
|}

[[Exodus 8-14 (Translated)]]

[[Category:Conservative Bible]]

Talk:Essay:Quantifying Order

2009-11-23T22:20:56Z

Danielitld: /* Science and the Bible */

"Subsequently, however, more accurate measurements with more sophisticated technology have determined this precession to be 55 arc-seconds per century, nearly 30% off the number provided by relativity."

Please provide a citation in the article for this. I'm shocked that I somehow missed the news. Thanks much. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 17:48, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:I'm urging you to look beyond what you're taught. I went through the same physics curriculum as others, and it is what isn't taught that matters. Earnestly.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 17:53, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::Okay. Let's find a way of making that point without quoting an incorrect value for the Mercury anomaly then? Cause putting in a number that's not actually supported by observations just to make a philosophical point seems kind of … I dunno. Deceptive? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 17:58, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, if I can call you that, I have no reason to lie about this. I'm not applying for any grants. I'm not trying to get a PhD from liberal professors. I'm not worried about what my colleagues might say. Like the Bible, I'm just telling the truth, and trying to learn more of it.

:::The physics journals all seem to require payment for access. But type this into a Google search: 5599.7 Mercury. You'll then see what the liberal physics professors won't tell you, as Google returns fragments from limited-access journals. Then, please, pause for a moment and ask yourself: why didn't they tell you this so you could decide for yourself, rather than being told what to think?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:40, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::::Oh, okay. I see where you made an honest mistake.

::::There are two numbers at play here: there's the ''observed'' precession of Mercury's orbit, and then there's the ''anomaly.'' The anomaly is the amount by which the observed precession differs from the mathematically predicted precession. What you did was quote a figure for the ''anomaly'' using the figure for the ''observed'' precession. Hang on, lemme splain.

::::The precession of an orbit is the sum of several effects. Newton's approximation for gravity predicted three different effects: axial precession of 5,025 arc seconds per century, 530 additional arc seconds per century from the gravitational effects of the other planets, and a tiny amount, less than one arc second per century, due to the fact that the sun isn't a perfect sphere. (Those numbers are all rounded off; the precise figures are trivially googlable.)

::::If you add up the precession predicted by Newton's approximation, you get exactly 5,557.02 arc seconds per century.

::::But if you run the numbers using the Einstein equations instead of the Newton equations — using the same constants for things like the mass and shape of the sun — you get a precession of exactly 5,600±0.04 arc seconds per century. It's really weird that it would be a round number like that, but that's how the math works out.

::::The observed precession of Mercury's orbit? It's 5,599.7 arc seconds per century. Which is where you got your number from. And that means the general relativity prediction was accurate to within (deep breath) one half of one one hundredth of one percent.

::::That's like shooting an arrow from Los Angeles and hitting the bullseye in Melbourne.

::::Would you be a dear and remove the incorrect anomaly figure from your essay now? I know it's a work in progress and I hate nitpickers, but somebody could stumble across that and be misinformed.--[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 19:11, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Your point is an excellent one. Thank you. The 30% figure was wrong for the reasons you provide.

:::::But the underlying point in this entry remains correct: due to advances in precision in measurement, the prediction of relativity no longer matches the data on the precession. The discrepancy is much greater than the margin of error, which is all that matters from a logical perspective. The entry has been updated accordingly, and I welcome further comments you may have.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 19:44, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(Unindent) I'm not sure you're going to welcome these comments, sir. Because you're just flat-out, provably, unequivocally wrong on this one. The observed value of the precession of Mercury hasn't been changed in a hundred years, because it's a direct observation. We measured it with telescopes, and those were just fine at that scale a century ago.

I'm afraid your edit made the offending section paragraph ''even more misleading than it was.'' Predicted value of the precession (via Newton) in 1915: 5,557. Observed value in 1915? 5,600. Difference? 43. Predicted value from the Einstein equations? 5,600. Observed value today? Still 5,600. Difference? Ridiculously small. I ''know'' you're actively working on this essay, and I feel ''really'' bad about beating you up over this, but you wouldn't have the paragraph in there unless you thought it had value.

Just so you know, I've got some feedback on your paragraph on quantum mechanics as well. For starters, the position and momentum of a particle is exactly as uncertain after an observation as it is before, because reducing uncertainty of the position increases uncertainty of the momentum and vice versa. They're intrinsically linked. Maybe that's not your point; measuring a particle does, I suppose, bring about a sort of philosophical order that was previously absent — we know where the particle is now — but at the cost of reducing our knowledge about another aspect of the particle's motion. But your essay isn't fleshed out enough for me to really see yet what you're getting at, so that might be irrelevant to your point. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 20:00, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:Kate, I don't have an ax to grind about this. General Relativity was developed to explain the Mercury precession, so the theory certainly should fit the data. I expected that it would. But the fit isn't there anymore, due to more precise measurements. It's beyond the margin of error, and logically that's all that matters. You're using rounding above that obscures what the margin of error is. Professor Will does not even include this test in his recent summary of all the evidence for GR, and we can now see why. Those are the facts, and logic applied to the facts. Anyone has free will to accept or deny it. I accept the facts and logic as they require.

:You make an interesting point about position, but I don't think the essay is incorrect because it says nothing about momentum. Observation can pin down the position, which is relevant to establishing order. But without observation there is disorder. That is the basic point.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:11, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::Right, but there's an error of fact buried in there. It's a totally innocent one, I'm sure; I'm not accusing you of axe-grinding. It's just that the precession of the perihelion of Mercury ''has not changed'' since 1916 when the theory was published. It's not that we measured it with telescopes before 1916 and got a rough estimate, and now we measure it with better telescopes and have a much more precise figure. We measured it before 1916 and got a very accurate figure because measuring the motion of Mercury just isn't that hard, and the measurements we make today with better telescopes say only that yup, the older measurements were pretty much spot on.

::What we ''have'' done since then is to much more precisely measure the oblateness of the sun. There was a big controversy about that back in the … hmm … 80s I think it was? Goldberg and Dicke claimed that the sun was much "fatter" than previously thought, which ''would have'' made the predictions from general relativity different from the observed precession. Maybe that's what you're thinking of? For a while there was a lot of disagreement about what shape the sun actually is, but that's been pretty much put to bed with both more accurate ground-based observations in the 90s and helioseismography.

::Anyway, saying that the prediction matched the observation in 1916 and doesn't today is simply flat-out false. If your argument depends on it, then you're hurting your argument with this point. If it doesn't, then what's the harm in fixing it?

::Thanks for clarifying your point about quantum mechanics. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 20:35, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, as I said, I don't care either way, but I am going to tell the truth. GR fit the observed data in 1916 (indeed, GR was developed to fit it), but now (due to more sophisticated measurements) the GR prediction is wrong ''by more than the margin of error''. None of your comments above address the margin of error, which must be the scientific focus. A difference between theory and observation is not "ridiculously small" if it is more than the margin of error, as in this case.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:47, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::: Perhaps this is what Mr. Schlafly is referring to. The article states that 5599.7 arc-seconds is the observed value. KSorenson is quoting a value of 5,600 (±0.04). 5600-.04=5599.96. From just those values then yes the relativity value is higher by .26 arc-seconds even factoring in the error. The only thing I ask is what is the error range for the observed value? [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 21:08, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Presumably the error range for the observed value is no more than .1. Again, note that Professor Will conspicuously omits this famous claim of evidence for GR from his recent comprehensive summary of the evidence for GR, as cited in this entry.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:12, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent again because I'm lazy with bullets) We can do a heck of a lot better than "presumably," Andy, and as a person who cares deeply about facts and logic, you darned well know that. I happen to have the Pijpers paper from 94 here; I dug it out when I thought you might have been thinking of helioseismography. In it he cites radar ranging studies from 1976 to 1992. Here's the data, ''with margins of error.'' Note that these numbers are for ''the anomaly,'' and not the precession total, and remember that the figure from the Einstein equation is 42.98 ± 0.04, okay?

*43.11 ± 0.21 (Shapiro 76)
*42.92 ± 0.20 (Anderson 87)
*42.94 ± 0.20 (Anderson 91)
*43.13 ± 0.14 (Anderson 92)

So the Einstein prediction is within the margin of error of those four radar-ranging measurements of the Mercury anomaly. I'm sure there've been more recent studies, but I don't have them literally sitting in front of my face at the moment, so those are the ones I'm citing. Can I see your numbers that say the Einstein prediction is outside the margin? More recent data than what I have in my hand here maybe? (This Pijpers paper is [http://arxiv.org/pdf/astro-ph/9804258v1 on ARXIV], by the way, if you want to check it out.)--[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 21:17, 14 November 2009 (EST)

Oh, and just incidentally? Will didn't leave Mercury out of his paper; he just talked about it in really jargony physics-paper language.

:Three decades of experiments, ranging from the standard light-deﬂection and perihelion-shift tests to lunar laser ranging, planetary and satellite tracking, and geophysical and astronomical observations, have placed bounds on the PPN parameters consistent with general relativity.

"PPN" is the ''parameterized post''-''Newton'' formalism, a rewriting of the law of universal gravitation to include coefficients derived from general relativity. The Einstein field equations are nightmarish to solve, so PPN was created as a middle-ground approximation between the (good but not good enough in some contexts) Newton approximation and the agonizing pain of having to actually ''solve'' the Einstein field equations every time you want to calculate the delta-vee required during a solar slingshot maneuver for a planetary probe. What Will said in that paper is the PPN approximation has been tested ''against general relativity'' and supported by 30 years of experiments.

This is really getting into the tall grass, and I know how you hate wasting time. Maybe we can bring this conversation to a conclusion? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 21:38, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:Kate, I have an open mind about this but, quite honestly, the relativists protest too much. Why do you care so much about defending relativity? Not to pick on you, however, because many trained in math and physics likewise defend relativity like they are defending their own reputation. It's bizarre. Regardless of the reason, protesting too much is not scientific.

:Answering the substance of your post, your most recent data is from 1992 (17 years ago, with the data probably older than that), and its margin of error confirms what I said: it's approaching 0.1. Combine that 0.1 (or 0.14 if you like) with the most recent data and it's clear that GR no longer fits the data. Of course, no one is going to dare publish a paper claiming GR is disproved by the data, and even if they tried, no journal would accept it. So the trail goes cold at this point, just as the data diverge from the GR predictions and the margin of error declines to where it can't save GR.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:37, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::"Why do you care so much about defending relativity?" 'Cause teaching physics is something I do for a living. 'Cause I think it's really neat. 'Cause seeing somebody totally misunderstand it, and then go on to draw incorrect conclusions based on his misunderstanding of it, and finally to pass those incorrect conclusions on to impressionable kids who trust him … well, that just breaks my heart. You can call it protesting too much if you want, Andy. But I wish you could understand that it's really just me trying to help.

::I wouldn't have fought you on this at all if you'd said something like "A dozen eggs contains fifteen eggs, plus or minus two." That's just ''obviously'' wrong, and nobody who reads it would fall for it. But you're hiding your false conclusion behind a wall of data that you know most people won't bother looking up for themselves, and that's just dishonest. That's unworthy of anybody who'd call himself a teacher, and what's more I think you know that in your heart. You seem like a conscientious guy; what does your conscience say to you about this?

::Anyway, it's your essay, you can obviously write what you want. But let me just give you a heads up: Next week, when I put your [[theory of relativity]] page on the table for major surgery? I don't think you're gonna like it. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:24, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, you didn't address the substance of my comment about the evidence, but don't worry about it. The bottom line is clear: no physics major, no physics grad student, and no physics teacher should dare criticize relativity, no matter what the data say. The political grip on this issue is intense. In fact, to be honest, I would advise against your criticizing it in any way. It could harm your (or any other teacher's or physicist's) career. There are examples of people who were denied tenure simply because they criticized evolution, and the politics here is just as strong.

:::I look forward to learning from your entry on the theory of relativity. The math is fascinating regardless of its manifestation in reality.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:33, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent) "Kate, you didn't address the substance of my comment about the evidence, but don't worry about it." What was there to address? You made an arithmetic error. Do you want me to send you the Mathematica scatterplot I made just to triple-check that I was interpreting the data correctly? It's pretty. The error bars are blue.

Andy, I wish I could get you to come to my department for a week. Just one week, any week. Our students, grad students, associates, profs, chair, heck, even the ''janitor'' criticizes relativity every day. I could get you a meeting with one of our theoretical cosmologist; he's been pulling his ''hair'' out for years trying to make some progress on the vacuum energy problem. For a while there he was coming into my office a couple times a week and saying … well, unprintable things about partial differential equations. Even we theoretical physicists think general relativity is a mathematical mess.

But we respect it anyway. Because it ''works,'' at least as far as anybody's been able to measure.

Can I ask you a question? What's your beef with relativity? I mean, I know you question the data, but … why? Are you just being iconoclastic? I don't mean that in a dismissive way; I totally understand and respect the impulse to say "Everybody agrees that this is true, so I'm going to question it!" I'd really just like to understand your point of view on this, whatever it may be. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:44, 14 November 2009 (EST)

: GR's predictions are off by more than the margin of error, as we discussed in detail above; it and special relativity have absurd discontinuities; there are logical flaws, as in relativistic mass; it conflicts with QM; and it predicts gravitons that have never been found despite wasting hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars on it. Relativity pulls people away from reading the Bible and relativity is pushed big-time by liberals. It chills progress by intimidating people against criticizing it. Other than that, the theory is pretty good!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:05, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::Wow, Mr. Schlafly must really like this conversation, he actually made a joke. ;) jk [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 00:15, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::Thanks very much for taking the time to reply; I understand better now. Of course, some of that is unmitigated garbage, and we'll have plenty of chances to deal with it when I fix your [[theory of relativity]] article next week, so I'll skip some points for now.

:::*''You'' discussed the fact that the predictions are outside the margin of error; ''I'' pointed out to you repeatedly that you were mistaken. I even offered to show you a plot. So come on.

:::*To be frank, relativity doesn't ''conflict'' with quantum mechanics; the two theories don't overlap in any domains we can presently observe. But that's the problem. They don't overlap, so we don't know how we're going to understand systems where both gravity and quantum mechanics have non-negligible effects. It's entirely possible that every such region of spacetime is sequestered behind an event horizon; that's jokingly called the "convenient cosmic censorship hypothesis" by one of my colleagues.

:::*General relativity doesn't predict gravitons at all. General relativity doesn't say anything about particles; the Standard Model predicts the existence of particles (like the Higgs). Gravitons are part of the various attempts to reformulate general relativity as a vector gauge theory, none of which have gotten there yet. And, uh, since none of the gauge theories have gotten there yet, Andy, ''not one dollar'' has been spent looking for gravitons. Because we don't know where to look. But we ''do'' know that if they could be detected by existing particle accelerators, they would've been. So if and when physicists decide to look for them, it's going to have to start with building an accelerator the size of our galaxy<ref>WARNING: exaggeration for humorous effect, do not take literally.</ref>, and you'll have your chance to lobby the appropriations committee then.

:::*Yes, studying relativity does take people away from time they could spend in religious activities. So does reading this site. Just give me a chance to copy-and-paste my contributions out before you shut it down to remove the temptation.

:::Anyway, like I said, we'll have plenty of time to have these arguments when I start work on [[theory of relativity]]. All I ask is that you ''engage in constructive collaboration'' with me and whomever else chooses to help out, rather than pouncing on the "undo" button like you did when I rewrote [[black hole]]. We've both demonstrated that we're reasonable adults, I think; we can work together. Deal? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 00:22, 15 November 2009 (EST)

{{reflist}}

::::I've been quietly following this conversation today, but Kate beat me to the "Submit" button! Well, I'll just point out that scientists can and frequently do "intimidat[e] people against criticizing" pretty much any theory, because they think it's right and they don't want to waste time. It's quite likely close-mindedness, but it exists, and you can't take that as disproof of the theory. I don't think someone who rejected Mendel or Maxwell would get pretty far today, either. (Yes, I know Mendel has been amended with epigenetic inheritance, but I think you get my picture). It's just a bothersome red herring.

::::I don't know anything about the Mercury data, but the most recent data I've seen here says general relativity might work; it's at the border of the range of error, and it's too precise for any of us to extrapolate. General relativity could be spot on. Or, a new theory being needed - if you're trying to construct a [[theory of everything]], a new theory definitely is needed to deal with [[quantum mechanics]]! But, general relativity does predict a lot of things better than Newton. Newton didn't explain everything, nor does general relativity - but I think you can find better stuff to attack it with than an extrapolation of Mercury orbital data. --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 00:37, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Ugh, I really should be sleeping, but this is just such an engaging conversation I can't seem to break away.

:::::If you make a measurement to test a theory and the measurement doesn't match the prediction, there are three possibilities. Either the measurement is wrong ("That's not Mercury, that's Saturn!") or the theory is wrong ("Turns out gravity ''isn't'' really caused by leprechauns!") or both are fundamentally right but you failed to take something into account ("We really shouldn't have assumed the sun is a sphere.")

:::::The thing about the Mercury anomaly is that the observed and predicted numbers are ''insanely'' close together. So close as to be declared equal within the margin of error. So either general relativity is ''absolutely'' right and we accounted for ''everything'' — no physicist believes this, by the way — or general relativity is at least ''incredibly close'' to being right, so close that the factors we failed to account for are negligible at the scale of the Mercury anomaly.

:::::But the thing is, Mercury is really thin sauce, as gravity goes. The fields are weak, and the prediction we're testing doesn't say anything terribly interesting about the theory. If you want to get a real feel for how general relativity holds up as a ''physical'' theory, and not just a mathematical one, you really need to look at the Gravity Probe B data. (Conflict of interest alert: I worked on that project.) That experiment didn't measure gravitation indirectly by observing the motion of a particle; it measured it ''directly'' by parallel transporting a vector in a closed loop around a region of curvature. We ''empirically'' measured the curvature of spacetime around a gravitating object (the Earth) and found it to be non-zero. Spacetime is ''not'' flat, massive bodies ''do'' curve spacetime, and the fundamental ''idea'' of general relativity reflects nature.

:::::General relativity doesn't just say that a falling body moves like such-n-such. It tells us ''why.'' And to see it dismissed out of hand because Andy doesn't care for the size of the error bars on the results of a radar study? That, I confess, rubs me the wrong way. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 00:51, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::Great point about experimental error. Before I ''really do'' sign off for the night, Kate, I'd like to give you an article suggestion: [[Gravity_Probe_B]]. I'm enthusiastically looking forward to hearing how it was done! --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 01:00, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::Oh, I'm not the girl to write that one. It'd be 200 pages long and full of equations and whole paragraphs of me going "You guys this is so ''awesome!"'' --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 01:09, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::On the contrary. You are exactly the right girl to write this. But not yet. Do GR first, OK? And you'll have to take off your instructor hat, and put on your explainer-for-lay-people hat, so that it won't be 200 pages long. Whenever you reach the point where you think "You guys this is so ''awesome''", don't go into "and so I have to write the awesome equations". Go into "how can I convey the awesomeness to my reader?". [[User:PatrickD|PatrickD]] 11:32, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::I don't want to perpetuate this debate, but I don't want a lack of response to be misinterpreted. Relativity has quasi-religious status for many; they'll defend regardless of what the evidence is, regardless of its absurd inconsistencies, and regardless of its far-fetched assumptions and non-falsifiability. I don't mind relativity, and look forward to reviewing the updated entry. But open-mindedness is not a trait of many relativists, who will demonize anyone who points out its fairly obvious flaws.

:::::::One way to evaluate religions, or quasi-religions, is to look at the fruit it bears. What has it helped achieved? In the case of relativity, it has produced nothing. Nil. Zippo. After nearly 100 years and a ton of money. If you find the math in relativity fun, great, but relativity is not going to help anyone. It never has. Pick up a Bible in between some equations.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:31, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::::''"Relativity has quasi-religious status for many…regardless of its far-fetched assumptions and non-falsifiability."'' As has already been shown repeatedly by those knowledgeable and qualified in the subject such as KSorenson the theory of general relativity is eminently falsifiable. For instance the two gravity probes (GP-A and GP-B) were launched specifically to measure rate change of a clock in lower gravity and space-time curvature near the Earth respectively, both experiments specifically testing the theory of relativity. As both experiments were to test the theory of relativity this means that the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be considered falsifiable. This is as patently obvious as stating that 2+2=4. If the theory of relativity is not falsifiable then no experiment can exist to test it. The existence of Gravity Probes A & B automatically that the previous statement cannot be true. So, the undeniable existence of Gravity Probes A & B now proving the falsifiability of the theory of general relativity this means that by Karl Popper's rigorous standard the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be a science. This is immediately obvious to anyone who has made an in depth study of Popper's work, the kind of study that all students of the pure sciences undergo, although strangely enough those students of those subjects which use an applied form of science never seem to be taught such things to the levels required. Presumably this is because the standard of science they are taught is considerably less rigorous or in-depth than the standards expected of and required of students of the pure sciences.

::::::::As the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be considered a science then this in turn means the first part of your statement: ''"Relativity has a quasi-religious status"'' is itself false. Science is not religion. Religion requires hope, hope that what one believes is true. Science requires absolute cynicism, it requires one to say "this is my idea, help me prove it wrong". To this date tests on the theory of general relativity has failed to show that it is wrong, and where measurements have been made to confirm or deny the accuracy of the general theory of relativity such results have shown that the predictions made by the theory of relativity are accurate to the observed effects well within the scientifically determined margins of error.

::::::::The statement that ''"relativity is not going to help anyone"'' is, of course, as wrong as you can get. The theory of relativity opened up a massive area of study, and there are no known limits to what may be achieved through such studies. It is not hyperbole to state that the creation of the theory of relativity is as important, if not more important, than the discovery of the safe generation and transference of electricity. This is known and accepted by everybody who has an in depth knowledge of the subject, knowledge gained through years of learning and self-teaching that begins after one leaves university, after one has gained the bedrock of knowledge required to begin teaching oneself the true depths of a subject.

::::::::I beg of you this one thing. Open up your Bible and truly study the price one pays for Arrogance and Pride. Learn the lesson that the true Student and Teacher must come to the subjects they study in a state of Humility. Of all the posts on the subject of general relativity each and every person that has made an in depth study of the subject have stated that the views you hold on general relativity are wrong. The only person who states that your views are correct are yourself. Look inside yourself and ask if your stubborn resistance to accept what others learned in the subject have to say on this matter is arrogance, pride or humility.(by DanHutchin)

:::::::::Dan, I accept your challenge. I'll work on translating the Bible tonight and tomorrow with "a state of Humility." Thank you for suggesting it. In the meantime, could you specify how the theory of relativity has helped anyone? Electricity powers hospitals that save lives, and increase productivity and wealth which help the poor throughout the world. You say relativity "is as important, if not more important." Specific examples, please?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:52, 15 November 2009 (EST)

: Sorry for butting in here but I love science, I am a science major currently. In my mind God gave us the scientific method and the tools to explore his creation for his glory. We can debate the merits of relativity all day but the fact remains that if it is true it is part of God's creation and because of that, automatically gives it value. Plus, pure science in a lot of cases leads to applied science. I don't like arguments based on what we don't know. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 22:00, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:: Ameda, that's fine, but surely you'd agree that unproductive theories or beliefs should not squeeze out productive ones. Someone can use rhetoric to defend any belief or activity, from watching television to drinking beer. One can spend hours explaining to an addict why he should, for example, stop smoking. All the explaining in the world is not as powerful as this: ''nothing good comes of it''. Relativity has had nearly 100 years to help somebody, anybody. How many more centuries should we give it priority over alternative, productive work?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:14, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::GPS, fiber optics, solar panels and PET scans don't count?

:::I'm amusingly reminded of what Benjamin Franklin said when asked what good was the then-freshly-invented hot-air balloon. "What good is a newborn baby?" That was 1783; powered flight didn't happen until 1903. If you don't see ''enough'' benefits from relativity yet, I'd say you need to embrace patience. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 22:20, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::: And by "squeeze out" I assume you mean in funding? I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, I think it is worth it because it is an integral part of God's creation. Plus, I don't think that just because relativity is given grant money that necessarily means that it is taking it from money that would have gone to say genetically engineering bigger crops. There isn't a one-one correspondence.

::::I agree with a lot on here but honestly Andy, with all respect, I think DanHutchin is right. We all suffer from pride and from all I have read on here, from your brother Roger to Kate above, you are suffering from it big time on this issue. Think, is it really a coincidence that the first part of the Conservative Bible Project I translated was talking about humbling oneself and I did it just this very night? Sorry for the long response but know that it comes from the heart. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 22:29, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::: Amen, Ameda. I appreciate your advice for me to read the Bible more, and with a humbler heart. I'd also like your advice about this. If empirically the promotion of relativity leads people ''away'' from the Bible, would you still support the promotion of relativity? A direct answer from your heart, please.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:43, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::: From the heart, and '''hopefully''' my understanding of the Word, anything can lead people away from the Lord, even if "based" on the Word of God. What I mean by that is people can use and abuse anything, even the Bible to support xyz. ''You know how many times I see Peter Popoff ripping off my brothers and sisters in Christ for some "Miracle spring water"?''

::::::If relativity is part of the fabric of the universe, and I do think that, then it was created by God just as much as the Bible, the stars, etc. and as I said can be used and abused. The only way science can lead one away from the Lord is if there isn't the secondary component to it, the spiritual one, the one stating that this was created by a being that created you and loves you. That is the only thing that needs to be addressed not relativity itself. Basically it seems like you are arguing that God's creation can lead people away from him? I don't think that is scriptural nor correct. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 23:04, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::No, that's not what I'm saying, and I humbly requested a ''direct'' answer. People who are taught and then believe relativity are less likely to read the Bible again, or as frequently. If true (as we've seen on this site and in colleges), do you still support the promotion of relativity?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:18, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::I don't think that is what you're saying, but Ameda has a point: if relativity is true, then God made it, so we can't dismiss it. If it isn't true, and if it does lead people away from the Bible, then we shouldn't be talking about it - but we first need to decide whether relativity is true.

:::::::And could I please see those statistics? I believe relativity, and I read the Bible. I think you're mistaking a correlation for causation: we already know colleges try to move students away from the Bible, and they're where most people happen to learn relativity. So, even though relativity has nothing to do with it, it's quite possible that people who study relativity are less likely to read the Bible because they've happened to spend years at liberal schools. (Incidentally, that's a good reason to teach relativity here at Conservapedia!) --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 23:24, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::: Andy, you are trying to trap me into some black/white answer here. I believe that relativity is true and therefore when taught in all aspects will not lead people away from God. You might as well ask me the same thing concerning the Sun. Can it lead people away, sure, '''when''' it is couched in naturalistic philosophy. You are making some wild hypothetical based on nothing but your own encounters with vandals on this site, that is not empirical. I can easily make the same hypothetical concerning Conservapedia itself. I view this site as preaching the word of God but that doesn't mean that just because someone thinks less of Christianity after reading it then that means it is a problem with the site, it could be with the person not wanting to hear the truth.

::::::::PS- People misunderstood me, I wasn't saying Andy was arguing that, it simply reads like it as a consequence of what he is saying considering that relativity is correct and was designed by God. My opinion of course.[[User:Ameda|ameda]] 23:29, 15 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent) Don't let me jump into the middle of y'all's philosophical debate or anything, but there's a point on the table that needs resolving. Andy, your essay (yes, I know, still a work in progress) contains falsehoods. Are you at all interested in correcting them? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:31, 15 November 2009 (EST)

Indeed. The essay contained the claim that the theory of general relativity is non-falsifiable. This is patently wrong. There are well documented experiments that seek, through observation of physical phenomena, to disprove predictions made by the application of the theory of the general relativity. Whether the results of these observations match the predictions made (within scientifically determined margins of error) is completely immaterial. The fact that the experiments contain the potential to show that the theory of relativity is false shows that the theory of relativity meets the most basic test required to be considered falsifiable. It is impossible to deny such a basic and obvious fact and retain any kind of credibility.

''"In the meantime, could you specify how the theory of relativity has helped anyone?"'' As has been stated above, PET scans. Please show how PET scans have never helped anybody. And all those inventions mentioned above are just the tip of the 'berg of how the theory of relativity has helped people.

''"Relativity pulls people away from reading the Bible"'' Please show the empirical evidence you have gathered for this. Please also provide the empirical evidence that shows that the people not reading the Bible '''a)''' have done so because of relativity and '''b)''' were reading the Bible before they became involved with relativity.

''"I'll work on translating the Bible tonight and tomorrow with "a state of Humility.""'' So you refuse to reconsider your belief that relativity is wrong, and refuse to remove the falsehoods contained within the essay. Instead you seek to rewrite sacred texts so that they say only what you want to say. Much in the same way you seek to rewrite what falsifiability means so that it says only what you want it to say. Much as you seek to rewrite the good that the theory of relativity has led to so that it now says only what you want it to say. Much as you seek to rewrite the experiments that test the theory of reliability and also seek to rewrite the results of those experiments so that they say only what you want them to say. I'm sorry. I truly am, for while I can see a pattern there, I cannot see any true humility in any of these actions.--[[User:DanHutchin|DanHutchin]] 11:23, 16 November 2009 (EST)

:Dan, I find your rants to be nonsensical. The theory of relativity no more helped develop PET scans than it helped land a man on the moon.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:38, 21 November 2009 (EST)

== Information theory? ==

In this essay am missing (among some other things which where partly already discussed in the talk page) the connection between physical reality and information theory. Maybe introducing the definition of entropy itself (and not a selected spotlight on the thermodynamic relations) would help to generate some more context.

:Please improve as you think best. Information theory does deal with physical reality, as in communication errors.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:06, 21 November 2009 (EST)

:: Ok I'll try, but it may take time, because i'll have to review some literature - I may hold a phd in physics and deal with effects of disorder in my experiments on a daily basis, but the (theoretical) developments in the last 100 years in that respect were a little steep. I feel that when discussing the topic Hawking deserves to mentioned, as well as the dissipation-fluctuation theorem, the Boltzmann radiation, entanglement, ergodicity, and maybe more (or a well selected set of topics to make it more clear). I'll try to write first a small independent text on how I see the subject (An kind of "reply" essay), which we can compare. I'll announce in this talk page, ok? (And i will not refer to relativity at all, because i find the discussions here about that topic highly uninspiring and counterproductive. Everything what needs to be said has been said already a hundred times.). If we feel that the content can be merged without messing things up, we can do so. --[[User:Stitch75|Stitch75]] 03:10, 21 November 2009 (EST)

::: To be candid, Stitch, if one's mind is completely made up and closed with respect to relativity, then I'm not optimistic about how insightful one can be on other topics. The essence of advancing knowledge is an open mind that is constantly challenging existing theories. That's what we do here, and I hope you can accept that approach.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:33, 21 November 2009 (EST)

:::: As all most physicist in the world, i am expecting what the next LIGO upgrade will bring. If it does not show gravity wave events then the colleagues in the relativity community may have to explain sth to us, since the general claim would be that it should be possible to observe these events then. However I am not an expert on relativity, so this is not my bussiness. And i find it sad that you suppose that somebody doing actual experiments and evaluating the data himself can tell less about modern physics than somebody who has comparatively little personal experience in experimental physics, and negligible one in theoretical physics. I am used to judge people based on what their statements and not on their non-statements. --[[User:Stitch75|Stitch75]] 07:49, 22 November 2009 (EST)

::::: What's "sad" is how relativity misleads so many people and wastes taxpayers' money on experiments that never prove anything. LIGO is yet another million-dollar boondoggle. People who believe in relativity should spend ''their own money'' on their activities, not ours, just as religions do.

::::: Not only does the theory of relativity fail to help anyone, but it affirmatively hurts lots of people by misleading them into a hurtful frame of mind.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:12, 22 November 2009 (EST)

== Science and the Bible ==

The talk page has been filled with quite a lively discussion. While the scientific arguments are interesting, they have been based on the assumption of this article: modern physics will help us understand the Bible. But, does someone really read the two feeding stories in Mark, and conclude that, ergo, order has won out over disorder? I highly doubt it. When Peter attempts to walk on the water in Matthew, is the reader really wondering if gravity or the "disordering" action of wind and wave caused him to fail? I would say - not likely. (A better question might be: Why does Mark not have Peter attempt to walk on the water?) As for John 1:1, the discussion concerning the logos has been equally lively, but the translation of logos as "perfect order" doesn't seem to be the best, especially if it is used to drag modern physics into it. The term logos, by the time of John, had had a long philosophical history, and it is to that history and to Greek philosophy that we should turn in order to understand it, and to put it into its proper context. - Danielitld

:Daniel, I have an open mind about this, and discussions are enlightening. I don't see any reason to place limits or boundaries on the Bible, and the remarkable insights that can be gleaned from it. Newton used daily, and that can hardly be criticized in light of his prodigious scientific output. Shouldn't modern scientific inquiry imitate Newton's productive approach? I think it should.

:Mark was a young boy who wrote about what he witnessed. Young boys are not out on dangerous boats in the middle of the night, so Mark didn't see the walking on water. As to translating "logos", John was trying to communicate the truth there and the Greek was inadequate. I don't think a scientific connotation should be automatically ruled out. Science is, after all, part of truth. But I welcome your views.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 09:50, 23 November 2009 (EST)

The greatness of Isaac Newton is not to be denied. However, that doesn't mean that his ideas can never be superseded, or that we can't disagree with him. According to an essay on Newton by Stephen Snobelen - found via the site isaac-newton.org - Newton believed that the ancient Greeks knew about the inverse-square law of gravitation, but "cloaked [that knowledge] behind the figure of Apollo and his seven-string lyre". Personally, I don't think that is the case. Religiously, Newton seemed to have believed in Arianism, that Jesus wasn't God - a view you probably disagree with. To say that the Bible is not a science book is not "placing limits" on the Bible. Its acknowledging that the Bible is a product of the time(s) when it was written. And its also stating that, characterizing the Bible as a science book mischaracterizes it, and leads to misunderstandings. Reading Mark's stories of the feedings of the multitudes as "order vs disorder" is a woeful misconception of what Mark was trying to say. The one link that JacobB wanted me to check out actually said that Matthew 24:30 somehow is a reference to television!! - which is simply outlandish! Would reading that verse with "television" in mind really improve someone's understanding of it? I'm highly skeptical of that notion, to say the least. Just as I'm skeptical of finding dinosaurs in the Bible, for reasons I've mentioned elsewhere. Realizing that the ancient Hebrews or Greeks didn't know modern science is not to say that they were idiots. The people who wrote the Bible were hardly that. Isn't it enough that they bequeathed to us the idea of monotheism with an ancient logic which, by itself and without the need to inject dinosaurs into it, is still compelling? - Danielitld
:Daniel, we addressed this on the Genesis talk page, and you seem to be bringing up the same nonsense as there. "Its acknowledging that the Bible is a product of the time(s) when it was written." The Bible is '''not''' a cultural product. It is the inspired word of God. The Logic of the bible is not ancient. It is divine. Methinks you've listened to too many liberal apologists. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 13:21, 23 November 2009 (EST)
::The Bible is logic, as Douglas says. Logic yields insights. It did for Newton, for everyone's benefit. Of course Newton wasn't correct about everything he did. But he got enough things right, and the Bible helped. It can help us too ... in all areas of life, including science.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:38, 23 November 2009 (EST)

So, Douglas, am I to take it that you believe that televisions are referred to in Matthew's gospel? And you say that my comments are "nonsense"! But if the Bible is not a cultural product, then how is it that you are supposedly finding the products of the 20th and 21st centuries in it? You want to deny that ancient cultures had any influence in the Bible's writing, yet apparently only our modern day culture can fully understand it. If the Bible is the timeless word of God, then the ancient Hebrew should have been as fully able of comprehending it as an early 21st Century American. It shouldn't require the happenstance of the invention of television to understand what the Bible says.

You might want to talk with Michael Back about this, as well. "As for the logos, John was using a concept the Greeks had . . to help the Greeks better understand who and what Jesus was," he wrote. This definitely sounds like its a "cultural product", especially since Mr Back "highly doubts" that the term logos - and the Greek ideas related to it - is "EXACTLY who Jesus is". (Emphasis in the original.) When asked by the scribe which is the greatest commandment, Jesus responded that the Shema Yisrael is. But then he added: "The second is this: Love your neighbor as yourself." (Mark 12:29-31) These two great commandments are Jewish, from Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Rabbi Hillel, who lived at same time as Jesus, told the man hopping about on one leg that the Torah can be reduced to this: What is hateful to you, don't do to another. So we can see that Jesus' words were part and parcel of the cultural milieu of his time. They, and the gospel they are in, were cultural products. And now these ancient cultural products are part and parcel of our culture. They don't require televisions, dinosaurs or the Second Law of Thermodynamics for further explication. Like the Socratic "Know thyself", they stand on their own, as relevant today as they were 2,000 years ago or more. - Danielitld
:Daniel, as a favor, please in the future try to be concise rather than resorting to rants. I'm not sure why you keep bringing up televisions, but the matter is extremely simple. The Bible is '''God's''' word. It is not, as you claim, a "cultural product." The objections many of those around Jesus were cultural, but his responses transcended culture, and included messages which were entirely new in human history. What I find most disturbing is that you seem to entirely ignore, or even ''deny'' the divine origin of the Bible. How can you possibly claim that it is God's inspired word when you deride it as a "cultural product" and that God was influenced by ancient cultures? Thanks to what we have learned of God's creation in the intervening millenia, we are more than ever able to discover the incredible depth, both logical and, yes, scientific, of God's word. Why are you so set on denying the mere possibility that the Bible mentioned dinosaurs? I've never claimed that it's true, nor would I seek to prove it, but I'm willing to allow for the possibility, and am amazed by the foresight entailed. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 16:46, 23 November 2009 (EST)

First "nonsense", and now "rants". At least Mr Back and I are able to keep this on what he termed a "professional level" in spite of our disagreements. But then I suppose that Mr Back would also be considered a "nonsensical ranter" by you for his comments. If you recall, DouglasA, I once stated that I have no problem with seeing the Bible as the inspired word of God. I just have problems with those like you who make claims about what it says. Maybe you were too incensed to notice, but I did mention that JacobB's link from the baraminology discussion made the claim about televisions and Matthew 24:15. If you feel that my considering that claim to be very dubious somehow denies God's word, then I would say that your conclusion is nonsensical. As for dinosaurs - once again - in my discussion about the tannin in Genesis, I stated that you or anyone else was free to interpret that very loose term as including dinosaurs. However, I don't see the need to do so. Does my interpretation of this one word therefore imply that I deny the inspired word of God? Hardly. I just find your claim and your interpretation extremely doubtful. Frankly, DouglasA, it seems that you are confusing your claims with the word of God. They are obviously not the same. And if you have a disagreement with any of my comments, I would prefer that you use the "professional level" of discourse - where you cite chapter and verse in support of your ideas - since "loving your neighbor as yourself" doesn't seem to be your forte. - Danielitld

Talk:Essay:Quantifying Order

2009-11-23T21:05:38Z

Danielitld: /* Science and the Bible */

"Subsequently, however, more accurate measurements with more sophisticated technology have determined this precession to be 55 arc-seconds per century, nearly 30% off the number provided by relativity."

Please provide a citation in the article for this. I'm shocked that I somehow missed the news. Thanks much. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 17:48, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:I'm urging you to look beyond what you're taught. I went through the same physics curriculum as others, and it is what isn't taught that matters. Earnestly.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 17:53, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::Okay. Let's find a way of making that point without quoting an incorrect value for the Mercury anomaly then? Cause putting in a number that's not actually supported by observations just to make a philosophical point seems kind of … I dunno. Deceptive? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 17:58, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, if I can call you that, I have no reason to lie about this. I'm not applying for any grants. I'm not trying to get a PhD from liberal professors. I'm not worried about what my colleagues might say. Like the Bible, I'm just telling the truth, and trying to learn more of it.

:::The physics journals all seem to require payment for access. But type this into a Google search: 5599.7 Mercury. You'll then see what the liberal physics professors won't tell you, as Google returns fragments from limited-access journals. Then, please, pause for a moment and ask yourself: why didn't they tell you this so you could decide for yourself, rather than being told what to think?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:40, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::::Oh, okay. I see where you made an honest mistake.

::::There are two numbers at play here: there's the ''observed'' precession of Mercury's orbit, and then there's the ''anomaly.'' The anomaly is the amount by which the observed precession differs from the mathematically predicted precession. What you did was quote a figure for the ''anomaly'' using the figure for the ''observed'' precession. Hang on, lemme splain.

::::The precession of an orbit is the sum of several effects. Newton's approximation for gravity predicted three different effects: axial precession of 5,025 arc seconds per century, 530 additional arc seconds per century from the gravitational effects of the other planets, and a tiny amount, less than one arc second per century, due to the fact that the sun isn't a perfect sphere. (Those numbers are all rounded off; the precise figures are trivially googlable.)

::::If you add up the precession predicted by Newton's approximation, you get exactly 5,557.02 arc seconds per century.

::::But if you run the numbers using the Einstein equations instead of the Newton equations — using the same constants for things like the mass and shape of the sun — you get a precession of exactly 5,600±0.04 arc seconds per century. It's really weird that it would be a round number like that, but that's how the math works out.

::::The observed precession of Mercury's orbit? It's 5,599.7 arc seconds per century. Which is where you got your number from. And that means the general relativity prediction was accurate to within (deep breath) one half of one one hundredth of one percent.

::::That's like shooting an arrow from Los Angeles and hitting the bullseye in Melbourne.

::::Would you be a dear and remove the incorrect anomaly figure from your essay now? I know it's a work in progress and I hate nitpickers, but somebody could stumble across that and be misinformed.--[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 19:11, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Your point is an excellent one. Thank you. The 30% figure was wrong for the reasons you provide.

:::::But the underlying point in this entry remains correct: due to advances in precision in measurement, the prediction of relativity no longer matches the data on the precession. The discrepancy is much greater than the margin of error, which is all that matters from a logical perspective. The entry has been updated accordingly, and I welcome further comments you may have.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 19:44, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(Unindent) I'm not sure you're going to welcome these comments, sir. Because you're just flat-out, provably, unequivocally wrong on this one. The observed value of the precession of Mercury hasn't been changed in a hundred years, because it's a direct observation. We measured it with telescopes, and those were just fine at that scale a century ago.

I'm afraid your edit made the offending section paragraph ''even more misleading than it was.'' Predicted value of the precession (via Newton) in 1915: 5,557. Observed value in 1915? 5,600. Difference? 43. Predicted value from the Einstein equations? 5,600. Observed value today? Still 5,600. Difference? Ridiculously small. I ''know'' you're actively working on this essay, and I feel ''really'' bad about beating you up over this, but you wouldn't have the paragraph in there unless you thought it had value.

Just so you know, I've got some feedback on your paragraph on quantum mechanics as well. For starters, the position and momentum of a particle is exactly as uncertain after an observation as it is before, because reducing uncertainty of the position increases uncertainty of the momentum and vice versa. They're intrinsically linked. Maybe that's not your point; measuring a particle does, I suppose, bring about a sort of philosophical order that was previously absent — we know where the particle is now — but at the cost of reducing our knowledge about another aspect of the particle's motion. But your essay isn't fleshed out enough for me to really see yet what you're getting at, so that might be irrelevant to your point. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 20:00, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:Kate, I don't have an ax to grind about this. General Relativity was developed to explain the Mercury precession, so the theory certainly should fit the data. I expected that it would. But the fit isn't there anymore, due to more precise measurements. It's beyond the margin of error, and logically that's all that matters. You're using rounding above that obscures what the margin of error is. Professor Will does not even include this test in his recent summary of all the evidence for GR, and we can now see why. Those are the facts, and logic applied to the facts. Anyone has free will to accept or deny it. I accept the facts and logic as they require.

:You make an interesting point about position, but I don't think the essay is incorrect because it says nothing about momentum. Observation can pin down the position, which is relevant to establishing order. But without observation there is disorder. That is the basic point.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:11, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::Right, but there's an error of fact buried in there. It's a totally innocent one, I'm sure; I'm not accusing you of axe-grinding. It's just that the precession of the perihelion of Mercury ''has not changed'' since 1916 when the theory was published. It's not that we measured it with telescopes before 1916 and got a rough estimate, and now we measure it with better telescopes and have a much more precise figure. We measured it before 1916 and got a very accurate figure because measuring the motion of Mercury just isn't that hard, and the measurements we make today with better telescopes say only that yup, the older measurements were pretty much spot on.

::What we ''have'' done since then is to much more precisely measure the oblateness of the sun. There was a big controversy about that back in the … hmm … 80s I think it was? Goldberg and Dicke claimed that the sun was much "fatter" than previously thought, which ''would have'' made the predictions from general relativity different from the observed precession. Maybe that's what you're thinking of? For a while there was a lot of disagreement about what shape the sun actually is, but that's been pretty much put to bed with both more accurate ground-based observations in the 90s and helioseismography.

::Anyway, saying that the prediction matched the observation in 1916 and doesn't today is simply flat-out false. If your argument depends on it, then you're hurting your argument with this point. If it doesn't, then what's the harm in fixing it?

::Thanks for clarifying your point about quantum mechanics. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 20:35, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, as I said, I don't care either way, but I am going to tell the truth. GR fit the observed data in 1916 (indeed, GR was developed to fit it), but now (due to more sophisticated measurements) the GR prediction is wrong ''by more than the margin of error''. None of your comments above address the margin of error, which must be the scientific focus. A difference between theory and observation is not "ridiculously small" if it is more than the margin of error, as in this case.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:47, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::: Perhaps this is what Mr. Schlafly is referring to. The article states that 5599.7 arc-seconds is the observed value. KSorenson is quoting a value of 5,600 (±0.04). 5600-.04=5599.96. From just those values then yes the relativity value is higher by .26 arc-seconds even factoring in the error. The only thing I ask is what is the error range for the observed value? [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 21:08, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Presumably the error range for the observed value is no more than .1. Again, note that Professor Will conspicuously omits this famous claim of evidence for GR from his recent comprehensive summary of the evidence for GR, as cited in this entry.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:12, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent again because I'm lazy with bullets) We can do a heck of a lot better than "presumably," Andy, and as a person who cares deeply about facts and logic, you darned well know that. I happen to have the Pijpers paper from 94 here; I dug it out when I thought you might have been thinking of helioseismography. In it he cites radar ranging studies from 1976 to 1992. Here's the data, ''with margins of error.'' Note that these numbers are for ''the anomaly,'' and not the precession total, and remember that the figure from the Einstein equation is 42.98 ± 0.04, okay?

*43.11 ± 0.21 (Shapiro 76)
*42.92 ± 0.20 (Anderson 87)
*42.94 ± 0.20 (Anderson 91)
*43.13 ± 0.14 (Anderson 92)

So the Einstein prediction is within the margin of error of those four radar-ranging measurements of the Mercury anomaly. I'm sure there've been more recent studies, but I don't have them literally sitting in front of my face at the moment, so those are the ones I'm citing. Can I see your numbers that say the Einstein prediction is outside the margin? More recent data than what I have in my hand here maybe? (This Pijpers paper is [http://arxiv.org/pdf/astro-ph/9804258v1 on ARXIV], by the way, if you want to check it out.)--[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 21:17, 14 November 2009 (EST)

Oh, and just incidentally? Will didn't leave Mercury out of his paper; he just talked about it in really jargony physics-paper language.

:Three decades of experiments, ranging from the standard light-deﬂection and perihelion-shift tests to lunar laser ranging, planetary and satellite tracking, and geophysical and astronomical observations, have placed bounds on the PPN parameters consistent with general relativity.

"PPN" is the ''parameterized post''-''Newton'' formalism, a rewriting of the law of universal gravitation to include coefficients derived from general relativity. The Einstein field equations are nightmarish to solve, so PPN was created as a middle-ground approximation between the (good but not good enough in some contexts) Newton approximation and the agonizing pain of having to actually ''solve'' the Einstein field equations every time you want to calculate the delta-vee required during a solar slingshot maneuver for a planetary probe. What Will said in that paper is the PPN approximation has been tested ''against general relativity'' and supported by 30 years of experiments.

This is really getting into the tall grass, and I know how you hate wasting time. Maybe we can bring this conversation to a conclusion? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 21:38, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:Kate, I have an open mind about this but, quite honestly, the relativists protest too much. Why do you care so much about defending relativity? Not to pick on you, however, because many trained in math and physics likewise defend relativity like they are defending their own reputation. It's bizarre. Regardless of the reason, protesting too much is not scientific.

:Answering the substance of your post, your most recent data is from 1992 (17 years ago, with the data probably older than that), and its margin of error confirms what I said: it's approaching 0.1. Combine that 0.1 (or 0.14 if you like) with the most recent data and it's clear that GR no longer fits the data. Of course, no one is going to dare publish a paper claiming GR is disproved by the data, and even if they tried, no journal would accept it. So the trail goes cold at this point, just as the data diverge from the GR predictions and the margin of error declines to where it can't save GR.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:37, 14 November 2009 (EST)

::"Why do you care so much about defending relativity?" 'Cause teaching physics is something I do for a living. 'Cause I think it's really neat. 'Cause seeing somebody totally misunderstand it, and then go on to draw incorrect conclusions based on his misunderstanding of it, and finally to pass those incorrect conclusions on to impressionable kids who trust him … well, that just breaks my heart. You can call it protesting too much if you want, Andy. But I wish you could understand that it's really just me trying to help.

::I wouldn't have fought you on this at all if you'd said something like "A dozen eggs contains fifteen eggs, plus or minus two." That's just ''obviously'' wrong, and nobody who reads it would fall for it. But you're hiding your false conclusion behind a wall of data that you know most people won't bother looking up for themselves, and that's just dishonest. That's unworthy of anybody who'd call himself a teacher, and what's more I think you know that in your heart. You seem like a conscientious guy; what does your conscience say to you about this?

::Anyway, it's your essay, you can obviously write what you want. But let me just give you a heads up: Next week, when I put your [[theory of relativity]] page on the table for major surgery? I don't think you're gonna like it. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:24, 14 November 2009 (EST)

:::Kate, you didn't address the substance of my comment about the evidence, but don't worry about it. The bottom line is clear: no physics major, no physics grad student, and no physics teacher should dare criticize relativity, no matter what the data say. The political grip on this issue is intense. In fact, to be honest, I would advise against your criticizing it in any way. It could harm your (or any other teacher's or physicist's) career. There are examples of people who were denied tenure simply because they criticized evolution, and the politics here is just as strong.

:::I look forward to learning from your entry on the theory of relativity. The math is fascinating regardless of its manifestation in reality.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:33, 14 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent) "Kate, you didn't address the substance of my comment about the evidence, but don't worry about it." What was there to address? You made an arithmetic error. Do you want me to send you the Mathematica scatterplot I made just to triple-check that I was interpreting the data correctly? It's pretty. The error bars are blue.

Andy, I wish I could get you to come to my department for a week. Just one week, any week. Our students, grad students, associates, profs, chair, heck, even the ''janitor'' criticizes relativity every day. I could get you a meeting with one of our theoretical cosmologist; he's been pulling his ''hair'' out for years trying to make some progress on the vacuum energy problem. For a while there he was coming into my office a couple times a week and saying … well, unprintable things about partial differential equations. Even we theoretical physicists think general relativity is a mathematical mess.

But we respect it anyway. Because it ''works,'' at least as far as anybody's been able to measure.

Can I ask you a question? What's your beef with relativity? I mean, I know you question the data, but … why? Are you just being iconoclastic? I don't mean that in a dismissive way; I totally understand and respect the impulse to say "Everybody agrees that this is true, so I'm going to question it!" I'd really just like to understand your point of view on this, whatever it may be. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:44, 14 November 2009 (EST)

: GR's predictions are off by more than the margin of error, as we discussed in detail above; it and special relativity have absurd discontinuities; there are logical flaws, as in relativistic mass; it conflicts with QM; and it predicts gravitons that have never been found despite wasting hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars on it. Relativity pulls people away from reading the Bible and relativity is pushed big-time by liberals. It chills progress by intimidating people against criticizing it. Other than that, the theory is pretty good!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:05, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::Wow, Mr. Schlafly must really like this conversation, he actually made a joke. ;) jk [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 00:15, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::Thanks very much for taking the time to reply; I understand better now. Of course, some of that is unmitigated garbage, and we'll have plenty of chances to deal with it when I fix your [[theory of relativity]] article next week, so I'll skip some points for now.

:::*''You'' discussed the fact that the predictions are outside the margin of error; ''I'' pointed out to you repeatedly that you were mistaken. I even offered to show you a plot. So come on.

:::*To be frank, relativity doesn't ''conflict'' with quantum mechanics; the two theories don't overlap in any domains we can presently observe. But that's the problem. They don't overlap, so we don't know how we're going to understand systems where both gravity and quantum mechanics have non-negligible effects. It's entirely possible that every such region of spacetime is sequestered behind an event horizon; that's jokingly called the "convenient cosmic censorship hypothesis" by one of my colleagues.

:::*General relativity doesn't predict gravitons at all. General relativity doesn't say anything about particles; the Standard Model predicts the existence of particles (like the Higgs). Gravitons are part of the various attempts to reformulate general relativity as a vector gauge theory, none of which have gotten there yet. And, uh, since none of the gauge theories have gotten there yet, Andy, ''not one dollar'' has been spent looking for gravitons. Because we don't know where to look. But we ''do'' know that if they could be detected by existing particle accelerators, they would've been. So if and when physicists decide to look for them, it's going to have to start with building an accelerator the size of our galaxy<ref>WARNING: exaggeration for humorous effect, do not take literally.</ref>, and you'll have your chance to lobby the appropriations committee then.

:::*Yes, studying relativity does take people away from time they could spend in religious activities. So does reading this site. Just give me a chance to copy-and-paste my contributions out before you shut it down to remove the temptation.

:::Anyway, like I said, we'll have plenty of time to have these arguments when I start work on [[theory of relativity]]. All I ask is that you ''engage in constructive collaboration'' with me and whomever else chooses to help out, rather than pouncing on the "undo" button like you did when I rewrote [[black hole]]. We've both demonstrated that we're reasonable adults, I think; we can work together. Deal? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 00:22, 15 November 2009 (EST)

{{reflist}}

::::I've been quietly following this conversation today, but Kate beat me to the "Submit" button! Well, I'll just point out that scientists can and frequently do "intimidat[e] people against criticizing" pretty much any theory, because they think it's right and they don't want to waste time. It's quite likely close-mindedness, but it exists, and you can't take that as disproof of the theory. I don't think someone who rejected Mendel or Maxwell would get pretty far today, either. (Yes, I know Mendel has been amended with epigenetic inheritance, but I think you get my picture). It's just a bothersome red herring.

::::I don't know anything about the Mercury data, but the most recent data I've seen here says general relativity might work; it's at the border of the range of error, and it's too precise for any of us to extrapolate. General relativity could be spot on. Or, a new theory being needed - if you're trying to construct a [[theory of everything]], a new theory definitely is needed to deal with [[quantum mechanics]]! But, general relativity does predict a lot of things better than Newton. Newton didn't explain everything, nor does general relativity - but I think you can find better stuff to attack it with than an extrapolation of Mercury orbital data. --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 00:37, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::Ugh, I really should be sleeping, but this is just such an engaging conversation I can't seem to break away.

:::::If you make a measurement to test a theory and the measurement doesn't match the prediction, there are three possibilities. Either the measurement is wrong ("That's not Mercury, that's Saturn!") or the theory is wrong ("Turns out gravity ''isn't'' really caused by leprechauns!") or both are fundamentally right but you failed to take something into account ("We really shouldn't have assumed the sun is a sphere.")

:::::The thing about the Mercury anomaly is that the observed and predicted numbers are ''insanely'' close together. So close as to be declared equal within the margin of error. So either general relativity is ''absolutely'' right and we accounted for ''everything'' — no physicist believes this, by the way — or general relativity is at least ''incredibly close'' to being right, so close that the factors we failed to account for are negligible at the scale of the Mercury anomaly.

:::::But the thing is, Mercury is really thin sauce, as gravity goes. The fields are weak, and the prediction we're testing doesn't say anything terribly interesting about the theory. If you want to get a real feel for how general relativity holds up as a ''physical'' theory, and not just a mathematical one, you really need to look at the Gravity Probe B data. (Conflict of interest alert: I worked on that project.) That experiment didn't measure gravitation indirectly by observing the motion of a particle; it measured it ''directly'' by parallel transporting a vector in a closed loop around a region of curvature. We ''empirically'' measured the curvature of spacetime around a gravitating object (the Earth) and found it to be non-zero. Spacetime is ''not'' flat, massive bodies ''do'' curve spacetime, and the fundamental ''idea'' of general relativity reflects nature.

:::::General relativity doesn't just say that a falling body moves like such-n-such. It tells us ''why.'' And to see it dismissed out of hand because Andy doesn't care for the size of the error bars on the results of a radar study? That, I confess, rubs me the wrong way. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 00:51, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::Great point about experimental error. Before I ''really do'' sign off for the night, Kate, I'd like to give you an article suggestion: [[Gravity_Probe_B]]. I'm enthusiastically looking forward to hearing how it was done! --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 01:00, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::Oh, I'm not the girl to write that one. It'd be 200 pages long and full of equations and whole paragraphs of me going "You guys this is so ''awesome!"'' --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 01:09, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::On the contrary. You are exactly the right girl to write this. But not yet. Do GR first, OK? And you'll have to take off your instructor hat, and put on your explainer-for-lay-people hat, so that it won't be 200 pages long. Whenever you reach the point where you think "You guys this is so ''awesome''", don't go into "and so I have to write the awesome equations". Go into "how can I convey the awesomeness to my reader?". [[User:PatrickD|PatrickD]] 11:32, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::I don't want to perpetuate this debate, but I don't want a lack of response to be misinterpreted. Relativity has quasi-religious status for many; they'll defend regardless of what the evidence is, regardless of its absurd inconsistencies, and regardless of its far-fetched assumptions and non-falsifiability. I don't mind relativity, and look forward to reviewing the updated entry. But open-mindedness is not a trait of many relativists, who will demonize anyone who points out its fairly obvious flaws.

:::::::One way to evaluate religions, or quasi-religions, is to look at the fruit it bears. What has it helped achieved? In the case of relativity, it has produced nothing. Nil. Zippo. After nearly 100 years and a ton of money. If you find the math in relativity fun, great, but relativity is not going to help anyone. It never has. Pick up a Bible in between some equations.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:31, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::::::''"Relativity has quasi-religious status for many…regardless of its far-fetched assumptions and non-falsifiability."'' As has already been shown repeatedly by those knowledgeable and qualified in the subject such as KSorenson the theory of general relativity is eminently falsifiable. For instance the two gravity probes (GP-A and GP-B) were launched specifically to measure rate change of a clock in lower gravity and space-time curvature near the Earth respectively, both experiments specifically testing the theory of relativity. As both experiments were to test the theory of relativity this means that the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be considered falsifiable. This is as patently obvious as stating that 2+2=4. If the theory of relativity is not falsifiable then no experiment can exist to test it. The existence of Gravity Probes A & B automatically that the previous statement cannot be true. So, the undeniable existence of Gravity Probes A & B now proving the falsifiability of the theory of general relativity this means that by Karl Popper's rigorous standard the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be a science. This is immediately obvious to anyone who has made an in depth study of Popper's work, the kind of study that all students of the pure sciences undergo, although strangely enough those students of those subjects which use an applied form of science never seem to be taught such things to the levels required. Presumably this is because the standard of science they are taught is considerably less rigorous or in-depth than the standards expected of and required of students of the pure sciences.

::::::::As the theory of relativity meets the requirements to be considered a science then this in turn means the first part of your statement: ''"Relativity has a quasi-religious status"'' is itself false. Science is not religion. Religion requires hope, hope that what one believes is true. Science requires absolute cynicism, it requires one to say "this is my idea, help me prove it wrong". To this date tests on the theory of general relativity has failed to show that it is wrong, and where measurements have been made to confirm or deny the accuracy of the general theory of relativity such results have shown that the predictions made by the theory of relativity are accurate to the observed effects well within the scientifically determined margins of error.

::::::::The statement that ''"relativity is not going to help anyone"'' is, of course, as wrong as you can get. The theory of relativity opened up a massive area of study, and there are no known limits to what may be achieved through such studies. It is not hyperbole to state that the creation of the theory of relativity is as important, if not more important, than the discovery of the safe generation and transference of electricity. This is known and accepted by everybody who has an in depth knowledge of the subject, knowledge gained through years of learning and self-teaching that begins after one leaves university, after one has gained the bedrock of knowledge required to begin teaching oneself the true depths of a subject.

::::::::I beg of you this one thing. Open up your Bible and truly study the price one pays for Arrogance and Pride. Learn the lesson that the true Student and Teacher must come to the subjects they study in a state of Humility. Of all the posts on the subject of general relativity each and every person that has made an in depth study of the subject have stated that the views you hold on general relativity are wrong. The only person who states that your views are correct are yourself. Look inside yourself and ask if your stubborn resistance to accept what others learned in the subject have to say on this matter is arrogance, pride or humility.(by DanHutchin)

:::::::::Dan, I accept your challenge. I'll work on translating the Bible tonight and tomorrow with "a state of Humility." Thank you for suggesting it. In the meantime, could you specify how the theory of relativity has helped anyone? Electricity powers hospitals that save lives, and increase productivity and wealth which help the poor throughout the world. You say relativity "is as important, if not more important." Specific examples, please?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:52, 15 November 2009 (EST)

: Sorry for butting in here but I love science, I am a science major currently. In my mind God gave us the scientific method and the tools to explore his creation for his glory. We can debate the merits of relativity all day but the fact remains that if it is true it is part of God's creation and because of that, automatically gives it value. Plus, pure science in a lot of cases leads to applied science. I don't like arguments based on what we don't know. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 22:00, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:: Ameda, that's fine, but surely you'd agree that unproductive theories or beliefs should not squeeze out productive ones. Someone can use rhetoric to defend any belief or activity, from watching television to drinking beer. One can spend hours explaining to an addict why he should, for example, stop smoking. All the explaining in the world is not as powerful as this: ''nothing good comes of it''. Relativity has had nearly 100 years to help somebody, anybody. How many more centuries should we give it priority over alternative, productive work?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:14, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::GPS, fiber optics, solar panels and PET scans don't count?

:::I'm amusingly reminded of what Benjamin Franklin said when asked what good was the then-freshly-invented hot-air balloon. "What good is a newborn baby?" That was 1783; powered flight didn't happen until 1903. If you don't see ''enough'' benefits from relativity yet, I'd say you need to embrace patience. --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 22:20, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::: And by "squeeze out" I assume you mean in funding? I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, I think it is worth it because it is an integral part of God's creation. Plus, I don't think that just because relativity is given grant money that necessarily means that it is taking it from money that would have gone to say genetically engineering bigger crops. There isn't a one-one correspondence.

::::I agree with a lot on here but honestly Andy, with all respect, I think DanHutchin is right. We all suffer from pride and from all I have read on here, from your brother Roger to Kate above, you are suffering from it big time on this issue. Think, is it really a coincidence that the first part of the Conservative Bible Project I translated was talking about humbling oneself and I did it just this very night? Sorry for the long response but know that it comes from the heart. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 22:29, 15 November 2009 (EST)

::::: Amen, Ameda. I appreciate your advice for me to read the Bible more, and with a humbler heart. I'd also like your advice about this. If empirically the promotion of relativity leads people ''away'' from the Bible, would you still support the promotion of relativity? A direct answer from your heart, please.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:43, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::: From the heart, and '''hopefully''' my understanding of the Word, anything can lead people away from the Lord, even if "based" on the Word of God. What I mean by that is people can use and abuse anything, even the Bible to support xyz. ''You know how many times I see Peter Popoff ripping off my brothers and sisters in Christ for some "Miracle spring water"?''

::::::If relativity is part of the fabric of the universe, and I do think that, then it was created by God just as much as the Bible, the stars, etc. and as I said can be used and abused. The only way science can lead one away from the Lord is if there isn't the secondary component to it, the spiritual one, the one stating that this was created by a being that created you and loves you. That is the only thing that needs to be addressed not relativity itself. Basically it seems like you are arguing that God's creation can lead people away from him? I don't think that is scriptural nor correct. [[User:Ameda|ameda]] 23:04, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::No, that's not what I'm saying, and I humbly requested a ''direct'' answer. People who are taught and then believe relativity are less likely to read the Bible again, or as frequently. If true (as we've seen on this site and in colleges), do you still support the promotion of relativity?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:18, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::I don't think that is what you're saying, but Ameda has a point: if relativity is true, then God made it, so we can't dismiss it. If it isn't true, and if it does lead people away from the Bible, then we shouldn't be talking about it - but we first need to decide whether relativity is true.

:::::::And could I please see those statistics? I believe relativity, and I read the Bible. I think you're mistaking a correlation for causation: we already know colleges try to move students away from the Bible, and they're where most people happen to learn relativity. So, even though relativity has nothing to do with it, it's quite possible that people who study relativity are less likely to read the Bible because they've happened to spend years at liberal schools. (Incidentally, that's a good reason to teach relativity here at Conservapedia!) --[[User:EvanW|EvanW]] 23:24, 15 November 2009 (EST)

:::::::: Andy, you are trying to trap me into some black/white answer here. I believe that relativity is true and therefore when taught in all aspects will not lead people away from God. You might as well ask me the same thing concerning the Sun. Can it lead people away, sure, '''when''' it is couched in naturalistic philosophy. You are making some wild hypothetical based on nothing but your own encounters with vandals on this site, that is not empirical. I can easily make the same hypothetical concerning Conservapedia itself. I view this site as preaching the word of God but that doesn't mean that just because someone thinks less of Christianity after reading it then that means it is a problem with the site, it could be with the person not wanting to hear the truth.

::::::::PS- People misunderstood me, I wasn't saying Andy was arguing that, it simply reads like it as a consequence of what he is saying considering that relativity is correct and was designed by God. My opinion of course.[[User:Ameda|ameda]] 23:29, 15 November 2009 (EST)

(unindent) Don't let me jump into the middle of y'all's philosophical debate or anything, but there's a point on the table that needs resolving. Andy, your essay (yes, I know, still a work in progress) contains falsehoods. Are you at all interested in correcting them? --[[User:KSorenson|KSorenson]] 23:31, 15 November 2009 (EST)

Indeed. The essay contained the claim that the theory of general relativity is non-falsifiable. This is patently wrong. There are well documented experiments that seek, through observation of physical phenomena, to disprove predictions made by the application of the theory of the general relativity. Whether the results of these observations match the predictions made (within scientifically determined margins of error) is completely immaterial. The fact that the experiments contain the potential to show that the theory of relativity is false shows that the theory of relativity meets the most basic test required to be considered falsifiable. It is impossible to deny such a basic and obvious fact and retain any kind of credibility.

''"In the meantime, could you specify how the theory of relativity has helped anyone?"'' As has been stated above, PET scans. Please show how PET scans have never helped anybody. And all those inventions mentioned above are just the tip of the 'berg of how the theory of relativity has helped people.

''"Relativity pulls people away from reading the Bible"'' Please show the empirical evidence you have gathered for this. Please also provide the empirical evidence that shows that the people not reading the Bible '''a)''' have done so because of relativity and '''b)''' were reading the Bible before they became involved with relativity.

''"I'll work on translating the Bible tonight and tomorrow with "a state of Humility.""'' So you refuse to reconsider your belief that relativity is wrong, and refuse to remove the falsehoods contained within the essay. Instead you seek to rewrite sacred texts so that they say only what you want to say. Much in the same way you seek to rewrite what falsifiability means so that it says only what you want it to say. Much as you seek to rewrite the good that the theory of relativity has led to so that it now says only what you want it to say. Much as you seek to rewrite the experiments that test the theory of reliability and also seek to rewrite the results of those experiments so that they say only what you want them to say. I'm sorry. I truly am, for while I can see a pattern there, I cannot see any true humility in any of these actions.--[[User:DanHutchin|DanHutchin]] 11:23, 16 November 2009 (EST)

:Dan, I find your rants to be nonsensical. The theory of relativity no more helped develop PET scans than it helped land a man on the moon.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:38, 21 November 2009 (EST)

== Information theory? ==

In this essay am missing (among some other things which where partly already discussed in the talk page) the connection between physical reality and information theory. Maybe introducing the definition of entropy itself (and not a selected spotlight on the thermodynamic relations) would help to generate some more context.

:Please improve as you think best. Information theory does deal with physical reality, as in communication errors.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:06, 21 November 2009 (EST)

:: Ok I'll try, but it may take time, because i'll have to review some literature - I may hold a phd in physics and deal with effects of disorder in my experiments on a daily basis, but the (theoretical) developments in the last 100 years in that respect were a little steep. I feel that when discussing the topic Hawking deserves to mentioned, as well as the dissipation-fluctuation theorem, the Boltzmann radiation, entanglement, ergodicity, and maybe more (or a well selected set of topics to make it more clear). I'll try to write first a small independent text on how I see the subject (An kind of "reply" essay), which we can compare. I'll announce in this talk page, ok? (And i will not refer to relativity at all, because i find the discussions here about that topic highly uninspiring and counterproductive. Everything what needs to be said has been said already a hundred times.). If we feel that the content can be merged without messing things up, we can do so. --[[User:Stitch75|Stitch75]] 03:10, 21 November 2009 (EST)

::: To be candid, Stitch, if one's mind is completely made up and closed with respect to relativity, then I'm not optimistic about how insightful one can be on other topics. The essence of advancing knowledge is an open mind that is constantly challenging existing theories. That's what we do here, and I hope you can accept that approach.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:33, 21 November 2009 (EST)

:::: As all most physicist in the world, i am expecting what the next LIGO upgrade will bring. If it does not show gravity wave events then the colleagues in the relativity community may have to explain sth to us, since the general claim would be that it should be possible to observe these events then. However I am not an expert on relativity, so this is not my bussiness. And i find it sad that you suppose that somebody doing actual experiments and evaluating the data himself can tell less about modern physics than somebody who has comparatively little personal experience in experimental physics, and negligible one in theoretical physics. I am used to judge people based on what their statements and not on their non-statements. --[[User:Stitch75|Stitch75]] 07:49, 22 November 2009 (EST)

::::: What's "sad" is how relativity misleads so many people and wastes taxpayers' money on experiments that never prove anything. LIGO is yet another million-dollar boondoggle. People who believe in relativity should spend ''their own money'' on their activities, not ours, just as religions do.

::::: Not only does the theory of relativity fail to help anyone, but it affirmatively hurts lots of people by misleading them into a hurtful frame of mind.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:12, 22 November 2009 (EST)

== Science and the Bible ==

The talk page has been filled with quite a lively discussion. While the scientific arguments are interesting, they have been based on the assumption of this article: modern physics will help us understand the Bible. But, does someone really read the two feeding stories in Mark, and conclude that, ergo, order has won out over disorder? I highly doubt it. When Peter attempts to walk on the water in Matthew, is the reader really wondering if gravity or the "disordering" action of wind and wave caused him to fail? I would say - not likely. (A better question might be: Why does Mark not have Peter attempt to walk on the water?) As for John 1:1, the discussion concerning the logos has been equally lively, but the translation of logos as "perfect order" doesn't seem to be the best, especially if it is used to drag modern physics into it. The term logos, by the time of John, had had a long philosophical history, and it is to that history and to Greek philosophy that we should turn in order to understand it, and to put it into its proper context. - Danielitld

:Daniel, I have an open mind about this, and discussions are enlightening. I don't see any reason to place limits or boundaries on the Bible, and the remarkable insights that can be gleaned from it. Newton used daily, and that can hardly be criticized in light of his prodigious scientific output. Shouldn't modern scientific inquiry imitate Newton's productive approach? I think it should.

:Mark was a young boy who wrote about what he witnessed. Young boys are not out on dangerous boats in the middle of the night, so Mark didn't see the walking on water. As to translating "logos", John was trying to communicate the truth there and the Greek was inadequate. I don't think a scientific connotation should be automatically ruled out. Science is, after all, part of truth. But I welcome your views.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 09:50, 23 November 2009 (EST)

The greatness of Isaac Newton is not to be denied. However, that doesn't mean that his ideas can never be superseded, or that we can't disagree with him. According to an essay on Newton by Stephen Snobelen - found via the site isaac-newton.org - Newton believed that the ancient Greeks knew about the inverse-square law of gravitation, but "cloaked [that knowledge] behind the figure of Apollo and his seven-string lyre". Personally, I don't think that is the case. Religiously, Newton seemed to have believed in Arianism, that Jesus wasn't God - a view you probably disagree with. To say that the Bible is not a science book is not "placing limits" on the Bible. Its acknowledging that the Bible is a product of the time(s) when it was written. And its also stating that, characterizing the Bible as a science book mischaracterizes it, and leads to misunderstandings. Reading Mark's stories of the feedings of the multitudes as "order vs disorder" is a woeful misconception of what Mark was trying to say. The one link that JacobB wanted me to check out actually said that Matthew 24:30 somehow is a reference to television!! - which is simply outlandish! Would reading that verse with "television" in mind really improve someone's understanding of it? I'm highly skeptical of that notion, to say the least. Just as I'm skeptical of finding dinosaurs in the Bible, for reasons I've mentioned elsewhere. Realizing that the ancient Hebrews or Greeks didn't know modern science is not to say that they were idiots. The people who wrote the Bible were hardly that. Isn't it enough that they bequeathed to us the idea of monotheism with an ancient logic which, by itself and without the need to inject dinosaurs into it, is still compelling? - Danielitld
:Daniel, we addressed this on the Genesis talk page, and you seem to be bringing up the same nonsense as there. "Its acknowledging that the Bible is a product of the time(s) when it was written." The Bible is '''not''' a cultural product. It is the inspired word of God. The Logic of the bible is not ancient. It is divine. Methinks you've listened to too many liberal apologists. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 13:21, 23 November 2009 (EST)

So, Douglas, am I to take it that you believe that televisions are referred to in Matthew's gospel? And you say that my comments are "nonsense"! But if the Bible is not a cultural product, then how is it that you are supposedly finding the products of the 20th and 21st centuries in it? You want to deny that ancient cultures had any influence in the Bible's writing, yet apparently only our modern day culture can fully understand it. If the Bible is the timeless word of God, then the ancient Hebrew should have been as fully able of comprehending it as an early 21st Century American. It shouldn't require the happenstance of the invention of television to understand what the Bible says.

You might want to talk with Michael Back about this, as well. "As for the logos, John was using a concept the Greeks had . . to help the Greeks better understand who and what Jesus was," he wrote. This definitely sounds like its a "cultural product", especially since Mr Back "highly doubts" that the term logos - and the Greek ideas related to it - is "EXACTLY who Jesus is". (Emphasis in the original.) When asked by the scribe which is the greatest commandment, Jesus responded that the Shema Yisrael is. But then he added: "The second is this: Love your neighbor as yourself." (Mark 12:29-31) These two great commandments are Jewish, from Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Rabbi Hillel, who lived at same time as Jesus, told the man hopping about on one leg that the Torah can be reduced to this: What is hateful to you, don't do to another. So we can see that Jesus' words were part and parcel of the cultural milieu of his time. They, and the gospel they are in, were cultural products. And now these ancient cultural products are part and parcel of our culture. They don't require televisions, dinosaurs or the Second Law of Thermodynamics for further explication. Like the Socratic "Know thyself", they stand on their own, as relevant today as they were 2,000 years ago or more. - Danielitld
::The Bible is logic, as Douglas says. Logic yields insights. It did for Newton, for everyone's benefit. Of course Newton wasn't correct about everything he did. But he got enough things right, and the Bible helped. It can help us too ... in all areas of life, including science.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:38, 23 November 2009 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Quantifying Order

2009-11-23T17:57:05Z

Danielitld: /* Science and the Bible */

Talk:Essay:Quantifying Order

2009-11-23T13:36:55Z

Danielitld: /* Science and the Bible */ new section

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-21T23:14:24Z

Danielitld: /* baramin */

Perhaps chapters one and two could be combined in some way so that they clearly tell the same story in the same order? Liberals often claim that they show two differently ordered creation stories and it would be a good idea to clarify this.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 15:09, 11 October 2009 (EDT)
:That's a major re-write, something we're not doing. While I agree we should make clear that Genesis 2:6-25 expands on what happened in Genesis 1:26-27, re-writing Genesis is a more drastic step than that action requires. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 15:31, 11 October 2009 (EDT)
::I agree, but it would be best to ensure that the two chronologies are the same. As it is, it looks like a different story starts from genesis 2:4 - and this is the usual Liberal complaint.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 16:29, 16 October 2009 (EDT)
:::Not required, actually. Genesis 1 gives the overview, and Genesis 2 gives the details. Verse 4 makes this clear, as you can see from my translation: "This is the story..." Notice also that Verse 5 undergoes a badly needed repair, because as it was, it didn't make a bit of sense.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:27, 27 October 2009 (EDT)
::::But verse 4 says: ''This is the story of the skies and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the skies.'' This still looks like the start of a different story doesn't it? And for example, Gen 2 - 19 has the animals created after Adam, while Gen 1 - 23 has the animals on the filth day - before Adam. --[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 17:48, 29 October 2009 (EDT)

== Genesis 1:2 ==
If "the waters under the heaven [were] gathered together unto one place, and ... the dry land appear[ed]" on the third day (Gen. 1:9), can it really be said that there were "oceans" on the first day? [[User:AngusF|AngusF]] 18:10, 14 October 2009 (EDT)
:Take your absurd gotcha questions elsewhere. Maybe wikipedia will appreciate them. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 14:28, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
::Let me get this straight. You guys are changing the words of the most revered English-language Bible, and then, when asked to account for a word-change, call the question "absurd". Gotcha. [[User:AngusF|AngusF]] 18:44, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

For the benefit of all observers: "Oceans" can mean the full quantity of all the waters.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:27, 27 October 2009 (EDT)
:I humbly defer to your expertise, and "oceans" can be seen as an expansive term, but "ocean" is most commonly seen as a ''body'' of water, and the reference here is clearly to water uncontained and undifferentiated. I still plump for "waters" as the better rendering. [[User:ChrisFV|ChrisFV]] 22:46, 28 October 2009 (EDT)

== 24 hours rather than days? ==

Is this desirable? In my opinion no, as it takes away from the beauty of the book - '24 hours' rather than 'day' seems to be more suited to a textbook, rather than a beautiful book like the Bible. I will remove it, but feel free to put it back in if you disagree. [[User:DerickC|DerickC]] 13:07, 15 October 2009 (EDT)
: As you can see, I left an explanation in the Analysis column that "day" means "solar day" and thus 24 hours.

==baramin==
Would it be better to use the modern conservative word [[Baraminology | baramin]] rather than the Old English word "kind" in verses 12 onwards?--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 15:10, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

I don't know that enough people are going to know what 'baramin' means for this to be helpful. According to Albert Barnes, the phrase 'after its kind' " intimates that like produces like, and therefore that the “kinds” or species are fixed, and do not run into one another. In this little phrase the theory of one species being developed from another is denied."{{unsigned|BruceR}}

Not to worry. I left a link to [[Baraminology]] and a full explanation of where that name comes from. "Kind" is correct; it is the word that [[God]] actually used, or at least how it translated. But everyone will know what we mean by that, especially after we write the commentary.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:30, 27 October 2009 (EDT)

I just read a lot of the discussion concerning "baraminology" on Conservapedia. What it comes down to is just how much of a scientific work is the Bible? And is the use of the term "baraminology" justified? While in its defense, its said that baraminology is a new system of classification, it does seem kind of confused. The "holobaramin" of dogs is said to include all canids, which were descended from the "two individuals taken aboard the Ark". Since canids include foxes, wolves, coyotes, domestic dogs, dholes, cape hunting dogs, etc., then it would appear that baraminology accepts the idea of speciation - which another article in Conservapedia confirms. So the holobaramin of canids includes all species of canids which speciated or evolved from the Noachian two. Or did some of them speciate from species that speciated from the original two? From the holobaramin, we go "up", to the apobaramin, which are groups of holobaramins. The article on baraminology states that the holobaramins of wolves and humans are grouped in one apobaramin. Since the holobaramin involves species which speciated from the original two or from those which speciated from the original two, is such a biological relationship implied for the groups in a apobaramin? What exactly determines membership in a holobaramin, or a apobaramin? And why bother coming up with "baraminology", when the classification system of kingdom, phylum, class, order, etc., works perfectly well? If the answer is that this implies evolutionary relationships, then so does baraminology when you get down to it.

Getting back to the first question, how scientific is the Bible, I examined that with my discussions of the expanse and of the tannin. But researching baraminology led me to "classification system" on Conservapedia, where it stated that the Biblical reference to bats as birds was based on the Bible "using a different classification system", the "flying creatures" level of baramin. The verse where bats are "classified" with birds is Leviticus 11:19 (and Deuteronomy 14:18). This verse is in the section of Leviticus forbidding the eating of unclean birds. Another verse in this section, 16, lists "the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk" (KJV) The JPS translates verse 16 as "the ostrich, the night hawk, the sea gull and hawks of every kind". The discrepancy is obvious: Owls and ostriches may both be birds - of course, according to the statement in Conservapedia, the ostrich wouldn't be a bird, since it is not a "flying creature" - but they are very different. Looking at the Hebrew, we see that ostrich is yaen, while owl is yaanah, which is the feminine form of yaen. The Hebrew for hawk is tachmas, which comes from chamas, to be violent, and, Strong's Concordance says, can mean either owl or hawk. But the Hebrew for hawk can also be nets, from natsats, to glare or be brightly colored. What's interesting, is that nets can also mean flower; and in Job 15:33, the term nitsah - the feminine of nets - is used for flower. The Hebrew for cuckoo or gull is shachaph, to peel or be emaciated. From this we can see that the words for these animals is based not on scientific rigor, but is rather more descriptive of these animals. Both owls and hawks are violent in their attack, and both merit the word tachmas, which has nothing to do with their biological relationship. An owl is also termed a yaanah, the feminine of yaen - again, perhaps descriptive - an owl is a feminine ostrich - but of course it is not biologically correct. And then we get to the word nets used for both hawk and flower, which may be highly descriptive of both as colorful, but hardly signifies a close relationship in any classification system. - Danielitld

:Despite having meandered through your wandering post and never having reached a point, I managed to scry something of what you were attempting to communicate. The Bible is unscientific? The Bible is extraordinarily scientific, and possesses scientific knowledge nobody could have possibly possessed when it was written, other than God. Don't believe me? [http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml See for yourself.]
:Regardless of whether a bat is a bird, God may have simply wanted people not to eat them because of something they had in common with birds - perhaps flight or a diet of insects exposes them to some disease that non-flying birds don't have, I don't know.
:We should not ever be attempting to tear down the Bible with knowledge that we've gained through genetics or other modern science (like ostriches having more in common with birds than bats), but instead use the Bible to understand our world better, and using modern knowledge as a supplement to that. I pray you learn to stop trying to tear down the Bible. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 13:51, 21 November 2009 (EST)

:: Look no further than our own article, [[Bible scientific foreknowledge]]. However, I must concur with Jacob: Daniel, your writing is so roundabout that I can barely read it. Conciseness is key. To the point, baraminology is a fledgling but burgeoning field of research, with extraordinary predictive power. I suggest you research it more before presenting paltry criticism. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 14:14, 21 November 2009 (EST)

Since when is trying to understand the Bible considered tearing it down? Someone wants to claim that dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible. If I look at that claim, and find it questionable if not plain wrong, is the Bible "damaged", or only the claim? JacobB's link in support of that claim, says that Behemoth and Leviathan, from Job, were dinosaurs. Were they? The footnote in the Good News Bible states that "some identify this [Behemoth] with the hippopotamus", while Leviathan "some take . . to be the crocodile". Believe what you want, since there's no way to be sure. Of course, both the hippo and the crocodile are dangerous creatures, and were surely known to the writer of Job. There doesn't seem to be any need to interpret them as being dinosaurs.

Take the word tannin, which JacobB's link mentions as referring to dinosaurs. I've already covered that with a discussion below. So I'll just repeat that, in Lamentations 4:3, a tannin is described as suckling its young - a mammalian trait, not a dinosaurian one. If you want to believe that the term tannin at least is broad enough to include dinosaurs, then you are free to do so. But a term so broad which can mean any type of animal is hardly scientific. And that is the point I was making referring to Leviticus 11:16, even without delving into the "bat is a bird" notion. The terms used are descriptive, not scientific. Shown the Hebrew term "nets" by itself, you wouldn't know if the "brightly-colored" object being referred to was a hawk or a flower. The Hebrew term yaen and its feminine form yaanah refer to what? The male ostrich and one might assume the female ostrich. Yet yaanah is translated in the KJV as "owl", which is also how the term tachmas is rendered, when its not translated as hawk. Researching all of this hardly "tears down" the Bible. It just points out that "the Bible is not a scientific book", as JacobB's link first states. And understanding how the ancient Hebrews looked at things means you don't have to go chasing down dinosaurs to understand the Bible. - Danielitld

== 3:14 ==

"You will crawl on your belly and eat dry-powder food throughout the days of your life."
Again, I defer to the expert(s), but I don't see the basis for "dry-powder food". Throughout the Old Testament, עפר (`aphar) is used in two senses: dust/dry earth (as in Gen. 2:7), and a vast number (as in Gen. 13:16). I don't see any basis for "food". Also, serpents (snakes) are almost exclusively carnivorous. Meat doesn't register as a "dry-powder food". [[User:ChrisFV|ChrisFV]] 22:59, 28 October 2009 (EDT)

== The expanse ==

The JPS Torah commentary states that "the verbal form [of expanse or rakia in Hebrew] is often used for hammering out metal or flattening out earth". What the expanse or the sky was actually supposed to be is unclear. The commentary points out that, in Ezekiel 1:22, the expanse is equated to ice. Whether metal or ice, the water beyond it was taken to be the source for rain. What I find interesting is that, in the translation, while it is stated how the ancient Hebrews understood things, it apparently seems necessary to point out how creation scientists understand the expanse. But is it even appropriate to take that ancient understanding - to even ''understand'' that that was the way the ancient Hebrews understood things - and somehow try to give it scientific legitimacy with ideas of water-vapor barriers or notions of Einsteinian physics? The Jehovah's Witnesses have "theorized" that a belt or a sphere of water orbited the Earth, even though this goes against what is said in Genesis. If the ancient Hebrews understood the expanse as a metallic or an ice barrier from which rain came, then obviously that was wrong, as we now know. But if we try to interpret the ancient text in a modern way, then aren't we actually misinterpreting it? Shouldn't we look at it with Hebrew eyes, and try to see the Hebrew understanding - even if it is scientifically inaccurate?

The same goes for the notion of dinosaurs being mentioned at Genesis 1:21. Just as the Hebrews didn't understand how rain came about, how much of a notion did they even have about dinosaurs? The Hebrew word used for "great sea monsters" is tannin. But from its use in the Bible, we can see that it is not an exact scientific term. In Ezekiel 29:3, the pharaoh is described as "the great tannin that crouches in the midst of his streams". The KJV translates this as dragon. But the Jerusalem (Hebrew) Bible translates it as crocodile, which would seem appropriate. However, in Lamentations 4:3, we read how the tannins "draw out the breast, they give suck to their young ones". The KJV translates this as "sea monsters", while the Jerusalem Bible renders it as jackals. Whatever these tannins are supposed to be, they are definitely mammals, since only mammals suckle their young. If someone would want to interpret tannin as including dinosaurs along with all other kinds of animals, then I suppose he or she would be free to do so. However, such an interpretation would definitely have to be a very loose one. - Danielitld````

== Genesis 3:1 ==

Is the serpent really Satan? Genesis 3:1 says that the serpent was a "wild beast" "that the Lord God had made". This reflects the words of Genesis 1:24-5, with the stipulation that "God saw that this was good". The Hebrew word for serpent used here is nachash, and it appears in many places in the Bible, where it is not equated with Satan. In Genesis 49:17, we are told that Dan, "one of the tribes of Israel", "shall be a serpent by the road, a viper by the path, that bites the horse's heels so that his rider is thrown backward". (JPS translation) Its difficult to imagine one of the tribes of Israel "who shall judge his people" (KJV) being equated with Satan. In Numbers 21:9, we are told that Moses "made a serpent of brass", that would cure any man if he had been bitten by a serpent. Again, its difficult to imagine this as being somehow satanic, when the allusion to the nachash is as a "beast of the field". While the serpent in Genesis 3 may be "subtil" or cunning - the Hebrew word is arum - equating this "beast of the field" with Satan is not supported by the text. Danielitld
:It would seem to be entirely plausible that ''all'' animals could talk before the fall. After all, we know that, for instance T Rex was vegetarian and used its teeth for opening coconuts. So it requires no great stretch of the imagination to suggest that apart from being entirely herbivorous the animals were also capable of speech. This would explain the fact that Eve is in no way recorded as being surprised by being accosted by a talking snake. It would also make the punishment which the snakes received as a group a lot more fair - as if it was only an unwilling tool of Satan then the permenant cursing would seem rather harsh - but if the snake was acting of its own violation then the punishment is more reasonable.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 12:57, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I have never heard about T. rex using its teeth to open coconuts, so I searched for any information on that on line. The only reference I found to this is on the website fishfeet2007.blogspot.com. Whoever wrote this reference said that, when he or she asked a guide at the Creation Museum what T. rex used its recurved teeth for, the guide responded that they were used for opening coconuts. However, a blogger named Hans Mast at HansMast.com states that this "fact" was made up by someone trying to "belittle" the Creation Museum in Kentucky, even before it opened. HansMast.com also points out that there are no guides at that museum, since it is a self-guided museum. When I tried to find a reference to this on the Creation Museum site, I found none. So it appears that Hans Mast is right - this is a hoax which has spread over the internet. - Danielitld
:That is most interesting. Nevertheless T Rex must have used its teeth for something before the Fall.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 17:45, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I found the comment to Genesis 1:6, about the expanse, most interesting: "The ancient Hebrews believed that the sky was in fact a solid object that separated two classes of water". I commented before that, understanding that that is what the ancient Hebrews believed, why then do creation scientists seek an explanation for this expanse that we now know doesn't exist? Put another way, since we can no longer believe what the ancient Hebrews believed, then how can we interpret the Bible literally? When you state that the T. rex must have used its teeth for something, the answer is in its teeth: The T. rex used its teeth for eating meat. This may contradict a supposed literal interpretation of Genesis. But as the "expanse" of Genesis 1:6 shows, a literal interpretation is just not possible. We might even ask ourselves how the ancient Hebrews themselves read the Torah. W. Gunther Plaut, in the introduction to his Torah commentary writes: "Even the ancient Jewish Sages, who believed that the Torah was a divinely authored book, did not take the text literally. They took it seriously, but they always looked behind the flat literal meaning. They realized that the Bible - in addition to everything else it was to them - abounded in subtle metaphors and allusions, that it used word plays and other literary devices, that it sometimes spoke satirically, and that its poetry could not be subject to a simple approach. They agreed without embarrassment that one could disagree on what the Torah meant, and on this sound principle we ourselves should base our approach to the text." An example of word play can be found in Genesis 3, where the serpent is "cunning" - the Hebrew word is arum - and then Adam and Eve found themselves ashamed because they were naked - aram in Hebrew. It is difficult to imagine this play on words being taken in a "flat literal" sense. Which takes us back to the expanse of verse 1:6. Did the ancient Hebrews actually believe, then, that the sky was a solid object? Or does this verse also have a meaning behind its "flat literal meaning"? If they really did believe the sky was a solid object, at a time which was centuries before Galileo, Kepler and Copernicus, then do Jews still believe that? I really don't believe that they do. - Danielitld

== Noah and Utnapishtim ==

In the comment to verse 6:14, we are told that, with the word pitch or kaphar in Hebrew "the ransom Jesus Christ paid for mankind" is prefigured. But since the ark or tebah only appears again in Exodus in connection with Moses, it would seem that Moses is prefigured here. The Hebrew word for pitch, kaphar, means to cover, according to Strong's Concordance, and , figuratively, to expiate, condone, placate, and cancel. But the word for pitch in Exodus is zepheth or asphalt, not kaphar. Where kaphar does appear is in the Epic of Gilgamesh, according to the JPS Torah Commentary, where the Akkadian word kupru is used: "six 'sar' (measures) of bitumen I poured into the furnace", Utnapishtim relates in the Epic. Instead of "prefiguring" a future event, kaphar represents a rewriting of the Epic. Utnapishtim is told by the gods to "Give up possessions, seek thou life. Forswear (worldly) goods and keep the soul alive!" If with kaphar/kupru we are meant to understand an atonement because "the earth became corrupt" (v. 6:11), then the expiation of that corruption was attained through the flood in both Genesis and the Epic. - Danielitld

In the Epic of Gilgamesh, we read that the god of the underworld "Erragal tears out the posts" of "the world dam", while the god of war Ninurta "causes the dikes to follow", thus unleashing the deluge. Is it possible to read this account of the flood and give it any kind of scientific credibility? After reading Walt Brown's "hydroplate theory", it would appear that that is what was done. Brown refers to pillars that held the crust of the earth up over his theorized subcrustal ocean, whose "tearing out" caused the waters of that subterranean ocean to spew out. But basing the hypothesized pillars on the "science" of Gilgamesh is highly dubious, to say the least. Aside from the science, is Brown's hypothesized "subcrustal ocean" even Biblically correct?

In verse 7:11, we read that the "fountains of the great deep [were] broken up". In Genesis 1:2, we first encountered the "great deep" or tehom - the "cosmic abyssal water" that existed when the earth was "unformed and void". (from the JPS Torah Commentary) On the second day of creation, God made the expanse - rakia - to "separate water from water", "and it separated the water which was below the expanse from the water which was above the expanse". On the third day, God bade "the water below the sky [the expanse] be gathered into one area, that the dry land may appear". We are then told that "God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering of waters He called Seas". What I get from this is the world as we now know it, with its continents and oceans - but not a "subcrustal ocean".

Tehom also appears in other Biblical verses. In Isaiah 51:10, the "arm of the Lord" is asked "Art thou not it which dried the sea, the waters of the great deep [tehom]; that made the depths of the sea a way for the ransomed to pass over?" (Jerusalem Bible) - referring to the Exodus crossing of the Sea of Reeds. In Habakkuk 3:10, we read how the mountains tremble upon seeing God, and "the deep [tehom] uttered its voice, and lifted up its hands on high". (Jerusalem Bible) In Genesis 49:25, we read that God "blesses you with the blessings of heaven above, [and the] blessings of the deep that crouches below". (JPS) Similarly in Deuteronomy 33:13, we read of Joseph "blessed of the Lord be his land with the bounty of the dew of heaven, and of the deep that crouches below". (JPS) From these verses, the idea of a "subcrustal ocean" is just not there. Reading the verses from Genesis 49 and Deuteronomy 33, if we were to equate the "deep" or tehom with a "subcrustal ocean", we would even get the impression that Brown's "subcrustal ocean" is still there after the flood.

Reading Genesis 7:11 with Genesis 1:6-10 in mind, what we are to understand is that "creation is being undone", according to the JPS commentary. The waters which were separated by the expanse are coming together again, making the earth again "unformed and void". But "God remembered Noah", and basically created the earth again, in chapter 8. The water above the expanse was "held back", and the waters below the expanse returned to the seas. There is no room here for a "subcrustal ocean", and any hypothesizing to that effect is inane, not only scientifically, but Biblically as well. - Danielitld

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-21T18:40:18Z

Danielitld: /* baramin */

Perhaps chapters one and two could be combined in some way so that they clearly tell the same story in the same order? Liberals often claim that they show two differently ordered creation stories and it would be a good idea to clarify this.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 15:09, 11 October 2009 (EDT)
:That's a major re-write, something we're not doing. While I agree we should make clear that Genesis 2:6-25 expands on what happened in Genesis 1:26-27, re-writing Genesis is a more drastic step than that action requires. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 15:31, 11 October 2009 (EDT)
::I agree, but it would be best to ensure that the two chronologies are the same. As it is, it looks like a different story starts from genesis 2:4 - and this is the usual Liberal complaint.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 16:29, 16 October 2009 (EDT)
:::Not required, actually. Genesis 1 gives the overview, and Genesis 2 gives the details. Verse 4 makes this clear, as you can see from my translation: "This is the story..." Notice also that Verse 5 undergoes a badly needed repair, because as it was, it didn't make a bit of sense.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:27, 27 October 2009 (EDT)
::::But verse 4 says: ''This is the story of the skies and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the skies.'' This still looks like the start of a different story doesn't it? And for example, Gen 2 - 19 has the animals created after Adam, while Gen 1 - 23 has the animals on the filth day - before Adam. --[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 17:48, 29 October 2009 (EDT)

== Genesis 1:2 ==
If "the waters under the heaven [were] gathered together unto one place, and ... the dry land appear[ed]" on the third day (Gen. 1:9), can it really be said that there were "oceans" on the first day? [[User:AngusF|AngusF]] 18:10, 14 October 2009 (EDT)
:Take your absurd gotcha questions elsewhere. Maybe wikipedia will appreciate them. [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 14:28, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
::Let me get this straight. You guys are changing the words of the most revered English-language Bible, and then, when asked to account for a word-change, call the question "absurd". Gotcha. [[User:AngusF|AngusF]] 18:44, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

For the benefit of all observers: "Oceans" can mean the full quantity of all the waters.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:27, 27 October 2009 (EDT)
:I humbly defer to your expertise, and "oceans" can be seen as an expansive term, but "ocean" is most commonly seen as a ''body'' of water, and the reference here is clearly to water uncontained and undifferentiated. I still plump for "waters" as the better rendering. [[User:ChrisFV|ChrisFV]] 22:46, 28 October 2009 (EDT)

== 24 hours rather than days? ==

Is this desirable? In my opinion no, as it takes away from the beauty of the book - '24 hours' rather than 'day' seems to be more suited to a textbook, rather than a beautiful book like the Bible. I will remove it, but feel free to put it back in if you disagree. [[User:DerickC|DerickC]] 13:07, 15 October 2009 (EDT)
: As you can see, I left an explanation in the Analysis column that "day" means "solar day" and thus 24 hours.

==baramin==
Would it be better to use the modern conservative word [[Baraminology | baramin]] rather than the Old English word "kind" in verses 12 onwards?--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 15:10, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

I don't know that enough people are going to know what 'baramin' means for this to be helpful. According to Albert Barnes, the phrase 'after its kind' " intimates that like produces like, and therefore that the “kinds” or species are fixed, and do not run into one another. In this little phrase the theory of one species being developed from another is denied."{{unsigned|BruceR}}

Not to worry. I left a link to [[Baraminology]] and a full explanation of where that name comes from. "Kind" is correct; it is the word that [[God]] actually used, or at least how it translated. But everyone will know what we mean by that, especially after we write the commentary.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]][[User talk:TerryH|Talk]] 18:30, 27 October 2009 (EDT)

I just read a lot of the discussion concerning "baraminology" on Conservapedia. What it comes down to is just how much of a scientific work is the Bible? And is the use of the term "baraminology" justified? While in its defense, its said that baraminology is a new system of classification, it does seem kind of confused. The "holobaramin" of dogs is said to include all canids, which were descended from the "two individuals taken aboard the Ark". Since canids include foxes, wolves, coyotes, domestic dogs, dholes, cape hunting dogs, etc., then it would appear that baraminology accepts the idea of speciation - which another article in Conservapedia confirms. So the holobaramin of canids includes all species of canids which speciated or evolved from the Noachian two. Or did some of them speciate from species that speciated from the original two? From the holobaramin, we go "up", to the apobaramin, which are groups of holobaramins. The article on baraminology states that the holobaramins of wolves and humans are grouped in one apobaramin. Since the holobaramin involves species which speciated from the original two or from those which speciated from the original two, is such a biological relationship implied for the groups in a apobaramin? What exactly determines membership in a holobaramin, or a apobaramin? And why bother coming up with "baraminology", when the classification system of kingdom, phylum, class, order, etc., works perfectly well? If the answer is that this implies evolutionary relationships, then so does baraminology when you get down to it.

Getting back to the first question, how scientific is the Bible, I examined that with my discussions of the expanse and of the tannin. But researching baraminology led me to "classification system" on Conservapedia, where it stated that the Biblical reference to bats as birds was based on the Bible "using a different classification system", the "flying creatures" level of baramin. The verse where bats are "classified" with birds is Leviticus 11:19 (and Deuteronomy 14:18). This verse is in the section of Leviticus forbidding the eating of unclean birds. Another verse in this section, 16, lists "the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk" (KJV) The JPS translates verse 16 as "the ostrich, the night hawk, the sea gull and hawks of every kind". The discrepancy is obvious: Owls and ostriches may both be birds - of course, according to the statement in Conservapedia, the ostrich wouldn't be a bird, since it is not a "flying creature" - but they are very different. Looking at the Hebrew, we see that ostrich is yaen, while owl is yaanah, which is the feminine form of yaen. The Hebrew for hawk is tachmas, which comes from chamas, to be violent, and, Strong's Concordance says, can mean either owl or hawk. But the Hebrew for hawk can also be nets, from natsats, to glare or be brightly colored. What's interesting, is that nets can also mean flower; and in Job 15:33, the term nitsah - the feminine of nets - is used for flower. The Hebrew for cuckoo or gull is shachaph, to peel or be emaciated. From this we can see that the words for these animals is based not on scientific rigor, but is rather more descriptive of these animals. Both owls and hawks are violent in their attack, and both merit the word tachmas, which has nothing to do with their biological relationship. An owl is also termed a yaanah, the feminine of yaen - again, perhaps descriptive - an owl is a feminine ostrich - but of course it is not biologically correct. And then we get to the word nets used for both hawk and flower, which may be highly descriptive of both as colorful, but hardly signifies a close relationship in any classification system. - Danielitld

== 3:14 ==

"You will crawl on your belly and eat dry-powder food throughout the days of your life."
Again, I defer to the expert(s), but I don't see the basis for "dry-powder food". Throughout the Old Testament, עפר (`aphar) is used in two senses: dust/dry earth (as in Gen. 2:7), and a vast number (as in Gen. 13:16). I don't see any basis for "food". Also, serpents (snakes) are almost exclusively carnivorous. Meat doesn't register as a "dry-powder food". [[User:ChrisFV|ChrisFV]] 22:59, 28 October 2009 (EDT)

== The expanse ==

The JPS Torah commentary states that "the verbal form [of expanse or rakia in Hebrew] is often used for hammering out metal or flattening out earth". What the expanse or the sky was actually supposed to be is unclear. The commentary points out that, in Ezekiel 1:22, the expanse is equated to ice. Whether metal or ice, the water beyond it was taken to be the source for rain. What I find interesting is that, in the translation, while it is stated how the ancient Hebrews understood things, it apparently seems necessary to point out how creation scientists understand the expanse. But is it even appropriate to take that ancient understanding - to even ''understand'' that that was the way the ancient Hebrews understood things - and somehow try to give it scientific legitimacy with ideas of water-vapor barriers or notions of Einsteinian physics? The Jehovah's Witnesses have "theorized" that a belt or a sphere of water orbited the Earth, even though this goes against what is said in Genesis. If the ancient Hebrews understood the expanse as a metallic or an ice barrier from which rain came, then obviously that was wrong, as we now know. But if we try to interpret the ancient text in a modern way, then aren't we actually misinterpreting it? Shouldn't we look at it with Hebrew eyes, and try to see the Hebrew understanding - even if it is scientifically inaccurate?

The same goes for the notion of dinosaurs being mentioned at Genesis 1:21. Just as the Hebrews didn't understand how rain came about, how much of a notion did they even have about dinosaurs? The Hebrew word used for "great sea monsters" is tannin. But from its use in the Bible, we can see that it is not an exact scientific term. In Ezekiel 29:3, the pharaoh is described as "the great tannin that crouches in the midst of his streams". The KJV translates this as dragon. But the Jerusalem (Hebrew) Bible translates it as crocodile, which would seem appropriate. However, in Lamentations 4:3, we read how the tannins "draw out the breast, they give suck to their young ones". The KJV translates this as "sea monsters", while the Jerusalem Bible renders it as jackals. Whatever these tannins are supposed to be, they are definitely mammals, since only mammals suckle their young. If someone would want to interpret tannin as including dinosaurs along with all other kinds of animals, then I suppose he or she would be free to do so. However, such an interpretation would definitely have to be a very loose one. - Danielitld````

== Genesis 3:1 ==

Is the serpent really Satan? Genesis 3:1 says that the serpent was a "wild beast" "that the Lord God had made". This reflects the words of Genesis 1:24-5, with the stipulation that "God saw that this was good". The Hebrew word for serpent used here is nachash, and it appears in many places in the Bible, where it is not equated with Satan. In Genesis 49:17, we are told that Dan, "one of the tribes of Israel", "shall be a serpent by the road, a viper by the path, that bites the horse's heels so that his rider is thrown backward". (JPS translation) Its difficult to imagine one of the tribes of Israel "who shall judge his people" (KJV) being equated with Satan. In Numbers 21:9, we are told that Moses "made a serpent of brass", that would cure any man if he had been bitten by a serpent. Again, its difficult to imagine this as being somehow satanic, when the allusion to the nachash is as a "beast of the field". While the serpent in Genesis 3 may be "subtil" or cunning - the Hebrew word is arum - equating this "beast of the field" with Satan is not supported by the text. Danielitld
:It would seem to be entirely plausible that ''all'' animals could talk before the fall. After all, we know that, for instance T Rex was vegetarian and used its teeth for opening coconuts. So it requires no great stretch of the imagination to suggest that apart from being entirely herbivorous the animals were also capable of speech. This would explain the fact that Eve is in no way recorded as being surprised by being accosted by a talking snake. It would also make the punishment which the snakes received as a group a lot more fair - as if it was only an unwilling tool of Satan then the permenant cursing would seem rather harsh - but if the snake was acting of its own violation then the punishment is more reasonable.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 12:57, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I have never heard about T. rex using its teeth to open coconuts, so I searched for any information on that on line. The only reference I found to this is on the website fishfeet2007.blogspot.com. Whoever wrote this reference said that, when he or she asked a guide at the Creation Museum what T. rex used its recurved teeth for, the guide responded that they were used for opening coconuts. However, a blogger named Hans Mast at HansMast.com states that this "fact" was made up by someone trying to "belittle" the Creation Museum in Kentucky, even before it opened. HansMast.com also points out that there are no guides at that museum, since it is a self-guided museum. When I tried to find a reference to this on the Creation Museum site, I found none. So it appears that Hans Mast is right - this is a hoax which has spread over the internet. - Danielitld
:That is most interesting. Nevertheless T Rex must have used its teeth for something before the Fall.--[[User:British_cons|British_cons]] [[User_talk:British_cons|(talk)]] 17:45, 9 November 2009 (EST)

I found the comment to Genesis 1:6, about the expanse, most interesting: "The ancient Hebrews believed that the sky was in fact a solid object that separated two classes of water". I commented before that, understanding that that is what the ancient Hebrews believed, why then do creation scientists seek an explanation for this expanse that we now know doesn't exist? Put another way, since we can no longer believe what the ancient Hebrews believed, then how can we interpret the Bible literally? When you state that the T. rex must have used its teeth for something, the answer is in its teeth: The T. rex used its teeth for eating meat. This may contradict a supposed literal interpretation of Genesis. But as the "expanse" of Genesis 1:6 shows, a literal interpretation is just not possible. We might even ask ourselves how the ancient Hebrews themselves read the Torah. W. Gunther Plaut, in the introduction to his Torah commentary writes: "Even the ancient Jewish Sages, who believed that the Torah was a divinely authored book, did not take the text literally. They took it seriously, but they always looked behind the flat literal meaning. They realized that the Bible - in addition to everything else it was to them - abounded in subtle metaphors and allusions, that it used word plays and other literary devices, that it sometimes spoke satirically, and that its poetry could not be subject to a simple approach. They agreed without embarrassment that one could disagree on what the Torah meant, and on this sound principle we ourselves should base our approach to the text." An example of word play can be found in Genesis 3, where the serpent is "cunning" - the Hebrew word is arum - and then Adam and Eve found themselves ashamed because they were naked - aram in Hebrew. It is difficult to imagine this play on words being taken in a "flat literal" sense. Which takes us back to the expanse of verse 1:6. Did the ancient Hebrews actually believe, then, that the sky was a solid object? Or does this verse also have a meaning behind its "flat literal meaning"? If they really did believe the sky was a solid object, at a time which was centuries before Galileo, Kepler and Copernicus, then do Jews still believe that? I really don't believe that they do. - Danielitld

== Noah and Utnapishtim ==

In the comment to verse 6:14, we are told that, with the word pitch or kaphar in Hebrew "the ransom Jesus Christ paid for mankind" is prefigured. But since the ark or tebah only appears again in Exodus in connection with Moses, it would seem that Moses is prefigured here. The Hebrew word for pitch, kaphar, means to cover, according to Strong's Concordance, and , figuratively, to expiate, condone, placate, and cancel. But the word for pitch in Exodus is zepheth or asphalt, not kaphar. Where kaphar does appear is in the Epic of Gilgamesh, according to the JPS Torah Commentary, where the Akkadian word kupru is used: "six 'sar' (measures) of bitumen I poured into the furnace", Utnapishtim relates in the Epic. Instead of "prefiguring" a future event, kaphar represents a rewriting of the Epic. Utnapishtim is told by the gods to "Give up possessions, seek thou life. Forswear (worldly) goods and keep the soul alive!" If with kaphar/kupru we are meant to understand an atonement because "the earth became corrupt" (v. 6:11), then the expiation of that corruption was attained through the flood in both Genesis and the Epic. - Danielitld

In the Epic of Gilgamesh, we read that the god of the underworld "Erragal tears out the posts" of "the world dam", while the god of war Ninurta "causes the dikes to follow", thus unleashing the deluge. Is it possible to read this account of the flood and give it any kind of scientific credibility? After reading Walt Brown's "hydroplate theory", it would appear that that is what was done. Brown refers to pillars that held the crust of the earth up over his theorized subcrustal ocean, whose "tearing out" caused the waters of that subterranean ocean to spew out. But basing the hypothesized pillars on the "science" of Gilgamesh is highly dubious, to say the least. Aside from the science, is Brown's hypothesized "subcrustal ocean" even Biblically correct?

In verse 7:11, we read that the "fountains of the great deep [were] broken up". In Genesis 1:2, we first encountered the "great deep" or tehom - the "cosmic abyssal water" that existed when the earth was "unformed and void". (from the JPS Torah Commentary) On the second day of creation, God made the expanse - rakia - to "separate water from water", "and it separated the water which was below the expanse from the water which was above the expanse". On the third day, God bade "the water below the sky [the expanse] be gathered into one area, that the dry land may appear". We are then told that "God called the dry land Earth, and the gathering of waters He called Seas". What I get from this is the world as we now know it, with its continents and oceans - but not a "subcrustal ocean".

Tehom also appears in other Biblical verses. In Isaiah 51:10, the "arm of the Lord" is asked "Art thou not it which dried the sea, the waters of the great deep [tehom]; that made the depths of the sea a way for the ransomed to pass over?" (Jerusalem Bible) - referring to the Exodus crossing of the Sea of Reeds. In Habakkuk 3:10, we read how the mountains tremble upon seeing God, and "the deep [tehom] uttered its voice, and lifted up its hands on high". (Jerusalem Bible) In Genesis 49:25, we read that God "blesses you with the blessings of heaven above, [and the] blessings of the deep that crouches below". (JPS) Similarly in Deuteronomy 33:13, we read of Joseph "blessed of the Lord be his land with the bounty of the dew of heaven, and of the deep that crouches below". (JPS) From these verses, the idea of a "subcrustal ocean" is just not there. Reading the verses from Genesis 49 and Deuteronomy 33, if we were to equate the "deep" or tehom with a "subcrustal ocean", we would even get the impression that Brown's "subcrustal ocean" is still there after the flood.

Reading Genesis 7:11 with Genesis 1:6-10 in mind, what we are to understand is that "creation is being undone", according to the JPS commentary. The waters which were separated by the expanse are coming together again, making the earth again "unformed and void". But "God remembered Noah", and basically created the earth again, in chapter 8. The water above the expanse was "held back", and the waters below the expanse returned to the seas. There is no room here for a "subcrustal ocean", and any hypothesizing to that effect is inane, not only scientifically, but Biblically as well. - Danielitld

Mark 9-16 (Translated)

2009-11-17T16:01:22Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 9==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
|Jesus said the them, "Truly I tell you, there are some of you standing here who will live to see the kingdom of God come with power."
|Jesus refers here to the founding of the Church, which truly begins with the events of Acts 2:1-4.
|-
|2
|And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
|Six days later, Jesus took Peter, James, and John, and led them up into a high mountain, and was transfigured before them.
|Or literally, "metamorphized."
|-
|3
|And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
|His clothing was dazzling white, whiter than snow, or anything else on Earth.
|
|-
|4
|And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
|And they saw [[Elijah]] and [[Moses]], and they spoke with Jesus.
|
|-
|5
|And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
|Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good for us to be here. Let us make three tents for the blessed, one for You, one for Moses, and one for Elijah."
|Where is the phrase "for the blessed" coming from in this verse?
|-
|6
|For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
|For he did not know what he was saying, so nervous were they.
|They were afraid, but not as one is afraid of a fire or an animal, but as anyone is afraid of something larger than himself. In addition, Peter was speaking without thinking, as usual.
|-
|7
|And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.
|Now a cloud came and cast a shadow all around, and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is my beloved Son. Listen to Him!"
|
|-
|8
|And suddenly, when they had looked round about, they saw no man any more, save Jesus only with themselves.
|Then suddenly, when they looked around them, they could not see a single person, except Jesus and themselves.
|
|-
|9
|And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
|As they came down the mountain, He asked them not to tell anyone what they had seen until He, the Son of Man, had risen from the grave.
|
|-
|10
|And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.
|Indeed, they kept his secret, but asked each other what such a resurrection would entail.
|
|-
|11
|And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elias must first come?
|Then they asked Jesus, "Why do the scribes say that Elijah will come first?"
|
|-
|12
|And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.
|He responded, "It is true that Elijah must come first to restore everything. Likewise, it is written that the Son of Man must suffer a great deal and be regarded as worthless."
|Mere "despising" doesn't express the Greek roots of this word, which include the word for "nothing" or "nobody."
|-
|13
|But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.
|"But Elijah has already come, and the elite did to him whatever they wanted, as was prophesied."
|Clarifying "they" (Herod et. al)
|-
|14
|And when he came to his disciples, he saw a great multitude about them, and the scribes questioning with them.
|Returning to His students, he found an enormous crowd gathered around them, with the scribes interrogating them.
|
|-
|15
|And straightway all the people, when they beheld him, were greatly amazed, and running to him saluted him.
|Immediately the whole crowd, seeing Jesus, ran to greet Him, amazed by His presence.
|Elizabethan English used "salute" even to mean "greet" as one civilian to another.
|-
|16
|And he asked the scribes, What question ye with them?
|Jesus demanded of the scribes, "What are you asking the people about?"
|
|-
|17
|And one of the multitude answered and said, Master, I have brought unto thee my son, which hath a dumb spirit;
|But a man from the crowd ran forward and said, "Lord, I've brought you my son, who has a demon of dumbness."
|Even the KJV had some gender-neutral verbiage
|-
|18
|And wheresoever he taketh him, he teareth him: and he foameth, and gnasheth with his teeth, and pineth away: and I spake to thy disciples that they should cast him out; and they could not.
|"And wherever the demon takes him, he claws at himself, foams from the mouth, grinds his teeth, and his body wastes away. I asked Your students to exorcise him, but they couldn't."
|
|-
|19
|He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him unto me.
|Jesus responded, "You faithless generation, how long can I be with you? How long will I put up with you? Bring your son to Me."
|
|-
|20
|And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.
|They brought him. The demon, seeing Jesus, immediately threw the boy to the ground, where he flailed about, and foamed.
|
|-
|21
|And he asked his father, How long is it ago since this came unto him? And he said, Of a child.
|Jesus asked the father, "How long has this afflicted him?" "Since he was a child", the man replied.
|
|-
|22
|And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him: but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us.
|"Sometimes the demon throws him into the fire, other times into water in order to kill him. If it is true that you can do anything, please have compassion on us and help."
|
|-
|23
|Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
|Jesus replied, "If you can believe; anything is possible to the believer."
|
|-
|24
|And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
|The father cried out, tears filling his eyes, "I believe, Lord. Help my lack of faith!"
|The word used is '''απιστια''' (''apistia''), which specifically means "not believing."
|-
|25
|When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.
|When Jesus saw the crowd of people running together, He scolded the evil spirit, telling him, "You deaf and mute spirit, I order you to leave him alone, and never to bother him again".
|
|-
|26
|And the spirit cried, and rent him sore, and came out of him: and he was as one dead; insomuch that many said, He is dead.
|The spirit cried out and exited him violently. The boy looked so much like he was dead, that bystanders declared, "He's dead!"
|
|-
|27
|But Jesus took him by the hand, and lifted him up; and he arose.
|But Jesus took his hand and pulled him up, and he stood up.
|
|-
|28
|And when he was come into the house, his disciples asked him privately, Why could not we cast him out?
|When Jesus went indoors, His students privately asked him, "Why couldn't we cast him out?"
|
|-
|29
|And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting.
|He told them, "That kind of spirit can only be driven out by prayer."
|Some, but not all, manuscripts add "and fasting."
|-
|30
|And they departed thence, and passed through Galilee; and he would not that any man should know it.
|They moved on, passing through Galilee; Jesus kept a low profile.
|
|-
|31
|For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.
|He taught His students, saying, "The Son of man shall be betrayed to men who shall murder him, but afterward he shall rise on the third day."
|
|-
|32
|But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him.
|The students did not understand this, and were afraid to ask Jesus.
|
|-
|33
|And he came to Capernaum: and being in the house he asked them, What was it that ye disputed among yourselves by the way?
|They arrived in Capernaum, where as soon as they had gone into a house Jesus asked His students, "What were you arguing about on the highway?"
|
|-
|34
|But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
|But they were too ashamed to answer because they had been debating who was the greatest among them.
|
|-
|35
|And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, the same shall be last of all, and servant of all.
|Jesus sat down and summoned the Twelve, saying, "If anyone wants the highest rank, then he must first become the lowest of all, waiting on all."
|The word used is '''διακονος''', meaning one who waits on tables. This prefigures the appointment of the first [[deacon]]s.
|-
|36
|And he took a child, and set him in the midst of them: and when he had taken him in his arms, he said unto them,
|Jesus then invited a child to join them, and after taking him in His arms, Jesus declared,
|The Greek '''παιδιον''' is neutral, not masculine or feminine. This might explain why the [[NAB]] uses the pronoun "it" instead of "him" here.
|-
|37
|Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.
|"Whoever welcomes such a child in My Name, welcomes Me; and whoever welcomes Me, doesn't so much welcome Me but Him Who sent Me."
|
|-
|38
|And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
|John replied: "Teacher, we saw a man casting out demons in Your Name, who was not one of our group. We told him to stop doing it, because he wasn't one of us.
|
|-
|39
|But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
|But Jesus replied: "Do not forbid him! You see, no man who has carried out a powerful work in My Name can easily turn round and attack Me.
|
|-
|40
|For he that is not against us is on our part.
|Because he who is not our enemy is our ally.
|
|-
|41
|For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
|Anyone who gives you a drink of water in My Name, because you follow Christ, will not lose his reward in heaven.
|In other words, whether someone does any sort of work, "powerful" or "common," makes no difference.
|-
|42
|And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
|Anyone who corrupts or deceives a child who believes in me will wish he had had a millstone hung around his neck and had been cast into the sea.
|The Greek word '''σκανδαλιζω''' means "I cause to reject someone," not merely "offend" as is used today.
|-
|43
|And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your hand corrupts you, cut if off. Entering eternal life maimed is better than descending to Hell with both hands intact, where the fire burns forever.
|
|-
|44
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|The provenance of verse 44 is in dispute.
|-
|45
|And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your foot corrupts you, cut it off. It's better to limp into eternal life than walk steadily into Hell, into that unending fire.
|
|-
|46
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|The provenance of this verse, like verse 44, is in dispute.
|-
|47
|And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
|If your eye deceives you, remove it. Entering God's kingdom half-blinded is better than entering Hell's fires with sight intact.
|
|-
|48
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul is always eaten by worms, and burns forever.
|The Greek '''σκωληξ''' (''scolex'') clearly means "worm." In fact, that term survives today as the head segment of a tapeworm.
|-
|49
|For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
|Everyone will be salted by fire[, as every sacrifice will be salted with salt].
|The provenance of the bracketed portion is in dispute.
|-
|50
|Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another.
|Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how will you season the sacrifice? Have salt in yourselves, and have the divine tranquility of mind.
|
|}

==Chapter 10==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.
|And he left that place, and went to the coasts of Judea on the far side of the Jordan river, and the people came to Him again, and He taught them again.
|
|-
|2
|And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.
|Some Pharisees came to him, and attempted to trick him by asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
|"Pharisees" is the name for a specific sect; see [[Talk:Gospel of Mark (Translated)#"Self-Proclaimed Elite"|this discussion]] regarding the use of "Pharisees."
|-
|3
|And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
|And He answered them, "What did Moses command you?"
|
|-
|4
|And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
|They said, "Moses said that a man could write a bill of divorcement, and divorce her."
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
|Jesus answered them, saying "He wrote you this law because men's hearts are hardened.
|The Greek word '''σκληροκαρδια''' speaks of a heart that refuses to change. Note the root, that survives in medical terms like "arteriosclerosis."
|-
|6
|But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
|But from the beginning of time, God has made man, male and female.
|
|-
|7
|For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
|For this reason, men leave their parents and cling to a wife,
|
|-
|8
|And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
|and the two shall be one flesh, so that they are no longer two people, but one.
|
|-
|9
|What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
|What God has joined together, let no mean tear apart."
|
|-
|10
|And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
|In his house, later, His students asked the same question again.
|The Pharisees asked Jesus this question to trick him; His students asked Him out of curiosity.
|-
|11
|And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
|He said to them, "Any man who divorces his wife and marries another has committed adultery.
|
|-
|12
|And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
|And if a woman divorces her husband, and marries another, she commits adultery."
|This is the real answer to the question of divorce.
|-
|13
|And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.
|Young children were brought to Jesus, that He might teach them. His students scolded those who brought the children,
|
|-
|14
|But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
|but when Jesus saw what His students were doing, He was very unhappy, and told them, "Do not forbid the children to come to me. Allow them there, for they are so like the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|15
|Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
|Truly I say to you, who ever does not receive the kingdom of God the way a child does, he shall not enter into it."
|
|-
|16
|And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|Jesus took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|
|-
|17
|And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
|As he was leaving, a man came running up to him, and kneeled before him, asking, "Good Teacher, what must I do that I may have eternal life?"
|
|-
|18
|And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
|And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? There is no one good but God the Father.
|
|-
|19
|Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
|You know the commandments, 'Do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your parents."
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
|The man answered Him, saying, "Teacher, I have kept all the commandments, since I was a child."
|
|-
|21
|Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
|Jesus loved him, so He said to him, "You lack one thing: go home, sell all your possessions, giving all you have to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow me."
|
|-
|22
|And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
|The man was sad to hear this, and grieved as he left, because he had a lot of "stuff."
|
|-
|23
|And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
|Jesus looked around and said to His students, "How unlikely it is that those who have a lot of money will enter the kingdom of God!"
|The "having" of money isn't the problem, so much as coming to depend on that money as a [[God-substitute]]. But anyone who has money, might come to trust in it. [[God]] wants us to trust Him, money or no.
|-
|24
|And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
|The students were astonished to hear this. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is for them [who trust in money] to enter the kingdom of God!
|Not all manuscripts contain that clarification.
|-
|25
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God."
|Plousios (rich man) derived from ploutos (wealth), from which plutocrat is derived.

The "needle" was the very narrow pedestrian portal in the larger city gate. In order to pass, the camel must lower itself. Similarly, in order to pass the gates of heaven, a man must bow.
|-
|26
|And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
|They were incredulous, saying to each other, "Who, then, can be saved?"
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
|Jesus looked at them and said, "With man, it is impossible to be saved, but not with God - with God, all things are possible."
|God stands ready to save any man, rich, poor, or in-between, who will trust Him ahead of anything else.
|-
|28
|Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
|Peter said to him, "We have left all we had, and followed you."
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
|Jesus answered, "Truly I tell you, every man who has left his house, or siblings, or parents, or family, or lands for My sake and the sake of the gospel
|
|-
|30
|But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
|shall in this life receive a hundred times as much persecution as he gave up in goods. But in the world to come, he shall receive eternal life.
|
|-
|31
|But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.
|Many who are in the first rank will be sent to the last rank, and many in the last shall be brought forward to the first."
|
|-
|32
|And they were in the way going up to Jerusalem; and Jesus went before them: and they were amazed; and as they followed, they were afraid. And he took again the twelve, and began to tell them what things should happen unto him,
|Jesus walked ahead of the rest on their way to Jerusalem. His students were in amazement while other followers were fearful. Jesus pulled the twelve Apostles aside and began telling them what to expect next.
|
|-
|33
|Saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles:
|He said, "Listen carefully: we will arrive in Jerusalem, where the Son of man shall be betrayed and handed over to the leading priests and scribes, who shall condemn Him to death for execution by the Gentiles.
|A reminder that the [[Sanhedrin]] of Jerusalem had no power to order anyone's execution, but had to get a warrant from the occupying Roman authority.
|-
|34
|And they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.
|They will mock Him, whip Him, spit on Him, and murder Him; yet on the third day He shall rise to life again."
|
|-
|35
|And James and John, the sons of Zebedee, come unto him, saying, Master, we would that thou shouldest do for us whatsoever we shall desire.
|Then James and John, Zebedee's sons, approached Jesus to say, "Teacher, could we ask you for a favor?"
|
|-
|36
|And he said unto them, What would ye that I should do for you?
|Jesus replied, "What would you like?"
|
|-
|37
|They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
|They requested, "Give us the highest seats of honor in your glory, with one of us at your right hand and the other at your left!"
|
|-
|38
|But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
|But Jesus replied to them, "You don't know what you're asking. Can you drink the same cup as I, and accept the same baptism that I will endure?"
|
|-
|39
|And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
|They replied, "Sure we can." Jesus then told them, "You will drink same cup as I, and be baptized as I will."
|seems a bit awkward, could be improved
|-
|40
|But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
|Alas, the seats on my left and right hands are not for me to distribute. They are destined for others, and will be given to them.
|
|-
|41
|And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
|The other ten students grew indignant with James and John when they heard this.
|
|-
|42
|But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
|Jesus gathered them together and said, "You know that those who rule over the Gentiles rule like lords over them, and those with great titles exercise authority over them.
|
|-
|43
|But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
|It will be different for you. Anyone who wants to be great among you will first have to wait on you.
|Differentiate the truly "great" followers with the so-called "great" of the Gentiles
|-
|44
|And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
|"Whoever has first rank will be the servant of all others."
|The Greek word actually translates "slave." More to the point, this is the basis of the term ''servant leader'' that is the ideal in Christian ministry.
|-
|45
|For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
|"Because even I, the Son of Man, did not come to be waited on, but to wait on others, and give My life as payment for the souls of all."
|
|-
|46
|And they came to Jericho: and as he went out of Jericho with his disciples and a great number of people, blind Bartimaeus, the son of Timaeus, sat by the highway side begging.
|They reached [[Jericho]]. As Jesus and His students emerged from the city, followed by a large crowd of people, they saw a blind man named Bartimaeus son of Timaeus begging by the side of the road.
|Making clear to today's reader that Jericho was a city.
|-
|47
|And when he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to cry out, and say, Jesus, thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|When He heard that Jesus of Nazareth was there, he began to shout, "Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me."
|
|-
|48
|And many charged him that he should hold his peace: but he cried the more a great deal, Thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|Others told him to shut up, but he only shouted louder, "You, Son of David, have mercy on me!"
|
|-
|49
|And Jesus stood still, and commanded him to be called. And they call the blind man, saying unto him, Be of good comfort, rise; he calleth thee.
|Jesus stopped in His tracks, asking that he be called over. Followers then welcomed the blind man, telling him, "Take heart and get up; He's calling you."
|
|-
|50
|And he, casting away his garment, rose, and came to Jesus.
|Arising, the man threw off his coat and came to Jesus.
|
|-
|51
|And Jesus answered and said unto him, What wilt thou that I should do unto thee? The blind man said unto him, Lord, that I might receive my sight.
|Jesus said to the blind man: "What do you want Me to do for you?" The man replied: "Sir, I want you to make me able to see."
|The original word used was '''Ραββουνι''' (''Rabboni''), an Aramaic word meaning the same thing as ''rabbi'', which can mean "Master" or simply "Sir" as we use it.
|-
|52
|And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.
|Jesus said to him: "Go on your way; you have been healed because of your faith." The man immediately found that he could see, and started to follow Jesus' teachings.
|The Greek phrase '''ο οδος''' (''ho hodos''), translated as "The Way", was a common expression for all the teachings of Jesus.
|}

==Chapter 11==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when they came nigh to Jerusalem, unto Bethphage and Bethany, at the mount of Olives, he sendeth forth two of his disciples,
|They came to Bethphage and Bethany, near Jerusalem at the Mount of Olives. Jesus sent two of His students.
|
|-
|2
|And saith unto them, Go your way into the village over against you: and as soon as ye be entered into it, ye shall find a colt tied, whereon never man sat; loose him, and bring him.
|with these instructions: "Go to the next village ahead. Just within its limits, you'll find a tied up colt, which no man has ever sat upon. Untie him and bring him here.
|
|-
|3
|And if any man say unto you, Why do ye this? say ye that the Lord hath need of him; and straightway he will send him hither.
|If anyone asks you why you're doing so, tell them that the Lord needs the colt, and he will send the colt along at once."
|
|-
|4
|And they went their way, and found the colt tied by the door without in a place where two ways met; and they loose him.
|They went to complete their task, finding the colt tied up at a street crossing and releasing him.
|
|-
|5
|And certain of them that stood there said unto them, What do ye, loosing the colt?
|Some people loitering there asked, "why are you releasing that colt?"
|
|-
|6
|And they said unto them even as Jesus had commanded: and they let them go.
|The disciples said what Jesus had told them to say, and the people let them pass.
|
|-
|7
|And they brought the colt to Jesus, and cast their garments on him; and he sat upon him.
|They returned to Jesus, put their garments on the colt, and Jesus sat on it.
|The KJV uses "him" only because the original Greek word was masculine, not neutral.
|-
|8
|And many spread their garments in the way: and others cut down branches off the trees, and strawed them in the way.
|Lots of people put their clothes on Jesus' path, while others cut palm branches down and placed them on the path.
|
|-
|9
|And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
|And all the people along the route sang "Hosanna! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord!
|In fact, this is a direct Greek translation of the Hebrew idiomatic phrase that means, "Welcome!" The word used for "blessed" here means "spoken well of" rather than "not-cut-off" as was quoted by Matthew and Luke at the Sermon on the Mount.

The word ''Hosanna'' is [[Aramaic]] for "Save, I pray."
|-
|10
|Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest.
|"Blessed is the kingdom of David, our father, which comes in the name of the Lord, Hosanna in the highest."
|In other words, "Welcome to King David's kingdom."
|-
|11
|And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.
|Jesus entered Jerusalem and went into the temple, and when he had seen everything and it was evening, went to Bethany with the Twelve apostles.
|
|-
|12
|And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
|Leaving Bethany the following day, he was hungry.
|
|-
|13
|And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
|He saw a fig tree in the distance, which had leafed, and went to see if there was fruit upon it. But there was nothing but leaves, for the fig season hadn't begun.
|
|-
|14
|And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.
|Jesus declared a parable in the hearing of His students, "no man will eat your fruit evermore."
|
|-
|15
|And they come to Jerusalem: and Jesus went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves;
|They entered Jerusalem and Jesus entered the [[Temple of Jerusalem|Temple]]. He threw out the vendors and toppled the moneychangers' tables and dove-sellers' seats.
|
|-
|16
|And would not suffer that any man should carry any vessel through the temple.
|He would not let any man carry their wares through the temple.
|The spectacle of the commercialization of the Temple, carried out as it had been under the Pharisees' noses, stood as further indictment of their hypocrisy.
|-
|17
|And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves.
|He then taught the true doctrine: "Isn't it written that My house will be the house of prayer for all people? But you have turned it into a den of robbers."
|
|-
|18
|And the scribes and chief priests heard it, and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.
|The scribes and leading priests heard about this and conspired to destroy him, fearing him and the people who were amazed by his teaching.
|
|-
|19
|And when even was come, he went out of the city.
|In the evening, Jesus left the city.
|
|-
|20
|And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
|In the morning, they passed a fig tree which had dried from the roots up.
|
|-
|21
|And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
|Peter remembered what Jesus had said, and declared, "Master, look! The fig tree you condemned has withered away!"
|
|-
|22
|And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
|Jesus then provided the answer, "Have faith in God.
|
|-
|23
|For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
|I tell you the truth. Anyone who says to a mountain, 'move out of my way and jump into the sea,' and has no doubts in his soul but believes it will come to pass, that man's words will become true.
|This is the origin of the phrase "faith that can move mountains."
|-
|24
|Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
|So I tell you, if you pray for whatever you desire, and believe that you'll receieve it, you will.
|
|-
|25
|And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
|And when you're praying, forgive anyone that you have anything against, so that your father God in heaven will forgive you your sins as well."
|
|-
|26
|But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.
|"If you don't forgive, God your heavenly father will not forgive you."
|The provenance of this verse is disputed. It is consistent with verse 25 above, but also redundant.
|-
|27
|And they come again to Jerusalem: and as he was walking in the temple, there come to him the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders,
|When they returned to Jerusalem, the leading priests, scribes, and elders came to Him as He was walking in the Temple.
|
|-
|28
|And say unto him, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority to do these things?
|And they asked him "Who gave you the authority to do these things?"
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, I will also ask of you one question, and answer me, and I will tell you by what authority I do these things.
|Jesus replied, "If you will answer one question, I'll tell you by whose authority I do these things.
|
|-
|30
|The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men? answer me.
|Tell me. Did John's baptism come from Heaven, or from men?"
|
|-
|31
|And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then did ye not believe him?
|They debated with each other, "If we say 'from heaven,' then He will reply, 'Then why didn't you believe him?'
|
|-
|32
|But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed.
|But if we say, 'of men,...!'" In fact they were afraid of the people because everyone considered John a true prophet.
|
|-
|33
|And they answered and said unto Jesus, We cannot tell. And Jesus answering saith unto them, Neither do I tell you by what authority I do these things.
|So they replied to Jesus, "We don't know." And Jesus responded, "Neither do I reveal to you My authority for my deeds."
|By saying that they didn't know, the elites copped out, as Jesus knew they would.
|}

==Chapter 12==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he began to speak unto them by parables. A certain man planted a vineyard, and set an hedge about it, and digged a place for the winefat, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country.
|Jesus began to teach them parables. "A businessman planted a vineyard and placed a hedge around it. He dug a place for the windpress, built a tower, rented it to tenant vinedressers, and traveled abroad.
|The literal Greek word is '''γεωργος''' or ''georgos'', from which comes the name '''Γεωργιος''' or ''Georgios'', the name of several [[saint]]s who doubtless had "workmanlike" dispositions. It might also be the origin of the expression, "Let George do it!"
|-
|2
|And at the season he sent to the husbandmen a servant, that he might receive from the husbandmen of the fruit of the vineyard.
|When the grape season arrived, he sent one of his slaves to them, to return with the fruit of the vineyard.
|A slave in those days actually held a position of greater honor than one might at first suppose, depending on the nature and disposition of his owner.
|-
|3
|And they caught him, and beat him, and sent him away empty.
|But they caught him, beat him, and sent him back empty-handed.
|
|-
|4
|And again he sent unto them another servant; and at him they cast stones, and wounded him in the head, and sent him away shamefully handled.
|So the owner sent another slave, but they threw stones at him, wounding him in the head. He too was rebuffed, badly treated.
|These are direct metaphors for the maltreatment of the [[prophet]]s.
|-
|5
|And again he sent another; and him they killed, and many others; beating some, and killing some.
|He sent a third, and they killed him, as well as many others. They beat some, killed some.
|
|-
|6
|Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
|He still had a son, whom he loved, and sent him to them last, thinking they would respect his son.
|
|-
|7
|But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
|But the tenants plotted with each other: 'This is his heir. If we kill him, we can take the inheritance.'
|
|-
|8
|And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
|So they killed him and left his body outside the vineyard.
|A direct metaphor for what will shortly happen to Jesus.
|-
|9
|What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others.
|So what should the vineyard owner do? He will return to annihilate the tenants and give the vineyard to other, more honest tenants.
|Clarification of "others"
|-
|10
|And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
|Have you not read in the scripture, 'The stone rejected by the builders becomes the cornerstone,
|
|-
|11
|This was the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
|This is the Lord's way, and it is wonderful to see'?"
|
|-
|12
|And they sought to lay hold on him, but feared the people: for they knew that he had spoken the parable against them: and they left him, and went their way.
|Furious, the intellectual classes wanted to seize him, but feared the public; they knew this parable was directed at them. They gave up for now and walked out.
|
|-
|13
|And they send unto him certain of the Pharisees and of the Herodians, to catch him in his words.
|Instead they chose a group of Pharisees and Herodians, and sent them to Jesus to try and catch Him out by using His own words against Him.
|The Herodians were political partisans of [[Herod Antipas]] within Jewish society.
|-
|14
|And when they were come, they say unto him, Master, we know that thou art true, and carest for no man: for thou regardest not the person of men, but teachest the way of God in truth: Is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not?
|When they came, they said to Him, "Teacher, we know that You are true, and play no favorites among men. You are no Respecter of persons, but teach the Way of God in truth. Now: is it lawful to pay capitation [[tax]]es to Caesar, or not?
|Literally, '''κηνσος''' or ''kensos'', a transliteration of the Latin ''census''. This was a head tax collected at the census. [[Joseph of Nazareth]] and his wife [[Mary]] had to pay such a tax.
|-
|15
|Shall we give, or shall we not give? But he, knowing their hypocrisy, said unto them, Why tempt ye me? bring me a penny, that I may see it.
|"What do we do: give, nor not?" But He, knowing full well how hypocritical they were, said to them, "Why are you always testing Me? Bring me a shilling, so that I may examine it."
|The "shilling" was a Roman denarius, worth one day's wages, and also the standard tax rate.
|-
|16
|And they brought it. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? And they said unto him, Caesar's.
|They brought one. He said to them, "Whose face and epigram is this?" They told him, "Caesar's."
|
|-
|17
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him.
|In answer, Jesus told them, "Give Caesar what is Caesar's, and God what is God's." And they were struck completely speechless by Him.
|
|-
|18
|Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,
|Then some Sadducees came to Him. They say that there is no such thing as the resurrection. They asked Him,
|The Sadducees, followers of one Zadok, discounted anything "mystical" or miraculous in the [[Bible]]. Today, they would probably be [[evolutionism|evolutionists]].
|-
|19
|Master, Moses wrote unto us, If a man's brother die, and leave his wife behind him, and leave no children, that his brother should take his wife, and raise up seed unto his brother.
|"Teacher, Moses wrote this law: 'If a man's brother dies, and leaves a wife but no children, his brother must marry the widow and raise up a son to inherit his brother's estate.'
|The Levirate Law.
|-
|20
|Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed.
|Now there were seven brothers. The first married a wife, and died without issue.
|
|-
|21
|And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise.
|Then the second married her, then died, and also left no issue. So did the third.
|
|-
|22
|And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also.
|Indeed all seven married her, and left no issue. Last of all the woman died.
|
|-
|23
|In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
|Now: in the resurrection, when they're all risen from the dead, whose wife will she be? After all, all seven married her!"
|This Levirate Riddle is quite similar to the [[Logical fallacy|logically fallacious]] arguments that evolutionists raise against [[creationism|creationists]] today.
|-
|24
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
|Jesus replied, "You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God.
|
|-
|25
|For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
|You see, when they rise from the dead, they will neither marry nor be given in marriage. They'll be like God's Messengers in heaven.
|Meaning, the [[angels]]. Here is a declaration that angels do not procreate, nor will resurrected people be in a position to repopulate the earth after the War of Armageddon (see Revelation 19).
|-
|26
|And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
|And while we're on the subject: I'll prove to you that the dead will rise. Haven't you read in the Books of Moses, how God spoke to him in a burning bush, saying, 'I am the God of [[Abraham]], and the God of [[Isaac]], and the God of [[Jacob]]?'
|
|-
|27
|He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
|He isn't the God of dead men, but the God of living men. So you are vastly mistaken."
|
|-
|28
|And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
|One of the scribes came, who had heard them debating this issue, and realizing that He had given a good answer to the riddle. So he asked Him, "Which is the most important commandment of all?"
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
|Jesus replied, "The most important commandment is, "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is One."
|A direct quote from the [[Septuagint]].
|-
|30
|And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
|And you will love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and all your mind, and all your strength. This is the most important commandment.
|
|-
|31
|And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
|The second most important commandment is just like it: you shall love your neighbor as you love yourself. No other commandment is more important than these two."
|
|-
|32
|And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
|The scribe said back to Him, "Well, Teacher, You speak the truth: 'There is one God, and there is no one else but Him,
|
|-
|33
|And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
|and to love Him with all the heart, soul, mind, and strength, and to love one's neighbor as one loves himself, is more important than all the burnt offerings and sacrifices a man can make.'"
|
|-
|34
|And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
|Jesus saw that he had given a sensible answer. So He said to him, "You aren't far from the Kingdom of God." After that, no man dared ask Him anything.
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the Son of David?
|Jesus said in answer, while He was teaching in the Temple, "How can the scribes say that Christ is the Son of [[David]]?
|
|-
|36
|For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
|After all, David himself said, under the influence of the Divine Guide, 'The LORD said to my Lord, "Sit on My right hand, until I make Your enemies something to put Your feet on."'
|
|-
|37
|David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
|So David himself calls Him Lord. So how can He be his son?" And many people were glad to hear this.
|
|-
|38
|And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,
|In His lessons He told them, "Watch out for the scribes. They want to go about in long clothing, and want people to greet them in the public square.
|
|-
|39
|And the chief seats in the synagogues, and the uppermost rooms at feasts:
|They want the seats of honor in the synagogues, and the ranking dining rooms at banquets.
|
|-
|40
|Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.
|And they also devour widows' homes, and put up a pretense by making long prayers. They will receive an even greater punishment."
|
|-
|41
|And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much.
|Jesus was sitting next to the treasury, and watched how people threw money into the treasury. Many rich people threw in a lot of money.
|
|-
|42
|And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing.
|Then came a certain poor widow, who threw in two mites, which together were worth a quarter-penny.
|The "mite" is the '''λεπτον''' (''lepton''), a [[copper]] coin of very low value. Two leptons made a '''κοδραντον''' (''kodranton'') or Roman quadrant. Four quadrants made an assarion (the "penny" of the day), and ten assaria made a denarius ("shilling").
|-
|43
|And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
|He called His students to Him, and told them, "I tell you truly: This poor widow has thrown in more money than everyone else combined.
|
|-
|44
|For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.
|All they did was to throw in a sample of their abundance. She, in her poverty, threw in everything she had, even everything she had to live on."
|
|}

==Chapter 13==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
|As they left the temple, one of Jesus' students said, "Teacher, just look at the sort of stones and magnificient buildings in this place!"
|
|-
|2
|And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
|Jesus responded, "See these grand buildings? Not one stone will remain atop another which will not be destroyed."
|The future Emperor Titus would bring about that destruction in AD 70.
|-
|3
|And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
|As Jesus sat atop the Mount of Olives, looking at the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew requested a private conference. They asked,
|
|-
|4
|Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
|"When will these events take place, and what will be the sign of their fulfillment?"
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:
|Jesus answered them, "Be on guard and don't let any man fool you.
|
|-
|6
|For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
|Many will come shouting My Name and say 'I am Christ!', and will fool many people.
|
|-
|7
|And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
|When you hear news of war and false rumor about them, don't worry, because they must occur but will not be the end.
|
|-
|8
|For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
|Ethnic groups and nation-states will attack one another. Earthquakes will occur in many lands. Famine and chaos will rule. These are the beginnings of the birth-pains.
|
|-
|9
|But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
|So take care of yourselves. The masses will hand you over to the tribunals, you will be beaten in houses of worship, and be hauled before leaders and kings for My sake, to testify against them.
|
|-
|10
|And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
|The good news has to be published among all ethnic groups first.
|
|-
|11
|But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
|But when they drag you in or betray you, do not worry about what to say. In that hour, you will be given the words to say, because the Divine Guide will be speaking for you and through you.
|
|-
|12
|Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
|Brother will betray brother to his death, father to son, children will rebel against their parents, and shall sign their death warrants.
|
|-
|13
|And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
|And you will be hated by every man on account of My Name, but you will be saved if you endure to the end.
|
|-
|14
|But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
|And when you see the Abomination of Desolation standing where it shouldn't - let the reader understand - then everyone living in Judea must flee into the mountains.
|The phrase "spoken of by Daniel the prophet" does not appear here, though Matthew and Luke both use it.
|-"let the reader understand" - ho anaginoskon is "the [one] reading", or the reader; compare Revelation 1:3
|15
|And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
|If you're standing on the housetop, don't go down or into the house to take anything out.
|
|-
|16
|And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
|If you're in the field, don't turn back even to get your cloak.
|
|-
|17
|But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
|And it will be bad for pregnant and nursing women in those days!
|
|-
|18
|And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
|And pray that you don't have to flee in the wintertime.
|
|-
|19
|For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
|In those days you will see such oppression as has not been seen from the beginning of God's creation until today, nor will ever be seen again.
|
|-
|20
|And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
|If the Lord hadn't limited those days, no flesh would survive. But for the sake of His chosen ones, He has set a limit on the time.
|
|-
|21
|And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
|And then if any man tells you, 'Look! Here's Christ!' or 'Look! There He is!', don't believe him.
|
|-
|22
|For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
|False Christs and false prophets will rise up, working enough signs and wonders to lead even the chosen ones down the garden trail, if that were possible.
|
|-
|23
|But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
|But you look sharp: I have forewarned you about everything.
|
|-
|24
|But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
|"But in those days that follow that oppression, the [[sun]] will go dark, and the [[moon]] not give her light,
|The Greek word '''φεγγος''' (''phengos'') means a secondary or reflected light, in contrast to '''φως''' (''phos''), which means primary light.
|-
|25
|And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
|The stars of the sky will fall, and the powers in heaven will be shaken.
|The "falling stars" are likely [[meteor]]s.
|-
|26
|And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
|Then people shall see 'the Son of man coming in the clouds' with great power and glory.
|
|-
|27
|And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
|Then He will send His Messengers, and will gather his chosen ones together from the four winds, from the furthest part of the earth to the furthest part of the sky.
|
|-
|28
|Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
|You can learn a great deal from the fig tree: when its branch is still tender, and it's putting out leaves, you know that summer is coming.
|The [[KJV]] uses "her" because the Greek word for a fig tree is feminine.
|-
|29
|So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
|Similarly, when you see these things happening, you know that My return is practically at your door.
|
|-
|30
|Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
|I tell you truly: this generation will not pass away until all these things happen.
|
|-
|31
|Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
|Heaven and earth might pass away, but My Words will not pass away.
|
|-
|32
|But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
|But no man knows about that day or that hour. Even the Messengers in heaven don't know. I, the Son, don't know. Only the Father knows.
|
|-
|33
|Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
|Take care and stay alert, because you don't know what time it is.
|Some manuscripts say "watch and pray."
|-
|34
|For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
|The Son of man is like a man traveling abroad, who left his house, and gave his slaves the proper authority, and a work assignment to every man, and ordered the doorkeeper to keep watch.
|
|-
|35
|Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
|So you keep watch. You don't know when the master of the house is coming. He could come in the evening, or at midnight, or when the rooster crows, or later in the morning.
|
|-
|36
|Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
|Don't let Him catch you napping!
|
|-
|37
|And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
|I'm telling you what I'm telling everyone: stay on watch."
|
|}

==Chapter 14==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After two days was the feast of the passover, and of unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to death.
|Two days later, it was time for the the Passover holiday of unleavened bread, and the leading priests and scribes were trying to figure out how to catch Him by stealth and have Him executed.
|
|-
|2
|But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar of the people.
|But they said, "Not on the day of the festival! Do you want to have a riot among the people?"
|
|-
|3
|And being in Bethany in the house of Simon the leper, as he sat at meat, there came a woman having an alabaster box of ointment of spikenard very precious; and she brake the box, and poured it on his head.
|At that time, he was in Bethany at Simon the leper's house, having a meal. A woman came in with an expensive white crystal container of valerian oil, which she opened and poured over his head.
|
|-
|4
|And there were some that had indignation within themselves, and said, Why was this waste of the ointment made?
|Some of the onlookers were indignant, saying "Why did she waste that nice oil like that?
|
|-
|5
|For it might have been sold for more than three hundred pence, and have been given to the poor. And they murmured against her.
|We could have sold that for more than three hundred shillings and charitably donated the money to the poor!" They kept whispering about what a bad thing she had done.
|This oil was expensive indeed: a day's wages for three hundred men.
|-
|6
|And Jesus said, Let her alone; why trouble ye her? she hath wrought a good work on me.
|But Jesus said, "Leave her alone; why are you bothering her? She had done Me a favor.
|
|-
|7
|For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.
|There will always be poor people around, and whenever you feel like helping them you can, but I am not going to be around forever.
|
|-
|8
|She hath done what she could: she is come aforehand to anoint my body to the burying.
|She did what she could: She came in advance to get my body ready for burial.
|
|-
|9
|Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached throughout the whole world, this also that she hath done shall be spoken of for a memorial of her.
|Truly I tell you: Anywhere in the world that people preach the good news about me, they are also going to remember what she did and talk about it."
|
|-
|10
|And Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve, went unto the chief priests, to betray him unto them.
|After that, Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve apostles, went to betray Jesus to the leading priests,
|
|-
|11
|And when they heard it, they were glad, and promised to give him money. And he sought how he might conveniently betray him.
|who were happy to hear it and offered to pay him. So Judas thought about how it would be best to do the deed, and the best time to do it.
|
|-
|12
|And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?
|So on the first day of the Passover holiday, after they killed the lamb, the students of Jesus said to him, "Where do you want us to go and get this lamb ready for you to eat?"
|
|-
|13
|And he sendeth forth two of his disciples, and saith unto them, Go ye into the city, and there shall meet you a man bearing a pitcher of water: follow him.
|He answered by sending two of the students to go to town. He told them, "Go into the city, and you'll find a man carrying a pitcher of water. Follow him.
|
|-
|14
|And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
|When he goes into a house, tell the man in charge, 'Our teacher wants to know where the guestroom is, so we can eat our lamb.'
|The Greek '''καταλυμα''' means "upper room." Any homeowner kept this upper room, the best room in the house, for his guests.
|-
|15
|And he will shew you a large upper room furnished and prepared: there make ready for us.
|He will show you a large room on the second floor, furnished and already prepared. Prepare for us there."
|
|-
|16
|And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
|So the students went into town, and it happened exactly like he had told them, so they got the lamb ready to eat.
|
|-
|17
|And in the evening he cometh with the twelve.
|That evening, Jesus and the Twelve arrived.
|
|-
|18
|And as they sat and did eat, Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, One of you which eateth with me shall betray me.
|While they were sitting and eating, Jesus said, "Truly I tell you, one of you who is eating with Me here will betray Me."
|
|-
|19
|And they began to be sorrowful, and to say unto him one by one, Is it I? and another said, Is it I?
|They became very upset, and one after another said, "You don't mean me, do You?" "It's not I, is it?"
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto them, It is one of the twelve, that dippeth with me in the dish.
|Jesus told them, "It is one of you - the one who dips his bread in the bowl with me.
|
|-
|21
|The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born.
|The Son of man will die as the Scriptures said, but as for the man who betrays the Son of man, he would have been better off if he had never been born."
|
|-
|22
|And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.
|And while they were eating, Jesus took the bread, blessed it, broke it, and distributed it, saying "Take this and eat it. This is My body."
|
|-
|23
|And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
|And He took the cup, said a prayer, and passed it around, and everybody drank some.
|
|-
|24
|And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
|Then he said to them, "This is My blood of the New Testament, which I bled for the sake of many people.
|
|-
|25
|Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.
|Truly I say to you, I shall not drink wine again until the day I drink it anew in the kingdom of God."
|Again, the "wine" of those days was not fermented.
|-
|26
|And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.
|Then, after they had sung a hymn, they went out into the Mount of Olives,
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.
|where Jesus told them, "All of you are going to have doubts about Me tonight. It is prophesied,
'I will kill the shepherd, and then the sheep will be scattered.'
|
|-
|28
|But after that I am risen, I will go before you into Galilee.
|But I shall rise and I shall go into Galilee before you."
|
|-
|29
|But Peter said unto him, Although all shall be offended, yet will not I.
|But Peter said, "Even if everyone doubts You, I never will."
|
|-
|30
|And Jesus saith unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this day, even in this night, before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice.
|And Jesus said to him, "Hear me when I say that tonight, before the rooster crows twice, you are going to disavow Me three times."
|
|-
|31
|But he spake the more vehemently, If I should die with thee, I will not deny thee in any wise. Likewise also said they all.
|But Peter protested, with agitation, "Even if I end up having to die with you, I'll never disavow you." Everyone chimed in to say the same.
|
|-
|32
|And they came to a place which was named Gethsemane: and he saith to his disciples, Sit ye here, while I shall pray.
|By now, they were at a place called Gethsemane. Jesus told his disciples, "Take a seat here, everyone. I want to pray."
|
|-
|33
|And he taketh with him Peter and James and John, and began to be sore amazed, and to be very heavy;
|Then he went away from them, taking Peter, James, and John, and he became very upset and distressed.
|
|-
|34
|And saith unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful unto death: tarry ye here, and watch.
|He said to them, "My soul is dying of sadness. Stay here and keep your eyes open."
|
|-
|35
|And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him.
|He wandered away a little, and fell to the ground. He prayed that if there were any possible way, he wouldn't have to go through what was to come.
|
|-
|36
|And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.
|He said, "Oh Father, anything is possible for you. I don't want this fate. Take it away. But let it be what you want, not what I want."
|He used the Hebrew word ''abba'', which is the equivalent of "Daddy."
|-
|37
|And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping, and saith unto Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? couldest not thou watch one hour?
|When he came back and found His students sleeping, he said to Peter, "Simon are you sleeping? Couldn't you keep your eyes open for an hour?
|
|-
|38
|Watch ye and pray, lest ye enter into temptation. The spirit truly is ready, but the flesh is weak.
|Keep them open and pray, or else you might fail the test. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
|
|-
|39
|And again he went away, and prayed, and spake the same words.
|Again, he went away and prayed, and he said the same thing again.
|
|-
|40
|And when he returned, he found them asleep again, (for their eyes were heavy,) neither wist they what to answer him.
|When he got back, he found them asleep again (they were really tired), and they had no idea how to answer him.
|
|-
|41
|And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: it is enough, the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|The third time he came back, he told them, "Just sleep now. I have prayed enough, and the time has come for the Son of man to be betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|
|-
|42
|Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.
|Get up, we must go. Look, the betrayer is here."
|
|-
|43
|And immediately, while he yet spake, cometh Judas, one of the twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and staves, from the chief priests and the scribes and the elders.
|And just as he was saying that, Judas came in, along with a lot of armed people, from among the leading priests, scribes, and elders.
|
|-
|44
|And he that betrayed him had given them a token, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he; take him, and lead him away safely.
|The betrayer had made an arrangement with them: "The man I kiss is the man you want. Take him and keep him safe."
|
|-
|45
|And as soon as he was come, he goeth straightway to him, and saith, Master, master; and kissed him.
|And as soon as he was there, he went directly to Jesus, saying "Rabbi! Rabbi!" and kissed him.
|
|-
|46
|And they laid their hands on him, and took him.
|And the armed people grabbed Jesus and took him away.
|
|-
|47
|And one of them that stood by drew a sword, and smote a servant of the high priest, and cut off his ear.
|But one of the men who was standing by drew a sword and struck the high priest's slave, cutting off his ear.
|Luke (but not Matthew or Mark) identifies this one as Peter. The sword used was the '''μαχαιρα''' (''machaira''), or ''gladius'' in [[Latin]]. This short sword was the typical service weapon of a Roman infantryman.
|-
|48
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, Are ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and with staves to take me?
|Jesus said, "Are you coming to get me with your swords and sticks as you would an insurrectionist?
|
|-
|49
|I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.
|I was right there with you, teaching in the temple every single day, and you never came for me then. But the scriptures will have to be fulfilled."
|
|-
|50
|And they all forsook him, and fled.
|Then they all abandoned him and fled.
|
|-
|51
|And there followed him a certain young man, having a linen cloth cast about his naked body; and the young men laid hold on him:
|A young man there following him, with a linen sheet wrapped around his naked body, when he was grabbed by the men.
|While it is likely this boy was Mark, the author, the original text uses the third person.
|-
|52
|And he left the linen cloth, and fled from them naked.
|He ran away naked, leaving the sheet behind.
|
|-
|53
|And they led Jesus away to the high priest: and with him were assembled all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes.
|Then the armed men took Jesus to the [[High Priest]], and all the leading priests, elders, and scribes were assembled there.
|This was the midnight meeting of the [[Sanhedrin]].
|-
|54
|And Peter followed him afar off, even into the palace of the high priest: and he sat with the servants, and warmed himself at the fire.
|Peter followed from a distance, all the way into the High Priest's palace, and he sat down at the fire with the attendants to keep warm.
|
|-
|55
|And the chief priests and all the council sought for witness against Jesus to put him to death; and found none.
|The leading priests and the rest of the [[Sanhedrin]] asked for testimony against Jesus so they could put him to death, but found none.
|
|-
|56
|For many bare false witness against him, but their witness agreed not together.
|There was much false testimony, and the witnesses contradicted each other.
|
|-
|57
|And there arose certain, and bare false witness against him, saying,
|Then certain particularly deceitful witnesses said,
|
|-
|58
|We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.
|"We heard Him say, 'I will destroy this handmade temple, and within three days I will build another without using My hands."
|
|-
|59
|But neither so did their witness agree together.
|But these witnesses also contradicted each other.
|
|-
|60
|And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
|The High Priest stood up and asked Jesus, "Do you have nothing to say? Just what are they saying about you?"
|
|-
|61
|But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
|Jesus kept silent. The High Priest started interrogating him again: "Are you the Christ, the Son of the blessed?"
|
|-
|62
|And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
|Jesus answered, saying "I am, and you all are going to see the Son of man sitting at the right hand side of power and coming in the clouds of heaven."
|
|-
|63
|Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
|The High Priest ripped his shirt down the middle, saying "We don't need any more witnesses!
|This ritual tearing of the shirt was a sign of deep mourning and indignation. But in fact the High Priest violated a regulation governing his own conduct when he did this.
|-
|64
|Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
|You all heard the blasphemy, now how do you vote?" And they all condemned him to death.
|
|-
|65
|And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.
|Some of them spat on him. They put a bag over his head and punched him. They taunted him, "Tell us the future, Prophet!", and the attendants slapped him.
|Capitalized on account of Who He is, not on account of what the Sanhedrin members and their attendants thought He was.

Some manuscripts say that they said in effect, "Who hit You? Guess!"
|-
|66
|And as Peter was beneath in the palace, there cometh one of the maids of the high priest:
|Meanwhile, Peter was downstairs in the palace, when one of the high priest's maids came by.
|
|-
|67
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked upon him, and said, And thou also wast with Jesus of Nazareth.
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, "You were with Jesus of Nazareth."
|
|-
|68
|But he denied, saying, I know not, neither understand I what thou sayest. And he went out into the porch; and the cock crew.
|He denied it, saying, "I do not know what you are talking about." And as he went out to the porch, the rooster crowed.
|
|-
|69
|And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them.
|And another maid saw him, and said to the bystanders, "This is one of them."
|
|-
|70
|And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto.
|But he denied it again. And again the bystanders said to Peter, "Surely, you are one of them, for your accent is Galilean."
|
|-
|71
|But he began to curse and to swear, saying, I know not this man of whom ye speak.
|But he began to swear, saying, "I do not know the man you speak of."
|
|-
|72
|And the second time the cock crew. And Peter called to mind the word that Jesus said unto him, Before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice. And when he thought thereon, he wept.
|And the cock crowed for the second time. Peter recalled what Jesus had told him, "Before the cock crows twice, you will deny Me three times." And he wept at the thought.
|
|}

==Chapter 15==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And straightway in the morning the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council, and bound Jesus, and carried him away, and delivered him to Pilate.
|In the morning the high priests held an urgent consultations with the elders and scribes, and the full membership of the [[Sanhedrin]], and decided to take Jesus to Pontius Pilate.
|
|-
|2
|And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto him, Thou sayest it.
|Pilate asked Him, "Are you the King of the Jews?" And in answer He said, "You say that."
|
|-
|3
|And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.
|And the leading priests accused Him of many things, but He did not answer.
|
|-
|4
|And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.
|Pilate asked Him again, "Have You nothing to say? Look at how many accusations they make against You."
|
|-
|5
|But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.
|But Jesus said nothing, and Pilate was shocked as he had never been shocked before in his career.
|
|-
|6
|Now at that feast he released unto them one prisoner, whomsoever they desired.
|Now at Passover, Pilate always released one prisoner, chosen by the people.
|
|-
|7
|And there was one named Barabbas, which lay bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.
|There was one named Barabbas, who was imprisoned because he had rebelled and committed murder in the rebellion.
|
|-
|8
|And the multitude crying aloud began to desire him to do as he had ever done unto them.
|And the crowds cried aloud, begging Pilate to release a prisoner as he always had.
|
|-
|9
|But Pilate answered them, saying, Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate answered them, saying "Do you wish me to release the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|10
|For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.
|Since he knew the leading priests had brought Jesus to him out of envy of His popularity.
|
|-
|11
|But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.
|But the leading priests influenced the people to request the release of Barabbas.
|
|-
|12
|And Pilate answered and said again unto them, What will ye then that I shall do unto him whom ye call the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate said to the crowds, "What, then, do you wish me to do to the Man you call the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|13
|And they cried out again, Crucify him.
|And the crowds cried out, "Crucify Him."
|
|-
|14
|Then Pilate said unto them, Why, what evil hath he done? And they cried out the more exceedingly, Crucify him.
|So Pilate said to them, "Why? What has he done wrong?" And they cried out louder, "Crucify Him!"
|
|-
|15
|And so Pilate, willing to content the people, released Barabbas unto them, and delivered Jesus, when he had scourged him, to be crucified.
|So Pilate, to keep the people content, released Barabbas to them, and had Jesus scourged and sent to be crucified.
|
|-
|16
|And the soldiers led him away into the hall, called Praetorium; and they call together the whole band.
|The soldiers then took Him into the garrison barracks (the Praetorium) and summoned the entire garrison.
|
|-
|17
|And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,
|They dressed Him in purple and made a wreath of thorns, which they stuck on His head.
|
|-
|18
|And began to salute him, Hail, King of the Jews!
|They then began to deliver mocking salutes: "Hail, King of the Jews!"
|
|-
|19
|And they smote him on the head with a reed, and did spit upon him, and bowing their knees worshipped him.
|They beat His head with a stick and spat on Him, and genuflected in mock worship of Him.
|The Greek words clearly say that the soldiers bowed the knee to Him.
|-
|20
|And when they had mocked him, they took off the purple from him, and put his own clothes on him, and led him out to crucify him.
|After mocking Him, they stripped Him of the purple robe, dressed Him in His own clothes, and led Him out to crucify Him.
|
|-
|21
|And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross.
|They forced a man named Simon, a Cyrenian, father of Alexander and Rufus, who was then coming out of the field, to carry His cross.
|
|-
|22
|And they bring him unto the place Golgotha, which is, being interpreted, The place of a skull.
|They brought Him to the place called Golgotha, or "Skull Hill."
|
|-
|23
|And they gave him to drink wine mingled with myrrh: but he received it not.
|They gave Him grape juice mixed with myrrh to drink, but He refused it.
|
|-
|24
|And when they had crucified him, they parted his garments, casting lots upon them, what every man should take.
|When they had crucified Him, they divided His clothes among them by gambling for it.
|use the modern term of "gambling" here; see [[Bible on Addiction]]
|-
|25
|And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
|They crucified Him on the third hour of the day.
|
|-
|26
|And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS.
|The epigram of his accusation was written over His head: THE KING OF THE JEWS.
|
|-
|27
|And with him they crucify two thieves; the one on his right hand, and the other on his left.
|They also crucified two robbers with Him, one on His right and the other on His left.
|
|-
|28
|And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors.
|With this deed the Scripture was fulfilled, which said, "And He was counted along with the lawless."
|The provenance of this verse is in dispute.
|-
|29
|And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days,
|The passersby railed at him, wagging their heads. They said, "Hey, You! You said You could destroy the Temple and rebuild it in three days.
|
|-
|30
|Save thyself, and come down from the cross.
|So save Yourself and come down from the cross!"
|
|-
|31
|Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.
|In the same way the leading priests, in a mocking tone, said to themselves with the scribes, "He saved others, but can't save Himself.
|
|-
|32
|Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.
|Let Christ the King of [[Israel]] come down now from the cross! Seeing is believing!" And the men being crucified with Him also insulted Him.
|
|-
|33
|And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
|When the sixth hour arrived, darkness fell over the whole country until the ninth hour.
|This period lasted from noon to three p.m.
|-
|34
|And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
|At the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, ''"Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachthani?"'' (Translation: "My God, My God, why have You abandoned Me?")
|
|-
|35
|And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
|Some of the bystanders, when they heard it, said, "Listen, he's calling [[Elijah]]."
|
|-
|36
|And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
|One of them ran and filled a sponge with vinegar, put it on a stick, and gave it to Him to drink. Others said, "Leave Him alone. Let's see whether Elijah will come to take Him down."
|
|-
|37
|And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
|Jesus shouted something with a loud voice, and breathed his last.
|Literally, "gave up the breath."
|-
|38
|And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.
|Then the veil of the Temple was torn in two from top to bottom.
|
|-
|39
|And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
|When the centurion, who stood next to Him, saw Him cry out and heave his death-sigh, he said, "Truly this Man was the Son of God."
|Here and elsewhere, Mark uses the word '''κεντυριων''', which is "centurion" transliterated into Greek. Luke and the others always use the word '''εκατονταρχος''' (''hekatontarchos''), literally, "leader of a hundred."
|-
|40
|There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;
|Some women were also watching from a distance, including Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joseph, and Salome.
|This is ''not'' the little girl who asked for the head of [[John the Baptist]] on a plate! The name of that little girl will probably never be known, nor will anyone know how the name ''Salome'' was given to that character in various [[Hollywood]] treatments.
|-
|41
|(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
|These women had followed Him while He was in Galilee, and used to wait on Him. With them were many other women who had followed Him to Jerusalem.
|The Greek phrase is "came up," a reference to Jerusalem's elevation of 800 meters, higher than that of the surrounding countryside.
|-
|42
|And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,
|Now in the evening, because it was preparation time, i.e. the day before the Sabbath,
|
|-
|43
|Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counseller, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
|Joseph of Arimathea, an honorable member of the council, who was also waiting for the Kingdom of God, came forward, went in boldly to Pilate, and claimed the body of Jesus.
|
|-
|44
|And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
|Pilate was shocked to hear that He was already dead. He called the centurion to ask him whether He was dead already.
|
|-
|45
|And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
|When the centurion confirmed it, Pilate gave Joseph permission to take possession of the body.
|
|-
|46
|And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
|Joseph then brought fine linen, and took Him down, wrapped Him in the linen, and laid Him in a tomb cut out of rock, and rolled a stone onto the tomb entrance.
|
|-
|47
|And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
|Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph saw the place where He was laid.
|
|}

==Chapter 16==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
|After the sabbath had come and gone, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Salome, bought aromatic spices with which to anoint Jesus' body.
|
|-
|2
|And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
|Very early in the morning on the day after the sabbath, they came to the tomb of Jesus at sunrise.
|
|-
|3
|And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre?
|And the women said to each other, "Who will roll away the stone blocking the tomb door?"
|
|-
|4
|And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.
|But when they looked, they saw that the massive stone had been rolled to the side.
|Neither pronoun nor article appears, but only a verb ending.
|-
|5
|And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
|And as they entered the tomb, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, wearing a long white garment, and they were afraid.
|
|-
|6
|And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.
|The man said to them, "Don't be afraid. You're looking for Jesus of Nazareth, Who was crucified. He has been raised up, He is not here - look at the place where they laid Him.
|
|-
|7
|But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.
|Leave now, and tell Peter and the students of Jesus that He has gone ahead of you into Galilee: you will see him there, as he told you."
|
|-
|8
|And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
|They left quickly and ran away from the tomb, shaking and ecstatic both at once. They were so afraid that they didn't say a word to any man.
|The Gospel According to Mark, strictly speaking, ends here. Mark deliberately left it in an unfinished state. Later copyists added a "closing verse," while others added the remaining verses in this table.<ref>http://www.bible-researcher.com/endmark.html</ref>
|-
|9
|Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
|
|
|-
|10
|And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.
|
|
|-
|11
|And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
|
|
|-
|12
|After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
|
|
|-
|13
|And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
|
|
|-
|15
|And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
|
|
|-
|16
|He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
|
|
|-
|17
|And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
|
|
|-
|18
|They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
|
|
|-
|19
|So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
|
|
|-
|20
|And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
|
|
|}

== References ==

{{reflist|1}}

[[Category:Conservative Bible]]

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-16T15:10:20Z

Danielitld: /* Noah and Utnapishtim */

Talk:Epistle to Philemon (Translated)

2009-11-12T13:28:07Z

Danielitld: /* Peace to fellowlaborers */ new section

Andy, I changed your translation of verse 8 slightly to better synch with verse 9. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 20:01, 28 September 2009 (EDT)

== Peace to fellowlaborers ==

I think its a safe bet that Paul wasn't campaigning for the nationalization of the means of production in the Roman Empire. So concerns that "fellowlaborers" connotes socialism are unfounded. The Greek word sunergos means coworker or "companion in labor", according to Strong's. "Fellowlaborers" actually seems to be a fairly accurate English translation. Instead of worrying about "today's connotations", we might want to delve into what Paul meant by sunergos. In II Timothy 2:15, Paul tells us "Do your best to win full approval in God's sight, as a worker [ergates] who is not ashamed of his work, one who correctly teaches the message of God's truth". (Good News Bible) Strong's defines ergates as a toiler and, figuratively, a teacher. So, I would say, when Paul refers to his "fellowlaborers", he's referring to those, like himself, who toil for and teach God's message. Translating this as "volunteers" hardly conveys the same meaning. Nor does "fellowteachers" render sunergos sufficiently. "Fellowlaborers" seems to be the best.

With the comment that "'peace' today means anti-war", one almost gets the impression that peace is an odious, noxious thing. I never thought I'd have to delve into the meaning of "peace" - eirene - but this comment, along with the one that "'peace of mind' is what is meant" prompted me to look into the matter. According to my dictionary, peace is defined as 1. freedom from war or civil strife; 2. a treaty or agreement to end war; 3. freedom from public disorder; public security. Strong's defines eirene as peace; prosperity; quietness; rest. Its derived from eiro, to join. The Hebrew word shalom - peace, health, prosperity - is derived from shalam, which Strong's defines as: to be safe; to be friendly; to reciprocate. From all this, we see that peace is very much a social issue. One person may have "peace of mind". But such quietness arises from social harmony. Luke, at verse 10:6, quotes Jesus saying that "If a man of peace is there, your peace will rest on him", connoting the social nature of peace. So when Paul talks about peace in Philemon 3, he's doing more than wishing someone "peace of mind".

I think this can be discerned more fully when we look at the whole verse: "Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ". Grace or charis implies graciousness of manner or act, according to Strong's. One can be gracious to oneself. But like shalam, friendliness and reciprocity to others is what is meant. Together, charis and eirene, friendliness, reciprocity and social harmony is Paul's message to his fellowlaborers. - Danielitld

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-11T13:30:15Z

Danielitld: /* Noah and Utnapishtim */ new section

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-10T02:59:07Z

Danielitld: /* Genesis 3:1 */

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-09T21:05:28Z

Danielitld: /* Genesis 3:1 */

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-09T14:13:25Z

Danielitld: /* Genesis 3:1 */ new section

Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-09T13:31:05Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 1==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
|In the beginning, God created the [[heaven]]s and the [[earth]].
|The Hebrew word '''שמים''' (''shamayim'') means "skies" and is in the dual number.
|-
|2
|And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
|The earth was utterly formless and empty. Darkness obscured the deep. The Breath of God moved upon the oceans.
|The earth is like a blank canvas, awaiting the stroke of the Master Artist. The original [[Hebrew]] repeats the concept of formlessness for emphasis.
|-
|3
|And God said, let there be light: and there was light.
|[[God]] commanded, "Light shall exist!" And light came to exist.
|The rare use of the [[Hebrew]] verb '''היה''' (''hayah''), meaning "he existed," emphasizes that the light did not merely exist but ''came'' to exist at God's command.
|-
|4
|And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
|God approved of the light, because it was good. God distinguished between the light and the darkness.
|
|-
|5
|And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
|God named the light Day, and the darkness Night. And evening and morning came: the first day.
|The Hebrew '''יום''' (''yowm'') means "day." In all its uses in the Bible, it most commonly means the solar day with which we are all familiar, i.e. twenty-four hours. The phrase describing "evening and morning coming to exist" confirms this. By [[Judaism|Jewish]] custom and tradition, the day begins at sundown, not midnight.
|-
|6
|And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
|Then God declared, "A great sheet-like expanse shall come between the waters, and it shall divide waters from waters!"
|
|-
|7
|And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
|God made this expanse, and separated the waters underneath the expanse from the waters above the expanse. And so it came to be.
|
|-
|8
|And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
|God called this expanse the sky. And evening and morning came: the second day.
|The ancient Hebrews believed that the sky was in fact a solid object that separated two classes of waters. Some [[creation science|creation scientists]] took this to mean a water-vapor canopy that protected the earth before the [[Great Flood]]. The [[cosmology|cosmologist]] [[John Hartnett]] holds that the expanse is not matter, but is in fact the very fabric of [[space]], stretched out on Day Four (see below) to the limits of the known [[universe]].
|-
|9
|And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
|Then God commanded: "The waters under the sky will come together in one place, and dry ground will appear!" And so it came to be.
|
|-
|10
|And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.
|God named this dry ground [[Earth]], and the collected mass of waters He named Seas. This was good.
|
|-
|11
|And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
|Then God declared, "The earth shall make grass sprout, the plant that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit of its [[baraminology|created kind]], carrying its own seed, to cover the earth!" And so it came to be.
|[[Baraminology]] ([[Hebrew]] '''ברא''' (''bara'') he created and '''מין''' (''min'') a kind, and [[Greek]] '''λογος''' (''logos'') a word) is the attempt to find all the created kinds from which all present [[species]] derive.
|-
|12
|And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
|And the earth produced [[grass]], and herbs yielding the seeds of their kinds, and trees yielding fruits (that held their own seeds) of their kinds. God approved it because it was good.
|Broadly speaking, this includes [[grain]]s, [[vegetable]]s, and [[fruit]]s.
|-
|13
|And the evening and the morning were the third day.
|Evening and morning came: the third day.
|
|-
|14
|And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
|Then God commanded: "Lights will come to be in the expanse of the skies, to distinguish between the day and the night, and they will serve as signs, for (planting) seasons, for days, and for years.
|The [[Hebrew]] '''מועד''' (''mow'ed''), translated "season," actually means an appointed time for doing something. The [[Hebrews]] were originally agrarian, as the original names of their months ([[Abib]], [[Sivan]], etc.) indicate.
|-
|15
|And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
|They will also serve for lights in the expanse of the sky to produce light over the earth!" And so it came to be.
|
|-
|16
|And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
|God made two particularly intense lights: the more intense to rule the day, and the less-intense to rule the night. He also made the [[star]]s.
|The two intense lights are, of course, the [[sun]] and the [[moon]]. In addition, God made every other object in the sky, including the [[planet]]s, of which the ancients could see five: [[Mercury]], [[Venus]], [[Mars]], [[Jupiter]], and [[Saturn]].
|-
|17
|And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
|God set these in the expanse of the sky to produce light on the earth,
|
|-
|18
|And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
|and to have dominion over the day and the night, and to distinguish light from darkness. God approved this because it was good.
|
|-
|19
|And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
|Evening and morning came: the fourth day.
|
|-
|20
|And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
|God commanded, "The waters will positively swarm with creatures that move and have life, and birds that fly above the earth in the open sky!"
|The traditional expression "bring forth abundantly" does not do justice to the original Hebrew. Once again Hebrew employs repetition for emphasis.
|-
|21
|And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
|So God created gigantic sea creatures, and made the waters teem with every moving creature after its [[Baraminology|kind]], and every winged bird after its [[Baraminology|kind]]. God approved it because it was good.
|The largest of sea creatures included more than the great [[whales]]. They also included several species of marine [[dinosaur]]s, at least two of which (the [[Loch Ness Monster | Loch Ness creature]] and "Predator X", identified in the Bible as "[[Leviathan]]") survived the [[Great Flood]].
|-
|22
|And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.
|God blessed them, and commanded them, "Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas! Birds will multiply in the earth!"
|
|-
|23
|And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.
|Evening and morning came: the fifth day.
|
|-
|24
|And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
|Now God commanded, "The earth shall produce living creatures of all [[Baraminology|kinds]]: livestock, creeping things, and wild animals of the earth, of all kinds!" And so it came to be.
|
|-
|25
|And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
|God made all manner of wild animal kinds, and livestock kinds, and every kind of thing that creeps on land. God approved it because it was good.
|
|-
|26
|And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
|Then God declared, "We shall make mankind in Our image, after Our likeness, and they will subjugate the fish of the sea, the birds of the sky, the cattle, the whole earth, and every creeping thing that creeps on the earth!"
|
|-
|27
|So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
|So God created mankind in His image. In the image of God He created mankind; He created them both male and female.
|
|-
|28
|And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
|Then God blessed them, and God told them, "Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the earth abundantly, and subdue it. You shall have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and every living thing that moves on the earth!"
|
|-
|29
|And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
|Then God said, "Look! I have provided for you every plant that produces seed on the face of the earth, and every tree that bears fruit that yields seed. These shall be your food.
|Pre-[[Great Flood|Flood]] man was supposed to be [[vegetarian]] and live entirely on [[fruit]]s and [[vegetable]]s. Genesis 9:1-3 supersedes this. But some dietitians, like the inventor of the [[Hallelujah Diet]], insist that vegetarianism reflects God's original and even present intent. Moreover, Rastas and other pro-marijuana advocates have used this verse to argue correctly that marijuana, as a seed-producing plant, should not be legally prohibited.
|-
|30
|And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.
|And for every land animal, and every bird of the air, and everything that creeps on the earth, and has life, I have provided every green vegetable for food!" And so it came to be.
|
|-
|31
|And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
|God approved of everything He had made. In fact it was absolutely excellent. Evening and morning came: the sixth day.
|The Hebrew '''מאד''' (''meh'od''), when used after an adjective, takes the meaning of that adjective to the highest degree. "Very good" does't quite do it justice.
|}

==Chapter 2==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
|In this way the [[heaven]]s and the [[earth]] were now complete, and everything in them was also complete.
|The [[Hebrew]] phrase '''כל-צבאם''' (''kalah-tsabam''), literally "complete armies," is a idiomatic expression.
|-
|2
|And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
|On the seventh day God finished the Work of Art That He had made, and He took a rest on the seventh day from all His effort that He had made.
|That word for "rest" is '''שבת''' or literally ''shabbat'', from which we get [[Sabbath]].
|-
|3
|And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
|God blessed the seventh day and set it apart from other days. In it He had rested from all His work of creating and making things.
|
|-
|4
|These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,
|This is the story of the skies and the earth when they were created, in the day that the [[YHWH|LORD]] [[God]] made the earth and the skies.
|The word rendered LORD, here and elsewhere, is '''יהוה''' (''Yahweh'', sometimes rendered ''Yehovah'' in the [[Masoretic Text]]) or [[YHWH]], the Tetragrammaton. The literal meaning is "He exists," sometimes rendered "He is" without a predicate nominative or adjective. Compare this with '''אהוה''' (''Ehweh''), which means ''I'' exist, in Exodus 3:14, the one occasion in which [[God]] gives His direct calling name to anyone.
|-
|5
|And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.
|None of the land plants were in the ground yet, nor had any land herb sprouted. The LORD God had not made it rain on the land, and no man was available to work the ground.
|
|-
|6
|But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
|Then a mist went up from the earth, and watered all parts of the ground.
|In [[Hebrew]], the word '''פנים''' (''paniym''), meaning "face," has the same idiomatic usage as the word "face" in English. Note also that the ''pan-'' root is similar to the [[Greek]] ''pan-'' root meaning "all" or "every".
|-
|7
|And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
|Then the LORD God formed a [[human]] being out of the dry powdered soil on the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. And so man became a living person.
|The [[Hebrew]] gives this man's name: [[Adam]].
|- In the Hebrew, the man - adam - is formed from the soil - adamah.
|8
|And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
|Then the LORD God planted the [[Garden of Eden]] toward the east. There He put the man that He had formed.
|
|-
|9
|And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
|From the ground the LORD God caused every tree to grow that is pleasant to look at and good to eat. In the middle of the garden He also planted the Tree of Life and the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
|The Tree of Life is probably an [[almond]] tree. The Tree of Knowledge may or may not be an [[apple]] tree.
|-
|10
|And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads.
|A river flowed out of Eden to irrigate the garden. From there it split into four headwaters.
|
|-
|11
|The name of the first is Pison: that is it which compasseth the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold;
|The first of these is called the Pison. This river surrounds the whole land of Havilah, a land rich in natural resources.
|
|-
|12
|And the gold of that land is good: there is bdellium and the onyx stone.
|The resources of that land are valuable; they include gum resin and onyx.
|The stone could also be chrysoprasus, beryl, or malachite.
|-
|13
|And the name of the second river is Gihon: the same is it that compasseth the whole land of Ethiopia.
|The second river is called the Gihon. This river surrounds the whole land of [[Ethiopia]].
|
|-
|14
|And the name of the third river is Hiddekel: that is it which goeth toward the east of Assyria. And the fourth river is Euphrates.
|The third river is called the Hiddekel; this is the river that flows toward the east of [[Assyria]]. The fourth river is the [[Euphrates River]].
|
|-
|15
|And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
|The LORD God took Adam, and put him into the Garden of Eden, to work it and have charge of it.
|
|-
|16
|And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
|The LORD God gave Adam these orders: "From every tree of the garden you may eat to your heart's content,
|The [[Hebrew]] actually repeats the verb "to eat" for emphasis.
|-
|17
|But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
|except that you must not eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. In the day that you eat from that tree you shall surely die."
|The Hebrew here repeats the word "die" for emphasis and intensification, not only of the certainty of death but also of its severity. The "death" meant here is separation from God, a thing that Adam probably did not then appreciate.
|-
|18
|And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
|Then the LORD God said, "It is not good for Adam to be alone. I will make him a suitable helper."
|
|-
|19
|And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
|From the ground the LORD God then formed every land animal and every bird of the sky, and brought them to Adam to see how he would name them. Whatever name Adam gave to any living creature, that would be its name.
|It's not clear how this fits into the Genesis one narrative.
|-
|20
|And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
|Adam gave names to all cattle, and all the birds in the sky, and every living creature of the field. But in all that company no suitable helper for Adam could be found.
|
|-
|21
|And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
|Then the LORD God caused Adam to fall into a trance, and he slept. He took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh in its place.
|
|-
|22
|And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
|Out of this rib, that the LORD God had taken from Adam, He made a woman, and brought her to Adam.
|
|-
|23
|And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
|Adam said, "This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh. She shall be named Woman, because she was taken out of Man."
|
|-
|24
|Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
|For that reason, a man will leave his father and mother, and cling to his wife, and they will be one flesh.
|This is the basis of [[marriage]].
|-
|25
|And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed.
|The two of them, Adam and his wife, were naked, and were not ashamed.
|Shame would not come into their lives until they made one fatal mistake.
|}

==Chapter 3==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
|Now the serpent was craftier than any other land animal that the [[YHWH|LORD]] [[God]] had made. He asked the woman, "Wait a minute. Did God really say, 'You may not eat from any tree in the garden?'"
|The serpent, that is, [[Satan]], twists God's command into a prohibiton against eating from ''any'' tree, not just one Tree in particular.
|-
|2
|And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
|The woman told the serpent, "We may eat the fruits of the trees of the garden,
|
|-
|3
|But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
|but concerning the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God has said, 'You must not eat this, or even touch it, or else you will die.'"
|Now [[Eve]] distorts God's word by exaggerating, an ever-present danger.
|-
|4
|And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
|The serpent told the woman, "You won't 'surely die.'
|
|-
|5
|For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
|Because God knows that in the day that you eat that fruit, your [[eye]]s will be opened, and you will be like gods yourselves, with knowledge of good and evil."
|It takes a lot more than knowledge of good and evil to be God-like. But Eve did not know that, and so believed a lie.
|-
|6
|And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
|So the woman considered that the tree was good to eat, pleasant to look at, and desirable for the understanding it might convey. So she took some of its fruit, and ate, and also gave some to her husband, and he ate.
|The action of the [[Fall of Man]]...
|-
|7
|And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
|Then both their eyes were opened. Then they knew they were naked, and sewed fig leaves together to make loin-coverings for themselves.
|...and the result.
|-
|8
|And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden.
|Then they heard the Voice of the LORD God as He walked in the garden in the daily breeze. Adam and his wife hid themselves from the face of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.
|
|-
|9
|And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
|Then the LORD God called to Adam, "Where are you?"
|
|-
|10
|And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
|And Adam said, "I heard Your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked. So I hid myself."
|Adam offers a lame excuse. So God begins to probe.
|-
|11
|And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?
|So He said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I ordered you not to eat from?"
|
|-
|12
|And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
|And Adam said, "The woman whom You provided to be with me, gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate."
|An even lamer excuse: blaming someone else.
|-
|13
|And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
|Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What have you done?" And the woman said, "The serpent [[Deceit|deceived]] me, and I ate."
|The woman also blames someone else.
|-
|14
|And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
|Then the LORD God told the serpent, "Because you have done this, you will lie under a curse, more than all livestock or any other land animal. You will crawl on your belly and eat dry-powder food throughout the days of your life.
|
|-
|15
|And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
|I will incite hatred between you and the woman, and between your children and hers. They will wound you in the head, and you will wound them in the heel.
|This is both a description of how [[snake]]s live today and a prophecy of the Crucifixion, in that [[Jesus Christ]] would have His heels pierced and will hang on a cross driven into a hill in the shape of a skull, i.e. a head.
|-
|16
|Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
|To the woman He said, "I will increase your labor pains to an extreme degree. You will deliver your children, your desires will be directed toward your husband, and he will rule over you."
|Again, Hebrew uses repetition for emphasis and intensification.
|-
|17
|And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
|To Adam He said, "Because you listened to the voice your wife, and ate from the tree that I ordered you not to eat from, the ground will be under a curse on your account. You will have to labor to eat from it all the days of your life.
|
|-
|18
|Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
|It will also produce thorns and thistles for you, and you will eat land herbs.
|
|-
|19
|In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
|Your face will sweat as you eat bread, until you return to the ground. You were taken out of the ground, you were made from powder, and you will turn back into powder."
|
|-
|20
|And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.
|Adam gave his wife a name, [[Eve]], because she was the mother of all living persons.
|
|-
|21
|Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
|Then the LORD God made coats of animal skins for Adam and his wife, and clothed them.
|Without the shedding of blood there can be no salvation. This act is a direct illustration of this principle.
|-
|22
|And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
|Then the LORD God, "Look! The man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil. We cannot now let him stretch out his hand, and also take fruit from the Tree of Life, and eat and live forever!"
|
|-
|23
|Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
|For that reason the LORD God sent him out of the Garden of Eden, to work the ground from which he had been formed.
|
|-
|24
|So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
|So He drove out the man, and to the east of the Garden of Eden he stationed cherubs, and a flaming sword that turned every which way, to guard the path to the Tree of Life.
|A cherub is a class of [[angel]]. Its exact rank and function are hinted at elsewhere. More to the point: God cannot allow mankind to live forever in a sinful condition.
|}

==Chapter 4==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
|[[Adam]] had relations with his wife, [[Eve]]. She conceived, and bore [[Cain]], saying, "I have acquired a man-child from the [[YHWH|LORD]]."
|The name ''Cain'' ([[Hebrew]] '''קין''' (''Qayin'') means "possession." The verb translated "acquired" comes from the same Hebrew root.
|-
|2
|And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
|Later she bore another son, his brother [[Abel]]. Abel was a shepherd, and Cain was a farmer.
|Literally, "one working the ground."
|-
|3
|And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.
|At the end of many days it happened that Cain brought an offering to the LORD from his harvest.
|
|-
|4
|And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
|Abel, similarly, brought one of the very first lambs from his flock and its fat. The LORD appreciated Abel and his offering,
|Abel brought the best that his work had produced to God,
|-
|5
|But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
|but did not appreciate Cain or his offering. Cain was extremely resentful and crestfallen.
|but Cain probably brought the leftovers. This was not because only animal sacrifice would serve.
|-
|6
|And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
|The LORD said to Cain, "Why are you resentful? Why are you crestfallen?
|
|-
|7
|If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
|If you would put forth a proper effort, don't you think you would be accepted? But if you won't make the effort, then sin lies at your door. Sin desires you, but you must master it."
|
|-
|8
|And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.
|Then Cain spoke with his brother Abel, and it happened, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against his brother Abel and murdered him.
|
|-
|9
|And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
|Then the LORD asked Cain, "Where is your brother Abel?" And he said, "I don't know. Am I supposed to be responsible for my brother?"
|
|-
|10
|And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
|And He said, "What have you done? The voice of your brother's blood cries out to Me from the ground.
|
|-
|11
|And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
|Now you are cursed from the earth, which has opened its mouth to take your brother's blood from your hand.
|
|-
|12
|When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
|Whenever you try to work the ground, it will never again yield its strength to you. You will be a fugitive and a wanderer in the earth."
|
|-
|13
|And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
|Cain said to the LORD, "My punishment is more than I can take!
|
|-
|14
|Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.
|Look! You have driven me this day from the face of the land, and I will be hidden from Your face! I will be a fugitive and a wanderer in the earth, and anyone who finds me will murder me!"
|
|-
|15
|And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.
|Then the LORD told him, "For that, if anyone murders Cain, he will pay a seven-fold penalty." Then the LORD placed a special mark on Cain, to make sure that anyone finding him would know not to kill him.
|
|-
|16
|And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
|Then Cain went away from the presence of the LORD, and lived in the land of Nod, to the east of Eden.
|The root meaning of the name "Nod" means "wandering." This name never appears again; it is a [[hapax legomenon]].
|-
|17
|And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.
|There Cain had relations with his wife, and she conceived and bore him a son named [[Enoch (Cainite)|Enoch]]. Cain built a city, and named that city after his son Enoch.
|The name ''Enoch'' means "dedicated."
|-
|18
|And unto Enoch was born Irad: and Irad begat Mehujael: and Mehujael begat Methusael: and Methusael begat Lamech.
|Enoch's son was Irad, and Irad's son was Mehujael, and Mehujael's son was Methusael, and Methusael's son was [[Lamech the Murderer|Lamech]].
|The names of these further descendants of Cain meant "fleet", "smitten by God," "who is of God," and "powerful."
|-
|19
|And Lamech took unto him two wives: the name of the one was Adah, and the name of the other Zillah.
|Lamech married two wives, named [[Adah]] and [[Zillah]].
|The names of Lamech's wives mean "ornament" and "shade."
|-
|20
|And Adah bare Jabal: he was the father of such as dwell in tents, and of such as have cattle.
|Adah bore [[Jabal]], the progenitor of those who live in tents, and those who keep livestock.
|''Jabal'' means "stream of water."
|-
|21
|And his brother's name was Jubal: he was the father of all such as handle the harp and organ.
|His brother's name was [[Jubal]], the progenitor of all who handle the [[harp]] and the [[organ]].
|''Jubal'' means "stream." Jubal invented [[music]]al instruments.
|-
|22
|And Zillah, she also bare Tubal-cain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron: and the sister of Tubal-cain was Naamah.
|Zillah bore [[Tubal-cain]], an instructor of every worker of [[bronze]] and [[iron]]. His sister was Naamah.
|''Tubal-cain'' means "You will be brought from Cain." ''Naamah'' means "loveliness."
|-
|23
|And Lamech said unto his wives, Adah and Zillah, Hear my voice; ye wives of Lamech, hearken unto my speech: for I have slain a man to my wounding, and a young man to my hurt.
|Lamech said to his wives, Adah, and Zillah, "Listen to me, you wives of Lamech, listen to what I'm telling you. I have killed a man who wounded me, and a young man who hurt me.
|
|-
|24
|If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold, truly Lamech seventy and sevenfold.
|If Cain enjoys seven-fold protection, then Lamech deserves seventy-seven-fold protection!"
|
|-
|25
|And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.
|Adam had relations again with his wife, and she bore a son, and named him [[Seth]]. She said, "Because [[God]] has appointed me another son in the place of Abel, whom Cain murdered."
|The name ''Seth'' means "appointed." The play on words is obvious in the original Hebrew.
|-
|26
|And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.
|Seth also had a son, named [[Enos]]. At that time men began to call on the Name of the LORD.
|''Enosh'' is another word for "man."
|}

==Chapter 5==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
|This is the book of the genealogy of [[Adam]]. In the day that [[God]] created man, He made him in God's likeness.
|
|-
|2
|Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
|He created them male and female, and blessed them, and called them "mankind," in the day that they were created.
|''Adam'' means "man."
|-
|3
|And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:
|When Adam had lived for 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image, and named him [[Seth]].
|That is, "appointed."
|-
|4
|And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters:
|And after Adam had become the father of Seth he lived 800 more years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|5
|And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.
|Altogether Adam lived for 930 years, and he died.
|
|-
|6
|And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos:
|When Seth had lived 105 years, he had a son named [[Enos]].
|That is, "man" again.
|-
|7
|And Seth lived after he begat Enos eight hundred and seven years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Seth had Enos, he lived 807 more years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|8
|And all the days of Seth were nine hundred and twelve years: and he died.
|Altogether Seth lived for 912 years, and he died.
|
|-
|9
|And Enos lived ninety years, and begat Cainan:
|When Enos was 90 years old, he had a son named [[Cainan]].
|That is, "possession."
|-
|10
|And Enos lived after he begat Cainan eight hundred and fifteen years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Enos had Cainan, he lived for 815 years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|11
|And all the days of Enos were nine hundred and five years: and he died.
|Altogether Enos lived for 905 years, and he died.
|
|-
|12
|And Cainan lived seventy years, and begat Mahalaleel:
|When Cainan had lived for 70 years, he had a son named [[Mahalaleel]].
|That is, "Praise of God."
|-
|13
|And Cainan lived after he begat Mahalaleel eight hundred and forty years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Cainan had Mahaleel, he lived for 840 years, and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|14
|And all the days of Cainan were nine hundred and ten years: and he died.
|Altogether Cainan lived for 910 years, and he died.
|
|-
|15
|And Mahalaleel lived sixty and five years, and begat Jared:
|Mahaleel lived for 65 years, and had a son named [[Jared]].
|That is, "descent," which could mean "coming down."
|-
|16
|And Mahalaleel lived after he begat Jared eight hundred and thirty years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Mahaleel had Jared, he lived for 830 years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|17
|And all the days of Mahalaleel were eight hundred ninety and five years: and he died.
|Altogether Mahaleel lived for 895 years, and he died.
|
|-
|18
|And Jared lived an hundred sixty and two years, and he begat Enoch:
|When Jared had lived 162 years, he had a son named [[Enoch]].
|That is, "dedicated."
|-
|19
|And Jared lived after he begat Enoch eight hundred years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Jared had Enoch, he lived for 800 years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|20
|And all the days of Jared were nine hundred sixty and two years: and he died.
|Altogether Jared lived for 962 years, and he died.
|
|-
|21
|And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselah:
|When Enoch had lived for 65 years, he had a son named [[Methuselah]].
|That is, "man of the dart."
|-
|22
|And Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Enoch had Methuselah, he lived for 300 more years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|23
|And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years:
|Altogether Enoch lived for 365 years.
|
|-
|24
|And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.
|Enoch walked with God. Then suddenly he didn't exist anymore, because God took him away.
|Reason: God directly translated him, as He would do for [[Elijah]] several thousand years later.
|-
|25
|And Methuselah lived an hundred eighty and seven years, and begat Lamech:
|When Methuselah had lived 187 years, he had a son named [[Lamech]].
|That is, "powerful."
|-
|26
|And Methuselah lived after he begat Lamech seven hundred eighty and two years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Methuselah had Lamech, he lived another 782 years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|27
|And all the days of Methuselah were nine hundred sixty and nine years: and he died.
|Altogether Methuselah lived for 969 years, and he died.
|Methuselah lived longer than any other man who ever lived, and died in the year of the [[Great Flood]].
|-
|28
|And Lamech lived an hundred eighty and two years, and begat a son:
|When Lamech had lived 182 years, he had a son named [[Noah]]
|That is, "comfort" or "rest."
|-
|29
|And he called his name Noah, saying, This same shall comfort us concerning our work and toil of our hands, because of the ground which the LORD hath cursed.
|Lamech named his son Noah, and said, "My son will comfort us on account of our labor and work of our hands, on account of the ground that the LORD has cursed."
|
|-
|30
|And Lamech lived after he begat Noah five hundred ninety and five years, and begat sons and daughters:
|After Lamech had Noah, he lived for another 595 years and had other sons and daughters.
|
|-
|31
|And all the days of Lamech were seven hundred seventy and seven years: and he died.
|Altogether, Lamech lived for 777 years, and he died.
|Lamech died five years before the [[Great Flood]].
|-
|32
|And Noah was five hundred years old: and Noah begat Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
|When Noah was 500 years old, he had three sons named [[Shem]], [[Ham]], and [[Japheth]].
|That is, "name", "hot", and "opened." These sons are not named in the actual birth order: Japheth was likely born first, then Shem, and finally Ham.
|}

==Chapter 6==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
|Eventually, when men began to populate the land, and many young women were born,
|The [[Hebrew]] starts with the imperfect of "to exist," which is idiomatic for "eventually" here.
|-
|2
|That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
|the sons of God regarded these young women as beautiful, and took as many of them as they chose as brides.
|Some commentators ([[Harold Camping]] among them) say that these "sons of God" were simply members of [[Seth]]'s line who married outside the true faith. But [[Jude]] (in the [[New Testament]]) says almost directly that these "sons of God" were fallen [[angels]] who thus produced a race of angel-human hybrids.
|-
|3
|And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
|The LORD said, "My spirit shall not continue this quarrel with man forever, because indeed he is sinful flesh. I give him one hundred twenty years more."
|[[God]] issues this warning 120 years before the [[Great Flood]]; see also [[Noah's Ark]].
|-
|4
|There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
|The Fallen Ones were abroad in the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God had relations with young human women, and these women bore children to them. These hybrids became strong men in ancient times, men of renown.
|[[Moses]] might be talking about the Anakim, giant-sized inhabitants of [[Canaan (land)|Canaan]] whom his twelve spies reported seeing. Whether [[Hercules]] was one of them is impossible to determine.
|-
|5
|And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
|[[God]] realized that the evil that man did in the earth was great, and that everything that he thought and imagined in his heart, every single day, was utterly evil.
|
|-
|6
|And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
|And the LORD regretted that he had made man on the earth, and He was heartsick.
|
|-
|7
|And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
|The LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, off the face of the land—mankind and land animals and insect life and birds of the air—because I regret that I have made them."
|Notice that God does not say here that he will destroy all marine life, and also that the word He actually uses means not merely to kill but to rub out, as if it never existed. Which is what the [[Great Flood]] did, to the extent that modern-day scoffers insist that it never occurred and cite a "lack of evidence," not realizing how complete a change the Great Flood made to the land.
|-
|8
|But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.
|But [[Noah]] found favor in the sight of the LORD.
|
|-
|9
|These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.
|This is Noah's story: Noah was a just man, and the most wholesom man of his time, and Noah walked with God.
|The two words translated "generations" in the [[KJV]] are radically different in meaning.
|-
|10
|And Noah begat three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth.
|Noah was the father of three sons: [[Shem]], [[Ham]], and [[Japheth]].
|That is, "name", "hot," and "opened." Yet the proper birth order is Japheth first, then Shem, then Ham.
|-
|11
|The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.
|The earth was corrupt before God, and the earth was an utterly violent world.
|
|-
|12
|And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.
|Wherever God looked on the earth, He saw corruption, because all men had become thoroughly evil and corrupt.
|All men, that is, except for Noah and his family.
|-
|13
|And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
|So God told Noah, "The end of all mankind has come before Me, because the earth is full of violence on their account. So look: I am going to destroy them along with the earth.
|
|-
|14
|Make thee an ark of gopher wood; rooms shalt thou make in the ark, and shalt pitch it within and without with pitch.
|Build for yourself an [[Noah's Ark|ark]] of gopher wood. Build nests in the ark, and coat it with pitch inside and out.
|The [[Hebrew]] '''תבה''' (''tebah'') appears only here and in the story of [[Moses]] in the bulrushes. It probably means simply "lifeboat." The term '''עצי-גפר''' (''etsi-gopher'') never appears again in the [[Bible]] or any other literature (thus making it a [[hapax legomenon]]), and could mean a lost species of tree, an [[Antediluvian Civilizatoin|antediluvian]] composite, or a lost art of producing wood for shipbuilding. "Pitch" usually means "ransom" and its use here prefigures the ransom that [[Jesus Christ]] paid for mankind.<ref name=Lovett>Lovett T, ''Noah's Ark: Thinking Outside the Box'', Green Forest, AR: Master Books, 2008.</ref>
|-
|15
|And this is the fashion which thou shalt make it of: The length of the ark shall be three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits.
|Build it this way:
*Length: 515 feet.
*Beam: 86 feet.
*Height: 52 feet.
|This is probably the long [[cubit]], at least 20 US Customary [[inch]]es long. These dimensions probably translate to slightly more than 150 by 25 by 15 [[SI]] [[meter]]s.<ref name=Lovett/>
|-
|16
|A window shalt thou make to the ark, and in a cubit shalt thou finish it above; and the door of the ark shalt thou set in the side thereof; with lower, second, and third stories shalt thou make it.
|Set a skylight hatch in its top deck, with its hatch combing rising one cubit above deck level. Set the door of the ark in its side. Build it with lower, second, and third deck levels.
|The Hebrew text does not specify a word for "deck levels," but merely says, "lower, second, and third." This usage suggests that the door was at the second deck level, perhaps midway up from the bottom.<ref name=Lovett/>
|-
|17
|And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
|Look: I Myself will bring a [[Great Flood|Flood]] of waters on the earth, to destroy all men and animals having the breath of life in them from under the sky. Everything in the earth will die.
|
|-
|18
|But with thee will I establish my covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee.
|But I will establish my covenant with you, and you will enter the ark, you, and your sons, and your wife, and your sons' wives with you.
|
|-
|19
|And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female.
|And out of every living thing among all animals, you are to bring two of every sort into the ark, a male and a female, to keep them alive with you.
|
|-
|20
|Of fowls after their kind, and of cattle after their kind, of every creeping thing of the earth after his kind, two of every sort shall come unto thee, to keep them alive.
|Two of every [[Baraminology|created kind]] of bird, and every kind of livestock, and of every ground creeper, will come to you so that you can keep them alive.
|
|-
|21
|And take thou unto thee of all food that is eaten, and thou shalt gather it to thee; and it shall be for food for thee, and for them.
|You will take with you samples of every kind of foodstuff, and gather it for yourself. This will be your food, and theirs."
|
|-
|22
|Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.
|So Noah did all these things, exactly as God ordered him.
|
|}

==Chapter 7==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And the LORD said unto Noah, Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation.
|Then the [[YHWH|LORD]] said to [[Noah]], "Come, you and all your household, into the [[Noah's Ark|ark]]. You're the only just person I've seen in this generation of men.
|
|-
|2
|Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.
|Take seven specimens of every clean animal, male and female, and take two specimens of unclean animals, male and female.
|
|-
|3
|Of fowls also of the air by sevens, the male and the female; to keep seed alive upon the face of all the earth.
|Also take seven specimens of every [[bird]], male and female, in order to raise live offspring to repopulate the earth afterward.
|
|-
|4
|For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth.
|Seven days from now, I will make it rain on the [[earth]] for 40 days and nights. and I will wipe out every living thing I have made from the face of the earth."
|
|-
|5
|And Noah did according unto all that the LORD commanded him.
|Noah followed all the LORD's orders.
|
|-
|6
|And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth.
|Noah was 600 years old when the [[Great Flood]] came on the earth.
|
|-
|7
|And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood.
|Noah boarded the ark, with his sons, his wife, and his sons' wives with him, to escape the Flood waters.
|
|-
|8
|Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth,
|Of clean animals, and unclean animals, and birds, and of every living thing that creeps on the ground,
|including [[insect]]s and [[worm]]s
|-
|9
|There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.
|two and two went to [[Noah]] aboard the ark, male and female, as God had ordered Noah.
|
|-
|10
|And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.
|After the seven days had passed, the waters of the Flood came upon the earth.
|
|-
|11
|In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
|In the 600th year of Noah's life, on the seventeenth day of the second month, on that very day the deep subcrustal springs were broken open, and the windows of the sky were thrown open.
|The date is 17 [[Bul]] 1656 [[Anno Mundi|AM]], corresponding to October 23, 2348 BC in the proleptic Gregorian calendar.

That last idiomatic phrase reflects the ancient Hebrew view of the sky as a solid object; see Genesis 1:6-8. It refers actually to the torrential rain, which came not only from rainclouds but also fell back to earth after gushing out of the subcrustal springs. See also [[Hydroplate Theory]] and entries for the [[Galilean moons]] of [[Jupiter]], three of which are supposed to have subcrustal oceans.
|-
|12
|And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.
|Τhe rain fell on the earth for 40 days and nights.
|
|-
|13
|In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark;
|On that very day [[Noah]], and [[Shem]], and [[Ham]], and [[Japheth]], Noah's sons, and Noah's wife, and the tree wives of his sons with them, boarded the ark.
|
|-
|14
|They, and every beast after his kind, and all the cattle after their kind, and every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind, and every fowl after his kind, every bird of every sort.
|With them went specimens of every [[Baraminology|created kind]] of land animal, including livestock, ground creepers, and birds,
|
|-
|15
|And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
|two specimens of each kind of air-breathing animal,
|
|-
|16
|And they that went in, went in male and female of all flesh, as God had commanded him: and the LORD shut him in.
|male and female, as God had ordered Noah. Then the LORD shut him in.
|This last phrase could indicate a miraculous action, but we have no reason to suppose that Noah did not build a properly watertight door.<ref name=Lovett/>
|-
|17
|And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
|The [[Great Flood|Flood]] lasted for forty days, during which time the waters rose steadily, and floated the ark and lifted it up above the earth.
|
|-
|18
|And the waters prevailed, and were increased greatly upon the earth; and the ark went upon the face of the waters.
|The waters could not be stopped, and rose to great depths on the earth, and the ark rode the surface of the waters.
|
|-
|19
|And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.
|The waters were exceedingly powerful and deep, and all the high hills under the entire sky were covered.
|
|-
|20
|Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.
|The waters kept rising for another fifteen cubits, and the mountains were covered.
|How high those mountains were before the Flood is impossible to say. Many of the modern mountain ranges formed in the process of the Flood, as the subterranean waters, escaping through the Mid-Oceanic Ridge system, shoved the continents into one another or off to one side, causing them to buckle and form mountains by faulting.
|-
|21
|And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:
|Everything that moved on the earth died, including birds, livestock, wild animals, ground creepers, and every man.
|
|-
|22
|All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
|Every [[animal]] that went about on dry land and breathed air, died.
|The great [[whales]] are air breathers, but they are also marine animals and were thus able to survive.
|-
|23
|And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
|Every living creature was wiped off the face of the ground, including mankind, livestock, ground creepers, and birds in the sky. They were wiped out from the earth, and only Noah and those with him in the ark remained alive.
|
|-
|24
|And the waters prevailed upon the earth an hundred and fifty days.
|The waters covered over the earth for 150 days.
|
|}

==Chapter 8==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters asswaged;
|Now [[God]] still remembered [[Noah]], and every living creature, and all the livestock that was with him in the [[Noah's Ark|ark]]. So God sent a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters receded.
|
|-
|2
|The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained;
|The subcrustal springs and the windows of the sky were stopped, and the rain from the sky was restrained.
|
|-
|3
|And the waters returned from off the earth continually: and after the end of the hundred and fifty days the waters were abated.
|The waters continued to recede from the earth. At the end of 150 days the waters had drained away.
|
|-
|4
|And the ark rested in the seventh month, on the seventeenth day of the month, upon the mountains of Ararat.
|The ark ran aground on the seventeenth day of the seventh month, in the mountains of Ararat.
|The date is 17 [[Abib]] 1656 [[Anno Mundi|AM]], or April 18, 2347 BC (proleptic Gregorian).

The [[Hebrew]] '''אררט''' (''ararat'') is the name of a mountain range in eastern [[Armenia]], not necessarily including the "[[Mount Ararat]]" in [[Turkey (country)|Turkey]].
|-
|5
|And the waters decreased continually until the tenth month: in the tenth month, on the first day of the month, were the tops of the mountains seen.
|The waters continued to decrease until the tenth month, so that on the first day of the tenth month, the mountaintops became visible.
|1 Tammuz 1656 AM, or 30 June 2347 BC (proleptic Gregorian).
|-
|6
|And it came to pass at the end of forty days, that Noah opened the window of the ark which he had made:
|Eventually, forty days later, [[Noah]] opened the skylight hatch of the ark that he had built.
|
|-
|7
|And he sent forth a raven, which went forth to and fro, until the waters were dried up from off the earth.
|He sent out a [[raven]], and the raven flew every which way until the waters were dried up from the earth.
|
|-
|8
|Also he sent forth a dove from him, to see if the waters were abated from off the face of the ground;
|Then he sent out a [[dove]], to see whether the waters had receded from the ground.
|
|-
|9
|But the dove found no rest for the sole of her foot, and she returned unto him into the ark, for the waters were on the face of the whole earth: then he put forth his hand, and took her, and pulled her in unto him into the ark.
|The dove found no place to alight, so it few back to him into the ark, because the waters still covered all the ground. Noah held out his hand, took the dove, and pulled it in to him into the ark.
|
|-
|10
|And he stayed yet other seven days; and again he sent forth the dove out of the ark;
|He waited for seven more days, and sent the dove out again from the ark.
|
|-
|11
|And the dove came in to him in the evening; and, lo, in her mouth was an olive leaf pluckt off: so Noah knew that the waters were abated from off the earth.
|The dove came back to him that evening, but, to Noah's delighted surprise, it had an [[olive]] leaf plucked off in its beak. So Noah knew that the waters had gone down significantly.
|
|-
|12
|And he stayed yet other seven days; and sent forth the dove; which returned not again unto him any more.
|He waited seven days more, and sent the dove out, and this time the dove never came back.
|
|-
|13
|And it came to pass in the six hundredth and first year, in the first month, the first day of the month, the waters were dried up from off the earth: and Noah removed the covering of the ark, and looked, and, behold, the face of the ground was dry.
|Eventually, in the 601st year of Noah's life, in the first day of the first month, the waters were dried up from the earth. Then Noah removed the covering of the ark, and looked out, and saw that the ground was now dry.
|
|-
|14
|And in the second month, on the seven and twentieth day of the month, was the earth dried.
|On the twenty-seventh day of the second month, the earth was completely dry.
|27 Bul 1657 AM, or 21 November 2347 BC (proleptic Gregorian). In this verse, the Hebrew uses a different word for "dry," one conveying a higher degree of dryness.
|-
|15
|And God spake unto Noah, saying,
|Now God spoke to Noah, and said,
|
|-
|16
|Go forth of the ark, thou, and thy wife, and thy sons, and thy sons' wives with thee.
|"Go out of the ark, you and your wife and your sons and your sons' wives with you.
|
|-
|17
|Bring forth with thee every living thing that is with thee, of all flesh, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth; that they may breed abundantly in the earth, and be fruitful, and multiply upon the earth.
|Bring out with you every living thing that is with you, of all kinds of animals, birds, livestock, and ground creepers, so that they may breed profusely in the earth, and be fruitful and multiply on the earth."
|
|-
|18
|And Noah went forth, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him:
|And Noah went out, with his sons, his wife, and his sons' wives.
|
|-
|19
|Every beast, every creeping thing, and every fowl, and whatsoever creepeth upon the earth, after their kinds, went forth out of the ark.
|Every land animal, every ground creeper, and every bird, after its created kind, left the ark.
|
|-
|20
|And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.
|Then Noah built an altar to the LORD. He took specimens of every clean land animal, and every clean bird, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.
|The [[Hebrew]] '''עלה''' (''olah'') describes this specific kind of offering. The word also connotes a climbing of stairs and reflects the need to "step up" to the altar. This is also why Noah took seven clean-animal specimens of each kind, rather than the usual two.
|-
|21
|And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.
|The LORD smelled a soothing odor, and the LORD said in His heart, "Never again will I curse the ground on account of mankind, because the imagination of man's heart is evil starting in his childhood. Nor will I ever again kill every living thing, as I have done.
|
|-
|22
|While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.
|While the earth remains, planting time and harvest time, cold and heat, summer and winter, and day and night will not stop."
|
|}

== References ==
{{reflist}}

* [[Genesis 9-16 (Translated)]]

[[Category:Conservative Bible]]

Talk:Genesis 1-8 (Translated)

2009-11-09T05:03:56Z

Danielitld: /* The expanse */ new section

Talk:John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-11-03T05:04:21Z

Danielitld: /* Aramaic solution to "Logos" controversy? */

== The Gospel According to John ==

TerryH and Aschlafly have asked me to take charge of the translation of the Gospel of John. For those who do not know me (which is pretty much all of you), here is a brief introduction (I've not yet had time to introduce myself on my User page). I first learned classical Greek back in 1980 in college, where I took an intensive course in Attic Greek. Not too long after that, I expanded that to include Koine (the dialect of the NT) Greek, which is in the Attic family. I have taught introductory courses in Biblical Greek (one year and two year courses) on several occasions, and have continued to study the latest research and thought on Greek translation in the almost 30 years since I first learned the language. I have also had the opportunity to read portions of some of the oldest manuscripts of the NT in existence, including P66, P77, Codex Sinaiticus, Codex Alexandrinus, and several others (from high resolution photographs of the originals, not the originals themselves). I have kept very abreast of the latest in NT textual research, and I am very well versed in most of the arguments concerning disputed sections of scripture. I have my own opinions on each of these which I will explain in the appropriate places as I reach those sections while translating.

As to this translation, the first three chapters were already completed when I arrived, so I have edited them according to my understanding of the text, and as soon as that is completed, I will begin new translation starting in chapter four. Most of the comments I have made on this page relating to the first chapter were prior to being asked to handle the translation of the rest of the book. Keep in mind that I have spent the majority of my life acting as a translation commentator, rather than a strict translator. In other words, I usually have had the luxury of taking as much space as I need to explain the meaning of the Greek. A translator, however, must be concise and succinct, which places a limitation on my "translation" that is somewhat new to me.

In keeping with my "commentator" tendencies, however, I will keep a running account of my reasoning and the occasional expanded explanation of the text in the Analysis section, as well as on this talk page.

Anyone who has questions about anything I have translated, or comments on the text itself, is encouraged to jump in on the talk page, or on my User page, and express your ideas, information or opinions. This is an open forum for all users, so please feel free to contribute. Keep in mind, however, that I have no interest whatsoever in personal attacks or snide remarks. My comments will always be professional and on the topic, and I ask that all of you do the same. Grace and peace to all of you, and I pray that the Lord uses this to minister to each and every one of you. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:41, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

:Wow, that's extremely impressive, Michael. You're a godsend.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:30, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

== Logos = the Word ==

There really shouldn't be much of a debate over using "Truth" or "Word" in John 1:1. In the Greek text, the word logos is used, which refers to something being said. Hence "Word" is better than "Truth". Also, truth in Greek is aletheia, and that word is not in the text.
:I do not think word or truth are all that great. Both fail to capture the connotation in λόγος of that which is being spoken of, mandate, law decree. Word is one literal translation of λόγος but without the idiomatic meaning people may or may not actually derive from John 1:1 it's still just a literal translation. Truth does not even weakly refer to that which is being spoken of except to editorialize by making a judgment (calling the mandate a truth, which of course it is but this doesn't capture the meaning of the words in Greek). Word is fine if you want to be a literalist about it because that is literally what λόγος means. But if you want some poetry in a Bible that's accurate and a pleasure to read, you could refer to the λόγος being a causal necessity, mandate, law, etc. because what I take John 1:1 to be saying very beautifully is that God was always there, even at the beginning and that it couldn't have been any other way. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 11:15, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

:: This is a fascinating dilemma. The unsigned first comment above fails to address how the term "word" is diluted in modern English. But the second comment above seems to downplay be the strong commonality between λόγος and the modern meaning of Truth. Still, I agree we should search for a better term.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:23, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

:::Truth doesn't seem to be an apt term here though, logos as word here is more of a ordering, rational force, which makes sense given the audience that John was writing this gospel for. To translate it as truth doesn't do justice to what logos fully means. Aletheia, a word for truth is a truth of disclosure, something 'exposes' itself to be true to one. Heidegger uses this idea to great effect in his 'Intro to Metaphysics.' Truth for the Greeks wouldn't have been logos. I prefer the translation of logos=reason or ordering force.--[[User:Rcgallup|Rcgallup]] 11:39, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

::::There is no Greek word for "Truth" with a capital "T". "λόγος" is probably the closest substitute John could find. As to "reason" or "ordering force," they seem to lack the spiritual side, which Truth captures better.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:43, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

I can really see, looking at this whole discussion, why James Moffatt in his translation chose NOT to translate Logos. He simply wrote "In the beginning was the Logos..." However, that's really not a very good solution. I never liked (and still don't like) "Truth" as a translation for Logos. However, I have to admit, "Living Word" is really growing on me! One problem way too many people have when they read "Word" is that they immediately think of a written word, which Logos is clearly not. Thus, the famous Reina-Valera translation in Spanish translates Logos as "el Verbo," the Verb, the active word. But clearly, since Logos is referring to Jesus Christ, "Living Word" really kind of captures the idea that this is a Person, specifically a Person of the Holy Trinity.--[[User:Caspianrex|Cory Howell]] 16:11, 22 October 2009 (EDT)

:"Living Word" for "λόγος" is really growing on me also. Truth has too much of a harsh edge to it in modern English, while "Living Word" has more of a dynamic, healing quality. Let's go with it!

== Truth or word ==
While I agree "truth" has too narrow a meaning, at first glance, it may serve the purpose well when explained properly. Sadly, many Christians believe that "word" refers to the Bible itself, rather than the deep concept of ''logos''. Is there a better term than either? Message? [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 22:12, 26 August 2009 (EDT)
:I'm not a Greek scholar, but λογος, as I understand it, had an enormous range of implications in first century Greek, deeply rooted in a Greek culture which held all reality to be logical and ordered, and flowing from logic and order. While truth is being used now, I think we would be hard pressed to find a single word which encompasses all the meaning and implications of λογος. The question we must ask ourselves, is how much of the beauty of the first passage(s) of John are we willing sacrifice to give a completely accurate translation? If we don't care at all for the prose, perhaps John 1:1 might better read, "In the beginning was truth, reason, wisdom, and harmony, and all this was with God for this is what God is." A suggestion. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 17:10, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
::Whoops, sorry for putting the comment Re 1:9 in the wrong place. Feel free to just delete it if you want. --[[User:MarkGall|MarkGall]] 17:28, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
:::The more foundational question that needs to be decided here is whether this is going to be a dynamic paraphrase, or a strict translation. In other words, are we attempting to relate what the Greek actually SAYS, or are we attempting to explain what we believe it MEANS? If this is a strict translation, then using "truth" in John 1:1 is not an option, as the word "aletheia" does not appear in that verse. Like it or not, we are stuck with legitimate translations of logos: "word, message, reason, communication, thought, etc." If, however, this is more of a dynamic paraphrase, then we are not restricted by what the Greek actually says, and are free to use whatever words we need to "explain" what the Greek means. In that case, we can describe the force and meaning of logos in our "translation." As it stands right now, this is something of an odd cross between a translation and a paraphrase. So we need a philosophy of translation that goes beyond "conservative" and guides us in how strict or loose we are allowed to be in this re-translation. That alone would settle many of these translation disputes. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]]

::::We're doing a "thought-for-thought" translation. That's not a paraphrase, but that's not tied down by literalism either.

::::That said, I'm not entirely comfortable with "truth", as it has harsh connotations that are contrary to forgiveness. "Word" does have advantages, but it is so diluted. This debate may continue on.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:06, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

::::: Commenting further on this, an imprecision is introduced in the Greek when John chose the best word available to him for what he wanted to say (which would not necessarily be perfect), and then on the English side we have dictionaries for translating that word which become quickly out of date as meanings shift. The meaning of "word" today is not the same as 20 years ago, and certainly not the same as 400 years ago. Today "word" makes one think of one solitary word that someone might type into a computer or send on twitter or texting. Pre-computers, "word" didn't mean that in English, and 400 years ago it probably had an entirely different connotation.

::::: A collaborative, wiki-based approach is very sell suited to reducing and eliminating these imprecisions, as many people can analyze both the Greek and the English in an effort to communicate the original intent.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 19:32, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::: I've been struggling with this for quite some time (long before I learned of this project). The fundamental problem here is that English simply does not have a word that comes anywhere close to the way John is using logos in this context. His usage directly challenged the Greek concept of logos (by making it PERSONAL - the logos itself created, and was both WITH God and WAS God), meaning that he was, in effect, giving it a brand new meaning BASED upon the Greek definition. So here is what we have: the logos starts as a Greek term referring to all that can be thought and communicated, and was, in ideal form, equated with "the contents, thoughts and communications of a god." The idea being that any true thing that could be learned, communicated, acted upon, written, or discovered, the gods already knew. John took this one step further with "ο λογος ην προς τον θεον," which is a nonsense statement. How could the logos NOT be with (or in agreement with) god if it is in his mind? But John repeats this in verse two, making it clear that this was no accident. THEN he goes one step further and makes it clear he intends for this logos to be taken personally by the use of houtos in verse two, and by attributing creation directly to the logos in verse three. This logos was much more than the logos of the Greeks, it was ALIVE and POWERFUL in its own right. Further, it somehow was both GOD and WITH God at the same time. Then John slams the lid on his new definition with verse 14, where the logos becomes FLESH (sarx). Absolutely IMPOSSIBLE according to the Greek understanding of this word. Likewise, impossible to relate with any current word in the English dictionary. So, there is no possible way that we will ever find an English word that can relate what John meant with logos. The most we can ever hope for is a rough approximation that might capture a hint of what logos is. Every suggestion will be lacking in some way. Traditionally, logos has been translated with "word," which was ALWAYS lacking, and is even more so now, for all the reasons we have seen. But frankly, "word" is no worse than "message," "Truth," "logic," "reason," or any other option, all for different reasons, of course.
:::::: With all of this in mind, I have opted for a different "combination" translation. This mixes the traditional translation with John's radical new concept of a living, personal logos. I believe it solves the problems presented by modern understandings of the meaning of "word" while preserving John's core intent, will be an interesting take for new believers, and keeping it recognizable to those who have been in the faith for a long time. It is not perfect by any means (as I said, I do not believe there is a perfect choice), but I would like all of you who are reading and participating in this to take a few days and dwell on it. I'm not claiming that this settles the discussion; far from it, I hope it moves it forward. My suggestion is "living Word." [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:01, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::::I like "living Word" very, very much. That may well be the optimal choice.

:::::::In the meantime I stumbled across John 17:17, where he says: "ἁγίασον αὐτοὺς ἐν τῇ ἀληθείᾳ: ὁ λόγος ὁ σὸς ἀλήθειά ἐστιν." This seems to support the "Truth" interpretation of "λόγος". Most translate the second half as "your word is the truth," but I wonder if a more straightforward translation would be "your truth is the word." The latter translation would serve as John's own redefinition of "λόγος" as "Truth".--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:18, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::::: The best translation here would be "Your word is Truth" (since you could give aletheia the article and still preserve the subject-predicate identification), keeping in mind that the absence of the article here does NOT mean "a lesser truth." "Your truth is the word" is not an option for the following reason: In a predicate phrase where one noun has the article and the other does not, the subject is the noun with the article, and the predicate is the noun without the article. The word order in John 17:17 is more or less neutral word order, with no particular emphasis.
:::::::: John 1:1, for example, reads "θεος ην ο λογος," and since logos has the article while theos does not, it can only be translated "the Living Word was God," not "God was the Living Word." The order reversal is to place extra emphasis on "God" so that no one thinks it means "a god," while making it subtly distinct from "ton theon" in the previous clause. Thus, this construction says that the logos is THEOS (the emphasis tells us the logos is FULLY God), but is somehow different from "ton theon" (the Father). By giving the article to logos without giving it to theos, logos is preserved as the subject and theos can be moved forward for emphasis. BTW, if both nouns have the article, the rule is that the first one is the subject and the second is the predicate.
:::::::: Manipulating word order and the articles in John 1:1 would lead to subtly different meanings of that last clause:
:::::::: ο λογος ο θεος ην = The Living word is The God (Jesus and the Father are the SAME individual - Sabellianism)
:::::::: ο λογος θεος ην = Although not manditory, this one "could" be interpreted as "The Living Word was a god." (less than the Father - Arianism)
:::::::: However, θεος ην ο λογος in the context of the first two clauses can ONLY mean that the Living Word, Jesus, is fully and completely God, but is somehow different from the Father (thus, the Trinity). [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:33, 18 October 2009 (EDT)

::::::::: Wow, thanks for the insights. I'll change John 17:17 back as you say.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 07:59, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

After reading what Michael Back had to say about the logos, and doing some research, I have to wonder if John's is a gospel or a philosophical tract. Saying that John took the Greek concept of the logos, challenged it, and gave it a new meaning, would make it seem like a philosophical tract. All the attempts here to define logos mirrors a very old discourse. From reading Karl Jaspers' discussion of Heraclitus in his book on the great philosophers, logos "can neither be translated into any other term nor defined as a concept". "Logos can signify: word, discourse, content of discourse, meaning; reason, truth; law; even Being." Edward Hussey in his book on the Presocratics, states that by the time Heraclitus (b. 540 BC) really began using logos in his philosophy, "the sense of 'reason' or 'reasoning' appears to be well established" for the meaning of logos. And it would seem that logos was used in reference to "divine law" or the law of the universe. It also appears that the logos was the means by which God - since the mid sixth century BC, perhaps starting with Xenophanes, the idea of one God became known, from which the idea of the logos originated - brought order to the kosmos. The Stoics defined the logos in the same way. And for Philo, the logos "denotes the Thought of God expressed in a form that is, at least indirectly, accessible to men and knowable by them". (From Ronald Williamson's book on Philo, p. 105) So if John extended the meaning of logos, then this was in a long line of philosophers who struggled with the term and its meaning. If John then applied his understanding of the logos to Jesus, then we would have to wonder if equating the logos with Jesus is a true depiction, or a representation of his philosophizing. - Danielitld

: LOL. Very good observations. And my answer is that it was BOTH a philosophical tract and a gospel, which is what the gospel has to be when it enters a new culture. The topics he directly tackles (and his tendency to explain Jewish customs) shows that John wrote his gospel specifically aimed at a Gentile/Greek audience, and that he understood he would have to address some fundamental Greek philosophical ideas in order for them to truly understand and believe the gospel. Of course, the genius of his work is that as a whole, it was just a radically challenging to Jewish philosophical and theological ideas as it was to those of the Greeks.
: As for the logos, John was using a concept the Greeks had that the Jews didn't even have to help the Greeks better understand who and what Jesus was. Is this EXACTLY who Jesus is? Given that it is a human concept, I highly doubt it. It could be the closest we humans can come, or it could simply be the best concept the Greek language has to offer. Ultimately, this is about communication, and this explanation would help Greeks grasp who Jesus was a little better, but it would only be marginally helpful to Jews (as it is only marginally helpful to most Americans). So asking if this was "a true depiction or just John philosophizing" is missing the point. This is the closest Greek concept to what what the eternal God who became flesh really is that their culture had to offer. In another culture, a completely different philosophical or religious concept might better help them understand God. The truth is that ALL human concepts fall woefully short of capturing the full essence of who God is, so human approximations (like logos) are all we have. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:29, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

::Wow, thanks for the insightful analysis. I like the use of "Living Word" as it is, but wonder if it is a bit too repetitious (three times in the first sentence). Would some variety help, as in:

:::In the beginning was the Living Word, and this Word was with God, and this Truth was God.

::I only suggest this as way of possibly sparking further improvements in this all-important sentence.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:48, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

:::Better yet for λογος: In the beginning was the Living Word, and its logic was with God, and this Truth was God.

:::By using three different terms for λογος, repetition is avoided and the meaning is more completely conveyed. This also comports with the redefinition of λογος in John 17:17.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:56, 23 October 2009 (EDT)
::::I respect your interest in improving this verse, but there are several reasons I do not think it is in our interest to attempt to improve on the KJV translation. First, the verse has become idiomatic in the English language. It's a pure classic, and it very much adequately conveys the idea of logos and provides a rich use of logos in the verse. Second, attempting to avoid repetition in a verse that uses the same word in the same sense (as I read it in Greek) is wrong. Logos simply does not convincingly translate to logic, living word, or truth. There is no possessive to the object of was in the second stanza. It's not in the Greek. Logos does not translate to living word either - it means literally assertion, gesture, or statement. Neither does logos translate to truth - it only refers to the product of the power of speech, resolution, conditioning, or commanding and does not editorialize the significance of the message. So I think the best translation is as the KJV found it because it leaves the English speaking reader with a richness inherent in the ambiguity of the meaning of logos, which is inherent in that word in English, and conveys the poetry and whatever the poetic conceit is (is it almost like alliteration but when you use the same word multiple times?) in the Greek. The beauty of the use of logos in this verse is that it conveys something entirely different than something as simple as truth, living word, or logic. God literally made the motivating gesture of the universe. Thus, in the beginning was that which always was and always will be - it is and was God's gesture of creation. It was with God. It was God. God is the beginning and the end. It's elementary. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 00:30, 24 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::We'll see what others say, but I don't find either your first or second point logical. Idioms and the meaning of words change over 400 years. Just because a Greek word is used repetitively, it does not mean the English translation is identical in every context. The context does matter.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:38, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
::::::I agree that idioms and meanings change over the years, but I believe that the important focus is translating the words of the Bible as they are written into language that is consistent with the meanings that the authors of those words intended and would have understood. If a idiom presents itself as sensible to our understanding as 21st century Americans, that says nothing about the meaning ascribed to the idiom by a 1st century Jew writing in Greek. I respectfully disagree with your objections to my thoughts. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 01:03, 24 October 2009 (EDT)
:::::::I just realized that I am not being as helpful as I could: my suggestion is merely that the term logos should be translated consistently throughout the verse and that its meaning is best captured by a word or phrase that speaks to the creative gesture that God made in the Beginning. I would propose: "In the beginning was God's will, and God's will was with God, and God's will was God." [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 01:14, 24 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:2 ==

The entire purpose of verse two is emphasis, and some of that is lost in this translation. "All this" is not the best translation to relate the force of "houtos" in this construction. In verse 2 "houtos" is serving as an emphatic form of "autos," placing extra emphasis on "this '''SAME''' individual..." The purpose here is to emphasize the personal nature of the logos in verse one. "This same one," or even "this very same one" or something like that would be better. As it stands now, "all this" does exactly the opposite of what the Greek is attempting to relate: it DE-PERSONALIZES the logos from verse one, which is actually a more "liberal" approach to this verse. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:08, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: You're a genius, Mback! Changed as suggested.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:09, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:3 ==

P66 has "outen" (nothing) in this verse while P75 has "oute hen" (not one thing), which is simply a more emphatic form of "outen." Our translation suggests we are going with the Greek in P75 (wise choice, given that p66 has 5 times as many copy errors as p75), and if that is the case, we should keep the emphatic nature of the words found there. "Not one thing" or "not one single thing" relates the emphatic force of the Greek much better than "no thing." The repetition of "ginomai" is also a function of emphasis, but, again, depending on how strict we are going to be, we probably can get away with dropping the last "that has been made" in this verse, as this translation does. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:21, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Mback, you're obviously brilliant, knowledgeable and meticulous. I made your change here but please feel free to edit any of the translations directly yourself, along with your highly informative comments!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:13, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

:: Wow. I am humbled and honored by your words and confidence. I promise you that anything I do will be done prayerfully and with full consideration to the thoughts and ideas of everyone contributing. Thank you, sir. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:25, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:4 ==

I don't see any reason why we can't do a better job of distinguishing between "dzoe" and "bios." How about something like, "He was the source of real life..." or "Real life was found only in Him, and ..."? [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:43, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:5 ==

While this verse definitely has many different modern translations, "snuff it out" is an idiom, not a defined "dictionary" word. That phrase gives this a strong "Message paraphrase" feel, as opposed to a more scholarly, exacting translation. Is that what we want? I have no problem with idioms, but in a strict translation, you usually limit the use of idioms in English to places where idioms occur in the Greek (which, admittedly, is fairly common). [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:52, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Interesting point. Thanks. I'll check out your other suggestions also.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:34, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:7 ==

Note that the use of "houtos" in this verse is similar to how John uses it in verse two. John uses it as a more emphatic form of "autos," emphasizing that "this SAME John who was just mentioned in the previous sentence" is the one being referenced here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:9 ==

"Animates" is not a good translation of photidzo, but it is a marginally adequate paraphrase, if we are OK with the fact that it changes the flow of John's argument. Strictly speaking, in modern English "animates" references "giving life to" or "bringing to life." The problem is that our translation takes the REVERSE meaning of verse four, which tells us that the real life He had within Him gave light to men. The current translation of this verse reverses that, and says the light from Him gives life. We could argue that this is still a true statement, but being a true statement, and being an accurate translation of the verse is not the same thing. Reversing the statement of verse four is NOT what the Greek is intending here. This verse is a follow up to the previous verses contrasting light with darkness, and photidzo specifically is "to enlighten, to bring into the light, to illuminate, to shine a light upon." The point of this verse is supposed to be that the true light brings us out of darkness, NOT that it gives us life. There is a difference between translating a verse into an English statement that just happens to be true, versus translating it into an English statement that actually relates what the verse SAYS, and is also true. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:55, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:1 and 1:14 ==

Using "Truth" for λογος in 1:1 but then "spirit" in 1:14 is not theologically sound. In the KJV, we have "the Word was God ... and the Word was made flesh" which indisputably places Jesus as being God. Changing from "Truth" to "spirit" breaks that link between the two and can mislead readers into a sub-Arian interpretation where Jesus is the son and messenger of God rather than being God Incarnate in human form.

: I agree completely. Whatever word we use for "logos" in verse 1 HAS to be used here. John's phrasing in this verse is NOT just to make a vague comment about "the spirit" becoming flesh (which is actually a very liberal, new age way of looking at this verse), but rather, specifically that the logos of verse 1, who is both "with" God and "is" God, became flesh. It is my understanding that a conservative translation would emphasize the "incarnate God" aspect of Jesus' birth, as opposed to de-emphasizing it, which is what this translation currently does. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:07, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

1:14 I've thought for a long time that "dwelt" is kind of archaic, and doesn't really capture the meaning of the Greek, which is something along the lines of "pitched His tent" or "built His tabernacle." How about at least something like "made His home among us" or even the slightly more earthy "pitched His tent among us"?--[[User:Caspianrex|Cory Howell]] 15:56, 22 October 2009 (EDT)

: That's not a bad idea. The word literally means "spread a tabernacle, pitch a tent, to tabernacle, to tent." John is the only person who uses this word in the NT, as it appears here, then in Revelation 7:15; 12:12; 13:6; and a really interesting one: Revelation 21:3 - ''"And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He will '''dwell''' among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be among them...",'' which is an interesting parallel to John 1:14. I kind of like "made His home among us." Let me think about it. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:13, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:16 ==

Translating "lambano" as "benefited" is certainly unusual, but can only be considered "appropriate" if our translation guidelines are "very, very loose paraphrase." Lambano never has the meaning of "benefits" anywhere in the New Testament. Is the EFFECT of "receiving" beneficial? Absolutely. But the "effect" of the word and the "meaning" of the word are not the same thing. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:27, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:18 ==

Using "spoken of" for "exegeomai" is a very surface translation of what this word relates, and has the effect of narrowing the force of this verse. Exegeomai is a much stronger word which is more about "unfolding" or "laying out in detail." It actually relates the idea of presenting something with great depth and breadth, a richer, fuller, more detailed explanation; it is not just "speaking about" something, but more carries the idea of "explaining" that thing. "Explained," or "unfolded" or even "thoroughly presented" would related the idea of this word better in this context. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:38, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:19 ==

"Testimony" is a MUCH, MUCH better translation of "marturia" than "record." Excellent choice here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:49, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:21 ==

Just as a note here, this is one of the verses that Muslims use to claim that the New Testament foretells the coming of Mohamed. They believe that all references to "that prophet" or "the prophet" are prophesies about the expected FINAL prophet who would set everyone straight: Mohamed. The thing to note here is that John was not denying being a specific prophet, he was actually denying being a prophet of any kind. Whether through humility or because he had a different ministry, John chose NOT to classify himself as a prophet, something that is re-enforced in verse 25 where we render the same Greek construction as "another prophet." Since this seems to be more of a paraphrase than a strict translation, it really would relate the meaning of this verse better to say simply "another prophet" here, as we do in verse 25. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:23 ==

Euthuno means "straight, straightened out", not "clear." The idea is NOT about removing obstacles in the path, but rather, that the path have no turns or side routes. In other words, "there is only ONE path that leads to God, and it has no turns or curves" (which is very much the conservative message, is it not?). While it is true that the Hebrew uses the words "clear" and "smooth" here, this is actually from the Septuagint, which uses "euthus," the substantive form of euthuno, meaning "straight." In other words, John doesn't just quote the OT, by quoting the Septuagint, he uses a quote that actually relates the INTENT or MEANING of the Hebrew. If John believes that was a good choice, I think we should stick with his selection, and translate the Greek found in this verse, NOT the Hebrew found in Isaiah 40:3. This shows that the struggle between "strict translation" and "paraphrase" is a very old one. The translators of the Septuagint actually used a mild Greek paraphrase of the Hebrew in translating Isaiah 40:3, and John gives added authority to the wise choice of that paraphrase by choosing their wording (as opposed to a direct and stricter translation of the Hebrew) for his quotation.

Additionally, I think the ending phrase "just as the prophet Isaiah was" is not quite as clear as it could be. This choice makes the force of the verse be: I am a voice in the wilderness . . . just like Isaiah was. This is true, but it kind of loses the point that this is not just something Isaiah did, but is, in fact, a QUOTATION from Isaiah. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:22, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:24 ==

This is a fairly minor point, but this verse does not say those questioning "were Pharisees," it says, εκ των φαρισαιων; that is, they were "from the Pharisees." The implication is that the pharisees themselves were too cowardly to come in person, so they sent others, probably students or servants, to do the questioning for them. I think that is a point worth preserving here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 7:35, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:27 ==

Both this translation and the KJV lose the startling and contrasting points that John is making here. The Greek is closer to "he is the one coming after me who existed prior to me..." (ος εμπροσθεν μου γεγονεν). John was actually pointing toward the eternal nature of the one coming after him, kind of in line with "before Abraham was, I am." While it is obvious that God is above him, the point is that this is not just "some random guy who is above me," but rather, this person is, in fact, the eternal God in physical form. "Existed before me" or some equivalent phrase would be more accurate, and would be more in line with the startling, worldview altering point (at least to Jews) that John is making here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 7:58, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:29 ==

Excellent point on the meaning of "airo." A possible solution to this would be "takes away the sinful burden..." or "takes away the burden of sin..." or maybe a more subtle "lifts and carries away the sin..." Any of these would capture at least a little of this extra force found in the Greek. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:30 ==

Again, John's statement here is closer to "after me comes a man who existed prior to me, because he was before me," which is a very emphatic way of pointing to the pre-existence of Christ, particularly as the last phrase uses "protos," which strictly speaking tells us that John is saying Christ "came first, before me." A strong, emphatic statement. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:28, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:31 ==

The tense is wrong here. It is NOT present tense ("I do not know..."), but pluperfect (past completed - "I had not known..."). The construction used here means "I had not (before this very moment) known who He was...". An acceptable translation would be, "I did not know who he was...," but placing this in the present tense completely misses what the Greek is saying. Eido is something of a surface kind of knowing and seeing, thus it is, in this context, about identity, not a deeper kind of "knowing him personally." The point here is that John was preparing the way for one who would take away our sins, but until this very moment, he did not know the exact identity of that man.

Also, in contrast with eido, phaneroo is more "revealed, unveiled, made publicly known," so translating both words with the same English word kind of misses what is going on here. The second half of this sentence is a purpose clause, showing the REASON that John came baptizing. This entire intent of this sentence is more like this: "I did not know who he was, but despite that, I have come to baptize people with water so that He could be revealed to Israel" (and yes, reversing the order of the clauses in this kind of purpose clause for clarity is completely legitimate).
[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 9:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:33 ==

Same tense and construction as 1:31, but here translated in the correct tense (I did not know...). Eido used in this context really does mean "I did not know '''who''' he was..." as opposed to "I did not know him personally...", and that subtle distinction should probably be preserved in the translation. After all, John knew Jesus, His God and creator, in His spirit, which is why he recognized God in the flesh standing before him. What John did not know was the identity of the man who was God in the flesh.

Redefining the Holy Spirit as the Divine Guardian is a questionable move for several reasons. First, the Greek '''literally''' says "Holy Spirit," and I find the idea of renaming a member of the Trinity completely distasteful. Second, Holy Spirit is NOT a title that has been largely redefined by our culture, so there is no need to redefine it - everyone knows that one part of the Trinity is called the "Holy Spirit." Third, it places a narrow description (guardian) upon the Holy Spirit that simply fails to even come close to all that the Holy Spirit does. Finally, it is a phrase that sounds VERY new age, and would be gladly and wholeheartedly welcomed by the eastern religion/new age element of our culture. We should not be trying to make Christianity easier to ignore because it uses new age terminology (and thus is just "another" way to god), but rather, more distinct and separate from the ideas and titles of false religions. Calling the Holy Spirit by a different name because we are not happy with what the Bible actually says is NOT a conservative thing to do; that simply smacks of liberalism in the extreme.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 10:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:42 ==

I would like to suggest here that for clarity, we give BOTH the common transliteration and the translation of "petros": "...you shall be called Cephas or Peter (the Rock)." For those who are new to scripture, that would just bring some clarity as to where the name "Peter" came from. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 10:31, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== John 2:1 ==

Would 2:1 be a little clearer if it were changed to something along the lines of 'A few days later...'? I took 'third day' to mean either the third day of the week or, possibly, the 3rd day after 1:51.

: Your suggestion is a good one, but I'm reluctant to remove information that is in the Greek. But certainly the reference to the third day could be clarified in some way for the reader, and I encourage you to do so by editing it.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:11, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

:: I slid this down so it falls under the heading for 2:1, and fits more chronologically. I apologize if this is not allowed by a non-administrator. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:02, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

Doesn't "''the third day''" mean "'''two''' days later" instead of "'''three''' days later" because of the custom of counting inclusively?
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting#Inclusive_counting for details.

: Your point is an excellent one, not because of your site, but because Christ rose on the "third day" (which was two days after Friday).--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:08, 7 October 2009 (EDT)

== 2:23 ==

It is not actually the Greek of this sentence that reveals their faith was superficial, but Jesus' reaction to their "faith" that is illuminating. Jesus understood that their faith was fleeting and transitory, which by definition means it was superficial. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:02, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 2:24-25 ==

The Greek word translated "understood" in V24 and "knew" in V25 is "ginosko," and is deeper than just "knowing"; it means, "to perceive, to understand, to know absolutely." The point here is that Jesus was sinless and innocent, but He was NOT naive. He understood the fickleness and evil that men were capable of, no matter what they "confessed" to believe. A simple "confession of faith" did not equal true believer, and did not mean the faith was sincere. The word translated "believed" in verse 23 and "confidence" in verse 24 is pisteuo, which is the standard word in the NT for "to believe in, to have faith in." In verse 24 the construction indicates more of it's root meaning of "complete confidence, totally sure." They expressed faith in Him, but He had no confidence in them.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:00, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:1 ==

Calling Nicodemus an "ανθρωπος εκ των φαρισαιων" (man from the pharisees), rather than just calling him a "pharisee" outright is another way of indicating that Nicodemus was different from most Pharisees. He might have agreed with much of their beliefs, but he was not really LIKE them, particularly in terms of his sincerity and devotion to God.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:19, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

: The term "Pharisee" seems overused in English translations. Few realize the significance, or what was meant by it. How about "intellectual" for some of these references?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:25, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

:: That is not a bad idea, given our cultural understanding of "intellectual," but for now I am sticking with Pharisee for purely historical reasons relating to the fact that Israeli religious thought was divided in to two major (Pharisee and Saducee) and a few minor (such as Essene and Zealot) divisions. The differences in the doctrines of these sects really does play an important role in what is happening at times (such as when Paul realizes he is being judged by a mixed group of Pharisees and Saducees, and uses their primary doctrinal dispute to cause an immediate division within those judging him). Distinguishing between these two groups in particular is important often enough that there is no real way around preserving them, particularly if we want to keep some portions of the text understandable.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:51, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:2 ==

Again, we see that when John wants to put emphasis on "this very same individual (as the previous verse)" he uses "houtos" (just as he did in 1:2).[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:25, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:3 ==

"αμην αμην" at the start of a quote ("truly, truly" here and again in verse 5 and 11) is a Jewish idiom (originating from the Hebrew and moving into the Greek via the Aramaic) that serves as a strong admonition to pay VERY close attention to what is about to be said. It is kind of like: "if you don't hear anything else, hear this..." or "pay VERY close attention to what I am about to say," or as Matthew Quigley (from the movie "Quigley Down Under") might say, "this is for sure and for certain...". It is worth noting that Jesus used this idiom THREE times in his conversation with Nicodemus, a pattern later repeated when speaking in the presence of opponents (John chapters 5, 6, and 8) and with His disciples at the last supper (chapter 13). [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:41, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== anothen: From above or again ==

According to Strong's Concordance, anothen means from above; from the first, or anew. Anothen comes from ano, which means upward or on the top. According to Strong's, the only verses anothen is translated as again is at John 3:3 and 3:7, and at Galatians 4:9. In Galatians 4:9, Paul asked them why they are turning back to "weak and miserable principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again?" (NIV Interlinear) But most of the time, when anothen is translated in the KJV, it is translated as "from above". In John 3:31, the KJV reads "He that cometh from above is above all". At John 19:11, Jesus, facing Pilate, tells Pilate that he has no power over him unless it comes "from above". At James 1:17, we are told that every gift and every good comes down "from above". And at James 3:15, we are told that earthly wisdom does not come "from above". From these examples, we can see that anothen has been translated both as "again" and as "from above". But looking back at John 3:3 and 3:7, especially in light of John 3:31 and the two verse from James, it really would appear that Jesus means for anothen to mean "from above". Nicodemus could just be dense and/or boorish. Or he could also simply not understand what Jesus is saying, as his response seems to show: "How can a man be born when he is old? Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb to be born?" (v. 3:4/ NIV Interlinear) Nicodemus is obviously taking anothen to mean "again", while Jesus means "from above". - Danielitld

: Which is more or less the point I made in the analysis of John 3:3. Clearly Nicodemus did not understand what Jesus was talking about, either spiritually or linguistically, thus his assumption that Jesus used anothen in the sense of "again." It is interesting that Jesus did not correct Nicodemus' linguistic error, but actually skipped right over it and went straight to the issue of spiritual birth. Jesus never was interested in word games, and seemed to operate from the assumption that people would not understand what He was talking about (particularly illustrated by His surprise when someone DID understand His point), thus His habit of NOT explaining Himself when people misunderstood him. Very interesting indeed. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:21, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:5 ==

It is common to interpret "born of water" to mean "physical birth," meaning, unless someone has a physical birth and then a spiritual birth, they cannot enter the kingdom of God. The problem is that the construction indicates that if EITHER one is missing, you cannot enter the kingdom of God. So if either one can be missing, then the "born from water" could be the part that is missing. This would mean that physical birth is a necessity of salvation, which could be interpreted to mean that an unborn child that dies in the womb (and thus, has not been truly "born of water") is doomed to hell. It is much more likely that Jesus is using "water" as it is usually used in scripture: as a symbol of spiritual cleansing, which causes this to parallel what Jesus did for us. His death paid the penalty for our sin (water - cleansing) and His resurrection gave us new life (spirit - life). We need BOTH cleansing and new life to enter the kingdom of God; one or the other alone will not cut it.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 4:05, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:16 ==

Many translations render this verse "For God loved the world SO MUCH that . . . ", but that is incorrect. οὕτω does not indicate the DEGREE of something, but the MEANS or METHOD of something. So this verse is not telling us HOW MUCH God loved the world, but rather, the WAY God SHOWED His love for the world: by sending His only Son to die so that we could gain eternal life. In other words, agape is demonstrated by what you DO, not by how you FEEL, and God is the ultimate example of agape. No one's life is changed by how you FEEL about them, their life is changed by what you DO about it.

It should be noted that the phrase "whoever believes in Him '''should''' not perish" is not expressing a wish (as in, "if all goes well, this SHOULD work"), but rather, as the result phrase in a purpose clause, is stating a fact that WILL happen if the conditional (believe in Jesus) is met.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:12, 20 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:34 ==

The last clause indicates that God gave the Holy Spirit to Jesus without measure, but I am reluctant to change all Greek negatives into positives, as they do not always mean the same thing. "Do not do to others what you don't want done to you" does not mean the same thing as "Do to others what you want done to you." [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:36, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

== 4:1 ==

The two oldest copies of John, P66 and P75, as well as three of the four oldest full bibles found so far (Alexandrinus, Vaticanus, and Ephraemi Rescriptus) all have "Lord" at the beginning of this verse. Of the earliest witnesses, only Sinaiticus has "Jesus" here. Based on this, we are going with "Lord." [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:17, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

== 4:9 ==

The word used here, συγχράομαι, is an extreme word that includes any kind of interaction, communication, or contact. She is so used to being shunned by Jews that the very fact that Jesus even acknowledged her presence, much less actually spoke to her, not to mention asking her for some of her water, challenges everything she has come to expect out of life, and completely rocks her world. Isn't it interesting how a few simple words, the slightest courtesy, can have such a strong response in those who are used to being hurt and discarded by others? Jesus did this kind of thing all the time (here He does it with a simple request for water, earlier, in his conversation with Nicodemus, He did it with a simple statement about new birth). Don't ever let the assumptions or expectations of culture stand in the way of speaking the gentle, loving Truth of the gospel. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:07, 23 October 2009 (EDT)

== 4:32 ==

I fascinates me how Jesus never let personal discomfort (hunger, thirst, exhaustion) hinder Him from using the circumstances around Him to teach spiritual truths. That is both amazing selflessness and very good self discipline. A good lesson for me.

== 4:34 ==

This is actually a purpose clause ("hina" plus subjunctive), yet I've never seen any version that translated it that way. Part of the reason is that it is difficult to translate the way the construction is used in this verse into English. The construction of this sentence places the entire predicate ("doing the will of the one who sent me and completing His work") in the purpose clause. The problem is that there is nothing prior to the purpose clause ("I did this" IN ORDER TO "accomplish that"), indicating that He is giving the purpose of His life, not of one particular action. In other words, "my food" does not just mean "this is what nourishes me," but more accurately, "this is the purpose of my life, this is my reason for living." Difficult to catch and translate into English, but very clear in the Greek. I have tried to illustrate this construction by adding "dedicating my life to", which is technically a translation of the construction, not of any particular words.

:That's a fascinating analysis, and your solution is an excellent one. I'll think if there is any way to suggest an improvement on the English to fully reflect the purpose clause.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:33, 31 October 2009 (EDT)

== Aramaic solution to "Logos" controversy? ==

I think that the way out into the open clear might be through the pass of the Aramaic understanding:

The Hebrew text of Scriptures is very clear in visualizing the God of Israel in physical terms, even if meant to be understood metaphorically. But the Aramaic Jewish translations of the Hebrew Scriptures (Torah/ Targum Onkelos) will not allow it to be so presented, but will rather speak around it (paraphrase) or use an intermediary word between the physical description and God. In the Hebrew text of Genesis 32, Jacob is wrestling with "a man" but after the bout, Jacob says, in the original Hebrew text, "I have seen God face to face and my life has been saved". In the Aramaic translation, however, Jacob is made to say, " I have seen the ''angel'' of God face to face and my life has been saved". At times, the intermediary word is actually the word "Word" - in Aramaic, ''Memra'' (the root is Aleph, Mem, Resh as in the Hebrew word 'Omer). Again, whereas the Hebrew text (Gen. 3:8) has it, "They (Adam and Eve) heard the sound of the LORD God walking about in the garden", the Aramaic has it, "they heard the sound of the ''Memra'' (Word) of the LORD God walking about in the garden" Apparently, walking about in the garden conjured up too much of rustling of leaves and bushes to take figuratively, and so it was the "Memra" of the Lord God that was heard and not the LORD God Himself. This is the pattern in other places in Genesis. An Orthodox Jew, Prof. David Flusser of the Hebrew University (now deceased), notes that it is to this mindset that we owe our understanding of John 1:1 and not to Philo and the Alexandrian "logos" philosophy. "In the beginning was the Word (Memra) and the Word (Memra) was with God.. and the Word (Memra) was God. John 1:1, Flusser maitains, is meant to rip away the distinction between God and the Memra, so assiduously held to by contemporary Judaism, and so declare that they, the Memra and God, are in reality one, ...and this One has, indeed, come down and has become flesh of our flesh and bone of our bone. John, in his epistle, would later say in wonderment, " Whom we have handled, we have touched and held Him."

In this view, the Word (Memr'a) is used, not to "mediate" God (or the knowledge of God) to man, but to say that God, needing no mediator, has Himself come down to us and incarnate, in the flesh, has made himself known. How to translate? Not easy as "Memr'a" is being purposely used as a literary device to destroy its former use of keeping God at an untoubable and unknowable distance. A weak comparison but the only one coming to me now " O.k. (to a blind person wanting to know what I look like but too shy to feel my face), so don't touch my face, just touch this hanky (which I put on my face) and feel around," Sounds pretty weak now, come to think of it, but Aramaic Judaism was very "shy" on anthropomorphizing God, and John, too polite to refute directly was nevertheless insistant on what was the truth, and so his way of taking what they believed and pressing on the face of Jesus so that they could touch and feel. This fits into recent (in decades) work that places John into 1st century time (by Dead Sea Scrolls terminology and language) and rediscovering the corpus of Aramaic literature (with its linguistic connections to John) in the first century context - all giving credence to the Gospel of John having "apologetic" force in ''1st century'' Judaism. Perhaps this is the accurate way to translate John 1:1 into English. It is accurate, but who can bear it? "In the beginning was the "Concealing Word" of God, and this Word was with God, and that Word was in actuality God Himself and thus has become the Revealing Word...and He became man [[User:BertSchlossberg|Bert Schlossberg]] 20:05, 1 November 2009 (EST)

: A decent explanation, but not a great translation. Your suggestion crosses over into translation commentary (i.e. transitioning from "concealing word" to "revealing word"), rather than strict idiomatic translation, and would better serve as a footnote on John 1:1 than a translation of the verse. I also think that while this gospel certainly would impact Jews, the evidence through out John's gospel points to it having been written with Greeks in mind, not Jews (unlike Matthew, for example). Thus, the secret to truly understanding what John was saying is unlikely to be found in Aramaic language parallels or Jewish thought. Greeks would have no knowledge of this Aramaic/Jewish explanation, and would be very unlikely to have made any of these connections.
: I do not dispute anything you say about the Jewish mind, and their understanding of God and of memr'a, I simply point out that this gospel was clearly written in Greek to Greek speaking gentiles, not to Jews, so the secret to a more accurate translation of John's words in 1:1 is not going to be found in Jewish understanding. [[User:MBack|Michael Back]] 2:12, November 2, 2009 (EST)

Michael, no question that the Gospel of John was written in Greek. Do you think that there is any indication of "Jewish interest" within John to warrant consideration that it was written to Hellenized and Greek speaking Jews (or with these Jews in mind), of which, I understand, there were considerable numbers, both within the Church (Book of the Acts) and without? I saya this because a Greek understanding Hellenized yet conversanbt with the Judaism, both
Aramaic and Hebrew did exist and they could be the "target population" as well as the Gentile for the Gospel of John. Cyrus Gordon hs shown that in the time of the Philistines, one of the 5 Greek tribes of the Peoples of the Sea, Greek also invaded the Hebrew language, such as "seren" instead of "melekh" (king) for ruiler of the 5 Greek city states of Canaan - "seren" coming from the Greek Tyranos (Tyrant), cov'a the philiistine head gear coming in as "hat" in Hebrew, etc. Likewise, in the 1sst century, there were Greek proselytes [who became Rabbis with their followers), and
Greek words invaded Hebrew and Aramaic like "nomos" (law, reulatoru principle)) becoming "nimusiin" (manners), as well as the skillful use of Greek in the Midrashic Targums (Bereshit Rabba)- the Midrash sees father and son somehow both participating in the sacrifice to be, even by implication and hint. The Bible - Isaac: "BEHOLD, THE FIRE AND THE WOOD, BUT WHERE IS THE LAMB OF SACRIFICE?" (the Hebrew word for "lamb is 'seh') Abraham: "GOD WILL SEE TO THE LAMB OF SACRIFICE, MY SON." (here be it noted that the Greek word for "you" is "se"(accusative case) sounding exactly like the Hebrew word for "lamb"). So the Midrash adds in the mind of Abraham "And if God will not provide a lamb (Hebrew - seh) for the sacrifice, then it is you(Greek - se), Thou are that sacrifice, my son!" I think from all this that Dr. Flusser may be right. There were a szeable number of hellenized Greek Jews both in an out of the Church that would have well understood John 1:1 according to the Aramic understanding presented above.
[User:BertSchlossberg|Bert Schlossberg]] 03:40, 2 November 2009 (EST)

About Flusser phttp://www.jerusalemperspective.com/Default.aspx?tabid=27&ArticleID=1612[[User:BertSchlossberg|Bert Schlossberg]] 09:54, 2 November 2009 (EST)

This discussion of the logos is certainly becoming fascinating. When I consider the difficulty we have had coming to terms with it, and the difficulty many have had with it, I began to wonder if the use of the term logos was an unfortunate event thrust upon us initially by Heraclitus. As Karl Jaspers pointed out, not even Heraclitus explicitly defined it, while Edward Hussey stated that he "end[ed] with a central difficulty that leaves things more mysterious than before". Philo, Ronald Williamson tells us, used the term logos "very frequently", but "partly because the ideas it was used to express are difficult and complex ones, and partly because Philo's own thought is also profound and complex, it is difficult to give a clear and coherent statement of Philo's thought in this area". Williamson even adds parenthetically "if indeed it can be said that he had a single Logos doctrine". In stating that "one god there is", Xenophanes reasoned that it was "contrary to divine law" that gods should be ruled by another god since it was contradictory that "gods should have masters". (Hussey, p. 13-14) But in attempting to imagine how the one god interacts with and brings order to the world, did the Greeks simply replace "the gods" with the logos? If that is the case, then why should we give the logos any more credence then we would "the gods"?

That said, John's use of the term logos would certainly have been familiar to his Greek-speaking audience. When Jesus said that we must be born "from above", someone familiar with Stoicism, like Marcus Aurelius, could well have responded with "what is born of the earth to the earth returns; but what is born from above, to heaven returns". But John's gospel would not have said too much unfamiliar to a Jewish audience, either. Frank Kermode in his essay on John's gospel in The Literary Guide to the Bible, mentions the times that John alluded to Scriptural texts without acknowledging them. References to sheep and shepherds, Kermode writes, are derived from Ezekiel 34, "but John does not say so, preferring to work the allusions into a highly developed parable . . in which Jesus himself is (ego eimi) shepherd . ." The parable of the vine in John 15 "is adapted without acknowledgment from Psalm 80". As Bert Schlossberg said, such unacknowledged allusions may have been noticed by a Gentile who was interested in Judaism. But a Jew would no doubt notice it. Similarly, such a Gentile and a Jew would have noticed a similarity between Philo's use of the term logos, and John's.

Seeing how the LXX translated the "word" of God in the Hebrew text as the logos of God prompted Philo to use the term as well, according to Williamson. But Philo would have also been aware that the idea of the logos mirrored the wisdom of God. The wisdom of God had many of the same "attributes and functions" as the logos of God, as found in the Hebrew text at Psalm 104:24, and Proverbs 3:19. But it was also in Ecclesiasticus and the Wisdom of Solomon where the qualities of Wisdom could be compared with the logos. In the Wisdom of Solomon we read that Wisdom is the "fashioner of all things"; "the breath of the power of God". (7:22, 24-25) But what made the logos win out over wisdom was most likely that logos is masculine, while wisdom - sophia - is feminine, making it "much more useful because of its masculinity to both Jewish and Christian writers in the first century AD" - according to Williamson (p. 104-5) If John was one of those first century writers so influenced, then it is easy to see how his reading of the Wisdom of Solomon 9:15 - substituting logos for wisdom - could have influenced his gospel: "For a perishable body weighs down the soul, And its earthly tent burdens the thoughtful mind". In his gospel, verse 1:14, John wrote that the logos became flesh, and "pitched its tent" among us. John may have been communicating to both a Greek and Jewish audience in terms that they would understand. But he was also deeply influenced by both the Greek and Jewish world in which he lived, and which helped shape his gospel. - Danielitld

Talk:John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-10-23T13:48:36Z

Danielitld: /* Truth or word */

Talk:Matthew 1-9 (Translated)

2009-10-21T12:32:12Z

Danielitld: /* Matthew 1:23 */ new section

== Question: Divine Guardian ==
I'm curious why "Holy Ghost" was translated as "Divine Guardian" (Matt 1:18). What is the thinking here? Why not choose a phrase like "Holy Spirit" which might better suggest both his connection to the Holy Trinity and also his spirit nature.
Just curious.
:See [[Talk:Gospel of Mark (Translated)#Holy Spirit|the discussion]] which led to this change. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 15:56, 7 October 2009 (EDT)
:Thanks. [[User:JohnBennett|JohnBennett]]

Having already stated my position on the [[Talk:Conservative Bible Project]] page, including that a word for word type translation can overall be the only faithful one, believing even the precise meaning of individual words is critical, here is my input so far on selected verses,

Mt. 1:1 This leaves out ''book'', bib'-los, which is in the Gk., as if that was superfluous. Worse, ''son'' is replaced with the liberal gender-neutral ''descendant''. This sets a bad precedent, as if "sent His only begotten decedent" might be acceptable.

Mt. 1:2 "Abraham begat Isaac" vs "Abraham was the father of Isaac" The latter conceivably allows for adoption.

1:18 ''pregnant with the child of the Divine Guide'' (really!) Likewise in v.20, 3:11, etc.) Using Divine for the Holy (''hagios'', otherwise translated in KJV as holy, or saints) disregards His specifically denoted sanctity (which liberals dislike, and do not consider God that holy). Also, ''Guide'' for ''Ghost'' interprets breath as according to His guiding function, while His primary distinctive effect in the N.T. is that of giving life, a purely Divine attribute, and which the human pneuma also denotes. "The body without the spirit is dead". (Jn. 2:26). The ''Holy Spirit'' best denotes both His sanctity and nature, and should remain unchanged.

1:19 ''Jospeh'', typo. ''Wished'' is a poor choice for ''minded'' - boo'-lom-ahee Middle voice of a primary verb; to “will”. "Make a wish and blow out the candle" indicates superficiality. [Strongly] desired would have more substance.

1:24 ''and wed Mary''. Married is clearer to the young.

2:7 "which would announce Christ's birth." This is not in the original, and though it is not inaccurate, such supplied words should be placed in ''italics'' or [brackets] (i notice both used in other places) so the reader can distinguish between God's word and mans helpful additions.

2:12 Analysis: "That God gave the warning directly is an assumption. That God was instrumental in the giving of that warning is certainly a safe assumption. " That leans toward liberal Deism. The text states that "being warned of God in a dream." That God purposely gave them a dream to warn them is conveyed a fact, not an assumption.

3:3 cf. Is. 40:3. Infers Jesus Deity.

3:7 "You jerks! Who has warned you to flee from the divine sentence that's coming to you? ''Jerks'' for ''generation of vipers[snakes]'', is hardly fitting, while ''divine sentence'' is hardly as strong as ''wrath'', which liberals would avoid, and ''wrath'' (orgē ) denotes what manner of ''sentence'' it will be.

5:4 "Blessed are the sad". ''Mourn'' better denotes continuous grieving, which is the thought here, not simply being emotionally ''sad'', which lacks continuity. Mourn is used 45 times in the KJV.

5:6 "hunger and thirst for justice". Justice denotes things like social equality, and is used by liberal social gospel advocates, while righteousness (Dikaiosunē) denotes a personal condition of heart, satisfaction coming in Christ. (Rm. 4) These saying are best seen as relating to Psa 34:18: "The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit." Some other modern translations even use justice in Rm. 4 and that is a poor rendering for today. Dikaiosunē Total KJV Occurrences: 93 righteousness, 91

5:9 Likewise. Liberals are not persecuted for standing for moral righteousness, but promote justice as in equal rights for immorality. Those who oppose them see this verse fulfilled.

5:22 ''Moron'' rather than ''fool''. Denotes "A person of subnormal intelligence," but do not use in other places where it is about being a fool, as being foolish.

6:16 "I tell you truly: they will get what's coming to them." Not will have, but have. Reward is not the that difficult a word, and should be used for the sake of consistency. misthos Total KJV Occurrences: 29: reward, 24 hire, 3 wages, 2.

6:22 "your whole body will be bright", versus "full of light". "Full of" is not in the Gk, but light is correct, as it relates to spiritually speaking, inwardly, and light is a powerful and abundantly used metaphor in the N.T. This verse correlates to 2Cor. 4:6; Heb. 12:2

"Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." vs "The bad things that happen today are enough to worry about today." . A day's evil is enough ''for itself.'' [[User:Daniel1212|Daniel1212]] 19:47, 10 October 2009 (EDT)

== Matthew 1:23 ==

Was Jesus born of a virgin? In the analysis segment of the translation, it states that Matthew refers to Isaiah 7:14 from the Greek LXX. The LXX translated the Hebrew word almah in Isaiah 7:14 as parthenos. But while parthenos may mean virgin in Greek, almah in Hebrew means young woman. Betulah is the Hebrew word used to mean virgin. In Genesis 24:16, where Abraham's servant was sent to find a wife for Isaac, Rebekah is described as a "maiden [who] was very beautiful, a virgin [betulah] whom no man had known". (From the JPS Torah Commentary) The word maiden here is naarah, which Strong's defines as a young, adolescent girl. It might be assumed that she is a virgin, yet the text further explains that she is a virgin, and then qualifies that with the phrase "whom no man had known". Nahum Sarna, in the JPS Torah Commentary, writes that even betulah by itself doesn't connote a virgin without a qualifying phrase, as in Gen. 24:16. He mentions Joel 1:8, where a betulah laments the husband of her youth. He also cites "an Aramaic incantation text [that] speaks of a 'bethultha' who is pregnant". When Isaiah wrote that an "almah shall conceive and bear a son", without using any qualifying phrases that even the term betulah seems to require to connote a virgin, can we then say that Isaiah was foreseeing a virgin birth? Was Matthew reading too much into the Greek word parthenos? Comments? - Danielitld

Talk:John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-10-20T01:35:38Z

Danielitld: /* anothen: From above or again */ new section

== Logos = the Word ==

There really shouldn't be much of a debate over using "Truth" or "Word" in John 1:1. In the Greek text, the word logos is used, which refers to something being said. Hence "Word" is better than "Truth". Also, truth in Greek is aletheia, and that word is not in the text.
:I do not think word or truth are all that great. Both fail to capture the connotation in λόγος of that which is being spoken of, mandate, law decree. Word is one literal translation of λόγος but without the idiomatic meaning people may or may not actually derive from John 1:1 it's still just a literal translation. Truth does not even weakly refer to that which is being spoken of except to editorialize by making a judgment (calling the mandate a truth, which of course it is but this doesn't capture the meaning of the words in Greek). Word is fine if you want to be a literalist about it because that is literally what λόγος means. But if you want some poetry in a Bible that's accurate and a pleasure to read, you could refer to the λόγος being a causal necessity, mandate, law, etc. because what I take John 1:1 to be saying very beautifully is that God was always there, even at the beginning and that it couldn't have been any other way. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 11:15, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

:: This is a fascinating dilemma. The unsigned first comment above fails to address how the term "word" is diluted in modern English. But the second comment above seems to downplay be the strong commonality between λόγος and the modern meaning of Truth. Still, I agree we should search for a better term.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:23, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

:::Truth doesn't seem to be an apt term here though, logos as word here is more of a ordering, rational force, which makes sense given the audience that John was writing this gospel for. To translate it as truth doesn't do justice to what logos fully means. Aletheia, a word for truth is a truth of disclosure, something 'exposes' itself to be true to one. Heidegger uses this idea to great effect in his 'Intro to Metaphysics.' Truth for the Greeks wouldn't have been logos. I prefer the translation of logos=reason or ordering force.--[[User:Rcgallup|Rcgallup]] 11:39, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

::::There is no Greek word for "Truth" with a capital "T". "λόγος" is probably the closest substitute John could find. As to "reason" or "ordering force," they seem to lack the spiritual side, which Truth captures better.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:43, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

== Truth or word ==
While I agree "truth" has too narrow a meaning, at first glance, it may serve the purpose well when explained properly. Sadly, many Christians believe that "word" refers to the Bible itself, rather than the deep concept of ''logos''. Is there a better term than either? Message? [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 22:12, 26 August 2009 (EDT)
:I'm not a Greek scholar, but λογος, as I understand it, had an enormous range of implications in first century Greek, deeply rooted in a Greek culture which held all reality to be logical and ordered, and flowing from logic and order. While truth is being used now, I think we would be hard pressed to find a single word which encompasses all the meaning and implications of λογος. The question we must ask ourselves, is how much of the beauty of the first passage(s) of John are we willing sacrifice to give a completely accurate translation? If we don't care at all for the prose, perhaps John 1:1 might better read, "In the beginning was truth, reason, wisdom, and harmony, and all this was with God for this is what God is." A suggestion. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 17:10, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
::Whoops, sorry for putting the comment Re 1:9 in the wrong place. Feel free to just delete it if you want. --[[User:MarkGall|MarkGall]] 17:28, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
:::The more foundational question that needs to be decided here is whether this is going to be a dynamic paraphrase, or a strict translation. In other words, are we attempting to relate what the Greek actually SAYS, or are we attempting to explain what we believe it MEANS? If this is a strict translation, then using "truth" in John 1:1 is not an option, as the word "aletheia" does not appear in that verse. Like it or not, we are stuck with legitimate translations of logos: "word, message, reason, communication, thought, etc." If, however, this is more of a dynamic paraphrase, then we are not restricted by what the Greek actually says, and are free to use whatever words we need to "explain" what the Greek means. In that case, we can describe the force and meaning of logos in our "translation." As it stands right now, this is something of an odd cross between a translation and a paraphrase. So we need a philosophy of translation that goes beyond "conservative" and guides us in how strict or loose we are allowed to be in this re-translation. That alone would settle many of these translation disputes. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]]

::::We're doing a "thought-for-thought" translation. That's not a paraphrase, but that's not tied down by literalism either.

::::That said, I'm not entirely comfortable with "truth", as it has harsh connotations that are contrary to forgiveness. "Word" does have advantages, but it is so diluted. This debate may continue on.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:06, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

::::: Commenting further on this, an imprecision is introduced in the Greek when John chose the best word available to him for what he wanted to say (which would not necessarily be perfect), and then on the English side we have dictionaries for translating that word which become quickly out of date as meanings shift. The meaning of "word" today is not the same as 20 years ago, and certainly not the same as 400 years ago. Today "word" makes one think of one solitary word that someone might type into a computer or send on twitter or texting. Pre-computers, "word" didn't mean that in English, and 400 years ago it probably had an entirely different connotation.

::::: A collaborative, wiki-based approach is very sell suited to reducing and eliminating these imprecisions, as many people can analyze both the Greek and the English in an effort to communicate the original intent.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 19:32, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::: I've been struggling with this for quite some time (long before I learned of this project). The fundamental problem here is that English simply does not have a word that comes anywhere close to the way John is using logos in this context. His usage directly challenged the Greek concept of logos (by making it PERSONAL - the logos itself created, and was both WITH God and WAS God), meaning that he was, in effect, giving it a brand new meaning BASED upon the Greek definition. So here is what we have: the logos starts as a Greek term referring to all that can be thought and communicated, and was, in ideal form, equated with "the contents, thoughts and communications of a god." The idea being that any true thing that could be learned, communicated, acted upon, written, or discovered, the gods already knew. John took this one step further with "ο λογος ην προς τον θεον," which is a nonsense statement. How could the logos NOT be with (or in agreement with) god if it is in his mind? But John repeats this in verse two, making it clear that this was no accident. THEN he goes one step further and makes it clear he intends for this logos to be taken personally by the use of houtos in verse two, and by attributing creation directly to the logos in verse three. This logos was much more than the logos of the Greeks, it was ALIVE and POWERFUL in its own right. Further, it somehow was both GOD and WITH God at the same time. Then John slams the lid on his new definition with verse 14, where the logos becomes FLESH (sarx). Absolutely IMPOSSIBLE according to the Greek understanding of this word. Likewise, impossible to relate with any current word in the English dictionary. So, there is no possible way that we will ever find an English word that can relate what John meant with logos. The most we can ever hope for is a rough approximation that might capture a hint of what logos is. Every suggestion will be lacking in some way. Traditionally, logos has been translated with "word," which was ALWAYS lacking, and is even more so now, for all the reasons we have seen. But frankly, "word" is no worse than "message," "Truth," "logic," "reason," or any other option, all for different reasons, of course.
:::::: With all of this in mind, I have opted for a different "combination" translation. This mixes the traditional translation with John's radical new concept of a living, personal logos. I believe it solves the problems presented by modern understandings of the meaning of "word" while preserving John's core intent, will be an interesting take for new believers, and keeping it recognizable to those who have been in the faith for a long time. It is not perfect by any means (as I said, I do not believe there is a perfect choice), but I would like all of you who are reading and participating in this to take a few days and dwell on it. I'm not claiming that this settles the discussion; far from it, I hope it moves it forward. My suggestion is "living Word." [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:01, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::::I like "living Word" very, very much. That may well be the optimal choice.

:::::::In the meantime I stumbled across John 17:17, where he says: "ἁγίασον αὐτοὺς ἐν τῇ ἀληθείᾳ: ὁ λόγος ὁ σὸς ἀλήθειά ἐστιν." This seems to support the "Truth" interpretation of "λόγος". Most translate the second half as "your word is the truth," but I wonder if a more straightforward translation would be "your truth is the word." The latter translation would serve as John's own redefinition of "λόγος" as "Truth".--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:18, 17 October 2009 (EDT)

:::::::: The best translation here would be "Your word is Truth" (since you could give aletheia the article and still preserve the subject-predicate identification), keeping in mind that the absence of the article here does NOT mean "a lesser truth." "Your truth is the word" is not an option for the following reason: In a predicate phrase where one noun has the article and the other does not, the subject is the noun with the article, and the predicate is the noun without the article. The word order in John 17:17 is more or less neutral word order, with no particular emphasis.
:::::::: John 1:1, for example, reads "θεος ην ο λογος," and since logos has the article while theos does not, it can only be translated "the Living Word was God," not "God was the Living Word." The order reversal is to place extra emphasis on "God" so that no one thinks it means "a god," while making it subtly distinct from "ton theon" in the previous clause. Thus, this construction says that the logos is THEOS (the emphasis tells us the logos is FULLY God), but is somehow different from "ton theon" (the Father). By giving the article to logos without giving it to theos, logos is preserved as the subject and theos can be moved forward for emphasis. BTW, if both nouns have the article, the rule is that the first one is the subject and the second is the predicate.
:::::::: Manipulating word order and the articles in John 1:1 would lead to subtly different meanings of that last clause:
:::::::: ο λογος ο θεος ην = The Living word is The God (Jesus and the Father are the SAME individual - Sabellianism)
:::::::: ο λογος θεος ην = Although not manditory, this one "could" be interpreted as "The Living Word was a god." (less than the Father - Arianism)
:::::::: However, θεος ην ο λογος in the context of the first two clauses can ONLY mean that the Living Word, Jesus, is fully and completely God, but is somehow different from the Father (thus, the Trinity). [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:33, 18 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:2 ==

The entire purpose of verse two is emphasis, and some of that is lost in this translation. "All this" is not the best translation to relate the force of "houtos" in this construction. In verse 2 "houtos" is serving as an emphatic form of "autos," placing extra emphasis on "this '''SAME''' individual..." The purpose here is to emphasize the personal nature of the logos in verse one. "This same one," or even "this very same one" or something like that would be better. As it stands now, "all this" does exactly the opposite of what the Greek is attempting to relate: it DE-PERSONALIZES the logos from verse one, which is actually a more "liberal" approach to this verse. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:08, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: You're a genius, Mback! Changed as suggested.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:09, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:3 ==

P66 has "outen" (nothing) in this verse while P75 has "oute hen" (not one thing), which is simply a more emphatic form of "outen." Our translation suggests we are going with the Greek in P75 (wise choice, given that p66 has 5 times as many copy errors as p75), and if that is the case, we should keep the emphatic nature of the words found there. "Not one thing" or "not one single thing" relates the emphatic force of the Greek much better than "no thing." The repetition of "ginomai" is also a function of emphasis, but, again, depending on how strict we are going to be, we probably can get away with dropping the last "that has been made" in this verse, as this translation does. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:21, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Mback, you're obviously brilliant, knowledgeable and meticulous. I made your change here but please feel free to edit any of the translations directly yourself, along with your highly informative comments!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:13, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

:: Wow. I am humbled and honored by your words and confidence. I promise you that anything I do will be done prayerfully and with full consideration to the thoughts and ideas of everyone contributing. Thank you, sir. [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:25, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:4 ==

I don't see any reason why we can't do a better job of distinguishing between "dzoe" and "bios." How about something like, "He was the source of real life..." or "Real life was found only in Him, and ..."? [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:43, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:5 ==

While this verse definitely has many different modern translations, "snuff it out" is an idiom, not a defined "dictionary" word. That phrase gives this a strong "Message paraphrase" feel, as opposed to a more scholarly, exacting translation. Is that what we want? I have no problem with idioms, but in a strict translation, you usually limit the use of idioms in English to places where idioms occur in the Greek (which, admittedly, is fairly common). [[user:Mback|Michael Back]] 12:52, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Interesting point. Thanks. I'll check out your other suggestions also.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:34, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:7 ==

Note that the use of "houtos" in this verse is similar to how John uses it in verse two. John uses it as a more emphatic form of "autos," emphasizing that "this SAME John who was just mentioned in the previous sentence" is the one being referenced here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:9 ==

"Animates" is not a good translation of photidzo, but it is a marginally adequate paraphrase, if we are OK with the fact that it changes the flow of John's argument. Strictly speaking, in modern English "animates" references "giving life to" or "bringing to life." The problem is that our translation takes the REVERSE meaning of verse four, which tells us that the real life He had within Him gave light to men. The current translation of this verse reverses that, and says the light from Him gives life. We could argue that this is still a true statement, but being a true statement, and being an accurate translation of the verse is not the same thing. Reversing the statement of verse four is NOT what the Greek is intending here. This verse is a follow up to the previous verses contrasting light with darkness, and photidzo specifically is "to enlighten, to bring into the light, to illuminate, to shine a light upon." The point of this verse is supposed to be that the true light brings us out of darkness, NOT that it gives us life. There is a difference between translating a verse into an English statement that just happens to be true, versus translating it into an English statement that actually relates what the verse SAYS, and is also true. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 1:55, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:1 and 1:14 ==

Using "Truth" for λογος in 1:1 but then "spirit" in 1:14 is not theologically sound. In the KJV, we have "the Word was God ... and the Word was made flesh" which indisputably places Jesus as being God. Changing from "Truth" to "spirit" breaks that link between the two and can mislead readers into a sub-Arian interpretation where Jesus is the son and messenger of God rather than being God Incarnate in human form.

: I agree completely. Whatever word we use for "logos" in verse 1 HAS to be used here. John's phrasing in this verse is NOT just to make a vague comment about "the spirit" becoming flesh (which is actually a very liberal, new age way of looking at this verse), but rather, specifically that the logos of verse 1, who is both "with" God and "is" God, became flesh. It is my understanding that a conservative translation would emphasize the "incarnate God" aspect of Jesus' birth, as opposed to de-emphasizing it, which is what this translation currently does. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:07, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:16 ==

Translating "lambano" as "benefited" is certainly unusual, but can only be considered "appropriate" if our translation guidelines are "very, very loose paraphrase." Lambano never has the meaning of "benefits" anywhere in the New Testament. Is the EFFECT of "receiving" beneficial? Absolutely. But the "effect" of the word and the "meaning" of the word are not the same thing. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:27, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:18 ==

Using "spoken of" for "exegeomai" is a very surface translation of what this word relates, and has the effect of narrowing the force of this verse. Exegeomai is a much stronger word which is more about "unfolding" or "laying out in detail." It actually relates the idea of presenting something with great depth and breadth, a richer, fuller, more detailed explanation; it is not just "speaking about" something, but more carries the idea of "explaining" that thing. "Explained," or "unfolded" or even "thoroughly presented" would related the idea of this word better in this context. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:38, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:19 ==

"Testimony" is a MUCH, MUCH better translation of "marturia" than "record." Excellent choice here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:49, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:21 ==

Just as a note here, this is one of the verses that Muslims use to claim that the New Testament foretells the coming of Mohamed. They believe that all references to "that prophet" or "the prophet" are prophesies about the expected FINAL prophet who would set everyone straight: Mohamed. The thing to note here is that John was not denying being a specific prophet, he was actually denying being a prophet of any kind. Whether through humility or because he had a different ministry, John chose NOT to classify himself as a prophet, something that is re-enforced in verse 25 where we render the same Greek construction as "another prophet." Since this seems to be more of a paraphrase than a strict translation, it really would relate the meaning of this verse better to say simply "another prophet" here, as we do in verse 25. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:23 ==

Euthuno means "straight, straightened out", not "clear." The idea is NOT about removing obstacles in the path, but rather, that the path have no turns or side routes. In other words, "there is only ONE path that leads to God, and it has no turns or curves" (which is very much the conservative message, is it not?). While it is true that the Hebrew uses the words "clear" and "smooth" here, this is actually from the Septuagint, which uses "euthus," the substantive form of euthuno, meaning "straight." In other words, John doesn't just quote the OT, by quoting the Septuagint, he uses a quote that actually relates the INTENT or MEANING of the Hebrew. If John believes that was a good choice, I think we should stick with his selection, and translate the Greek found in this verse, NOT the Hebrew found in Isaiah 40:3. This shows that the struggle between "strict translation" and "paraphrase" is a very old one. The translators of the Septuagint actually used a mild Greek paraphrase of the Hebrew in translating Isaiah 40:3, and John gives added authority to the wise choice of that paraphrase by choosing their wording (as opposed to a direct and stricter translation of the Hebrew) for his quotation.

Additionally, I think the ending phrase "just as the prophet Isaiah was" is not quite as clear as it could be. This choice makes the force of the verse be: I am a voice in the wilderness . . . just like Isaiah was. This is true, but it kind of loses the point that this is not just something Isaiah did, but is, in fact, a QUOTATION from Isaiah. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:22, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:24 ==

This is a fairly minor point, but this verse does not say those questioning "were Pharisees," it says, εκ των φαρισαιων; that is, they were "from the Pharisees." The implication is that the pharisees themselves were too cowardly to come in person, so they sent others, probably students or servants, to do the questioning for them. I think that is a point worth preserving here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 7:35, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:27 ==

Both this translation and the KJV lose the startling and contrasting points that John is making here. The Greek is closer to "he is the one coming after me who existed prior to me..." (ος εμπροσθεν μου γεγονεν). John was actually pointing toward the eternal nature of the one coming after him, kind of in line with "before Abraham was, I am." While it is obvious that God is above him, the point is that this is not just "some random guy who is above me," but rather, this person is, in fact, the eternal God in physical form. "Existed before me" or some equivalent phrase would be more accurate, and would be more in line with the startling, worldview altering point (at least to Jews) that John is making here. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 7:58, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:29 ==

Excellent point on the meaning of "airo." A possible solution to this would be "takes away the sinful burden..." or "takes away the burden of sin..." or maybe a more subtle "lifts and carries away the sin..." Any of these would capture at least a little of this extra force found in the Greek. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:30 ==

Again, John's statement here is closer to "after me comes a man who existed prior to me, because he was before me," which is a very emphatic way of pointing to the pre-existence of Christ, particularly as the last phrase uses "protos," which strictly speaking tells us that John is saying Christ "came first, before me." A strong, emphatic statement. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 8:28, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:31 ==

The tense is wrong here. It is NOT present tense ("I do not know..."), but pluperfect (past completed - "I had not known..."). The construction used here means "I had not (before this very moment) known who He was...". An acceptable translation would be, "I did not know who he was...," but placing this in the present tense completely misses what the Greek is saying. Eido is something of a surface kind of knowing and seeing, thus it is, in this context, about identity, not a deeper kind of "knowing him personally." The point here is that John was preparing the way for one who would take away our sins, but until this very moment, he did not know the exact identity of that man.

Also, in contrast with eido, phaneroo is more "revealed, unveiled, made publicly known," so translating both words with the same English word kind of misses what is going on here. The second half of this sentence is a purpose clause, showing the REASON that John came baptizing. This entire intent of this sentence is more like this: "I did not know who he was, but despite that, I have come to baptize people with water so that He could be revealed to Israel" (and yes, reversing the order of the clauses in this kind of purpose clause for clarity is completely legitimate).
[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 9:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:33 ==

Same tense and construction as 1:31, but here translated in the correct tense (I did not know...). Eido used in this context really does mean "I did not know '''who''' he was..." as opposed to "I did not know him personally...", and that subtle distinction should probably be preserved in the translation. After all, John knew Jesus, His God and creator, in His spirit, which is why he recognized God in the flesh standing before him. What John did not know was the identity of the man who was God in the flesh.

Redefining the Holy Spirit as the Divine Guardian is a questionable move for several reasons. First, the Greek '''literally''' says "Holy Spirit," and I find the idea of renaming a member of the Trinity completely distasteful. Second, Holy Spirit is NOT a title that has been largely redefined by our culture, so there is no need to redefine it - everyone knows that one part of the Trinity is called the "Holy Spirit." Third, it places a narrow description (guardian) upon the Holy Spirit that simply fails to even come close to all that the Holy Spirit does. Finally, it is a phrase that sounds VERY new age, and would be gladly and wholeheartedly welcomed by the eastern religion/new age element of our culture. We should not be trying to make Christianity easier to ignore because it uses new age terminology (and thus is just "another" way to god), but rather, more distinct and separate from the ideas and titles of false religions. Calling the Holy Spirit by a different name because we are not happy with what the Bible actually says is NOT a conservative thing to do; that simply smacks of liberalism in the extreme.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 10:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:42 ==

I would like to suggest here that for clarity, we give BOTH the common transliteration and the translation of "petros": "...you shall be called Cephas or Peter (the Rock)." For those who are new to scripture, that would just bring some clarity as to where the name "Peter" came from. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 10:31, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== John 2:1 ==

Would 2:1 be a little clearer if it were changed to something along the lines of 'A few days later...'? I took 'third day' to mean either the third day of the week or, possibly, the 3rd day after 1:51.

: Your suggestion is a good one, but I'm reluctant to remove information that is in the Greek. But certainly the reference to the third day could be clarified in some way for the reader, and I encourage you to do so by editing it.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:11, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

:: I slid this down so it falls under the heading for 2:1, and fits more chronologically. I apologize if this is not allowed by a non-administrator. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:02, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

Doesn't "''the third day''" mean "'''two''' days later" instead of "'''three''' days later" because of the custom of counting inclusively?
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting#Inclusive_counting for details.

: Your point is an excellent one, not because of your site, but because Christ rose on the "third day" (which was two days after Friday).--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:08, 7 October 2009 (EDT)

== 2:23 ==

It is not actually the Greek of this sentence that reveals their faith was superficial, but Jesus' reaction to their "faith" that is illuminating. Jesus understood that their faith was fleeting and transitory, which by definition means it was superficial. [[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 2:02, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 2:24-25 ==

The Greek word translated "understood" in V24 and "knew" in V25 is "ginosko," and is deeper than just "knowing"; it means, "to perceive, to understand, to know absolutely." The point here is that Jesus was sinless and innocent, but He was NOT naive. He understood the fickleness and evil that men were capable of, no matter what they "confessed" to believe. A simple "confession of faith" did not equal true believer, and did not mean the faith was sincere. The word translated "believed" in verse 23 and "confidence" in verse 24 is pisteuo, which is the standard word in the NT for "to believe in, to have faith in." In verse 24 the construction indicates more of it's root meaning of "complete confidence, totally sure." They expressed faith in Him, but He had no confidence in them.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:00, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:1 ==

Calling Nicodemus an "ανθρωπος εκ των φαρισαιων" (man from the pharisees), rather than just calling him a "pharisee" outright is another way of indicating that Nicodemus was different from most Pharisees. He might have agreed with much of their beliefs, but he was not really LIKE them, particularly in terms of his sincerity and devotion to God.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:19, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

: The term "Pharisee" seems overused in English translations. Few realize the significance, or what was meant by it. How about "intellectual" for some of these references?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 16:25, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:2 ==

Again, we see that when John wants to put emphasis on "this very same individual (as the previous verse)" he uses "houtos" (just as he did in 1:2).[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:25, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:3 ==

"αμην αμην" at the start of a quote ("truly, truly" here and again in verse 5) is a Jewish idiom (originating from the Hebrew and moving into the Greek via the Aramaic) that serves as a strong admonition to pay VERY close attention to what is about to be said. It is kind of like: "if you don't hear anything else, hear this..." or "pay VERY close attention to what I am about to say," or as Matthew Quigley (from the movie "Quigley Down Under") might say, "this is for sure and for certain..."[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 3:41, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== 3:5 ==

It is common to interpret "born of water" to mean "physical birth," meaning, unless someone has a physical birth and then a spiritual birth, they cannot enter the kingdom of God. The problem is that the construction indicates that if EITHER one is missing, you cannot enter the kingdom of God. So if either one can be missing, then the "born from water" could be the part that is missing. This would mean that physical birth is a necessity of salvation, which could be interpreted to mean that an unborn child that dies in the womb (and thus, has not been truly "born of water") is doomed to hell. It is much more likely that Jesus is using "water" as it is usually used in scripture: as a symbol of spiritual cleansing, which causes this to parallel what Jesus did for us. His death paid the penalty for our sin (water - cleansing) and His resurrection gave us new life (spirit - life). We need BOTH cleansing and new life to enter the kingdom of God; one or the other alone will not cut it.[[User:Mback|Michael Back]] 4:05, 19 October 2009 (EDT)

== anothen: From above or again ==

According to Strong's Concordance, anothen means from above; from the first, or anew. Anothen comes from ano, which means upward or on the top. According to Strong's, the only verses anothen is translated as again is at John 3:3 and 3:7, and at Galatians 4:9. In Galatians 4:9, Paul asked them why they are turning back to "weak and miserable principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again?" (NIV Interlinear) But most of the time, when anothen is translated in the KJV, it is translated as "from above". In John 3:31, the KJV reads "He that cometh from above is above all". At John 19:11, Jesus, facing Pilate, tells Pilate that he has no power over him unless it comes "from above". At James 1:17, we are told that every gift and every good comes down "from above". And at James 3:15, we are told that earthly wisdom does not come "from above". From these examples, we can see that anothen has been translated both as "again" and as "from above". But looking back at John 3:3 and 3:7, especially in light of John 3:31 and the two verse from James, it really would appear that Jesus means for anothen to mean "from above". Nicodemus could just be dense and/or boorish. Or he could also simply not understand what Jesus is saying, as his response seems to show: "How can a man be born when he is old? Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb to be born?" (v. 3:4/ NIV Interlinear) Nicodemus is obviously taking anothen to mean "again", while Jesus means "from above". - Danielitld

John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-10-16T13:14:34Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 1==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
|In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
|Logos in the text means Word; aletheia in Greek means truth, and is not in the text.
|-
|2
|The same was in the beginning with God.
|The same one was in the beginning, with God.
|"houtos" is serving as an emphatic form of "autos," placing extra emphasis on "this SAME individual..." The purpose here is to emphasize the personal nature of the logos in verse one.
|-
|3
|All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
|All things were made by Him; not one thing was made without Him.
|"Not one thing" relates the emphatic force of the Greek much best. Conciseness chosen over repetition here.
|-
|4
|In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
|He was the source of life, which is the light of men.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|5
|And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
|In the darkness shined the light, and the darkness could not snuff it out.
|This verse has many different modern translations
|-
|6
|There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
|There was a man sent by God, whose name was John.
|
|-
|7
|The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
|He came as a witness, to bear witness to the Light, so that all men might believe because of him.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|8
|He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
|John was not the Light, but a messenger of the Light.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|9
|That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
|That was the true Light, which animates every man who comes into the world.
|This is the "Quaker verse" and it is where the phrase "inner light" comes from. Animates is a good translation of φωτιζει.
|-
|10
|He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
|He was in the world, and the world was made by Him, but the world did not recognize Him.
|
|-
|11
|He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
|He came among his own, but his own accepted him not.
|Here "his own" refers to the Jewish people, and is implied in the Greek<ref>http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+1%3A11%2CJohn+17%3A6%2CJohn+17%3A9-11&version=ESV</ref>.
|-
|12
|But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
|But many did accept him, and to them he gave power to be the sons of God, even to those who believed in him.
|Emphasizes that the gift granted applies not just to those who received/accepted (as one would a guest), but to any who believe in Jesus.
|-
|13
|Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
|Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
|
|-
|14
|And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth.
|And the spirit was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory, the glory as the only child of the Father, full of grace and truth.
|Greek "λόγος" has multiple meanings, but as John uses it to refer to Jesus, "spirit" seems most appropriate here.
|-
|15
|John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
|John gave witness of Him, and cried, saying, "This was he of whom I spoke, He who comes after me, who is preferred before me, for he was before me."
|Modern phrasing
|-
|16
|And of his fullness have all we received, and grace for grace.
|And by His abundance, all of us have benefited, indeed, with grace and bounty for grace and bounty.
|An unusual translation of ελαβομεν, but most appropriate here.
|-
|17
|For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
|For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
|
|-
|18
|No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
|Never has a man seen God; instead God is spoken of by His only son, who is in the heart of the Father.
|
|-
|19
|And this is the record of John the Baptist, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?
|And this is the testimony John gave to the priests and Levites, who had been sent by the Jews from Jerusalem to ask him, "Who are you?"
|John here refers to John the Baptist, not John the apostle and author of this Gospel.
|-
|20
|And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ.
|And John did not deny who he was, but confessed, and told them, he was not Christ.
|
|-
|21
|And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.
|And they asked him, "Then what are you? Elijah?" And he said, "I am not." They asked, "Are you that prophet?" And he answered, "No."
|
|-
|22
|Then said they unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself?
|So they said to him, "Who are you, what shall we tell the people who sent us. What have you to say for yourself?"
|
|-
|23
|He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.
|He said, "I am the voice crying in the wilderness, 'Make clear the path of the Lord,' just as the prophet Isaiah was."
|
|-
|24
|And they which were sent were of the Pharisees.
|Those who questioned him were Pharisees.
|
|-
|25
|And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be not that Christ, nor Elias, neither that prophet?
|And so they asked him, "Why do you baptize people, if you are not Christ, nor Elijah, nor another prophet?"
|
|-
|26
|John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;
|John answered them, "I baptize with water, but there is one among you who you do not know,"
|
|-
|27
|He it is, who coming after me is preferred before me, whose shoe's latchet I am not worthy to unloose.
|"and it is he, who is coming after me, who is above me, whose shoe's laces I am not worthy to untie."
|
|-
|28
|These things were done in Bethabara beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing.
|These things happened in Bethabara, beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing.
|
|-
|29
|The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
|The next day, John saw Jesus coming to him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, which takes away the sin of the world."
|Greek "αιρων" means literally two ideas simultaneously: to bear a burden, and to carry that burden away. Here it is translated as "takes away," but this additional implication of burden is lost.
|-
|30
|This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he was before me.
|This is the man I have spoken of when I said, "After me will come a man who is above me, for he existed before me.
|
|-
|31
|And I knew him not: but that he should be made manifest to Israel, therefore am I come baptizing with water.
|I did not know who he was, yet I have come to baptize with water so that He could be revealed to Israel."
|an enigmatic verse; more improvements welcome (see comment page)
|-
|32
|And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.
|And John testified "I saw the Spirit come down like a dove out of heaven, and it stayed upon Jesus."
|
|-
|33
|And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
|"I did not know him who sent me to baptize with water, but that same man said to me, 'The man whom you will see the Spirit descend upon, and remain on, that man is he who will baptize with the Divine Guardian.'"
|As per [[Gospel of Mark (Translated)|Mark 1:8]].
|-
|34
|And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.
|"I saw these things, and testify that this is the Son of God."
|
|-
|35
|Again the next day after John stood, and two of his disciples;
|The next day, John stood again with two of his disciples;
|
|-
|36
|And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!
|and looking upon Jesus as he walked, he said, "Behold! The Lamb of God!"
|
|-
|37
|And the two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus.
|And the two disciples heard this, and they followed Jesus.
|
|-
|38
|Then Jesus turned, and saw them following, and saith unto them, What seek ye? They said unto him, Rabbi, (which is to say, being interpreted, Master,) where dwellest thou?
|Jesus turned, and saw them following him, and said to them, "What do you seek?" They said to him, "Rabbi, where do you live?"
|
|-
|39
|He saith unto them, Come and see. They came and saw where he dwelt, and abode with him that day: for it was about the tenth hour.
|He said to them, "Come and see." They came, and saw where he lived, and stayed with him that day, for it was 10 o'clock.
|
|-
|40
|One of the two which heard John speak, and followed him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother.
|One of these two disciples, who had heard John speak, and followed Jesus, was Andrew, brother of Simon Peter.
|
|-
|41
|He first findeth his own brother Simon, and saith unto him, We have found the Messias, which is, being interpreted, the Christ.
|He first found his brother Simon, and said to him, "We have found the Messiah, the Christ!"
|
|-
|42
|And he brought him to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, Thou art Simon the son of Jona: thou shalt be called Cephas, which is by interpretation, A stone.
|Andrew brought Simon Peter to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, "You are Simon, son of Jonah: you shall be called Cephas, the rock."
|
|-
|43
|The day following Jesus would go forth into Galilee, and findeth Philip, and saith unto him, Follow me.
|The day following, Jesus went forth into Galilee, and finding Phillip, he said to him, "Follow me."
|
|-
|44
|Now Philip was of Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter.
|Phillip was of Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter.
|
|-
|45
|Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.
|Phillip found Nathaniel, and said to him, "We have found him, him of whom Moses and the prophets wrote, Jesus of Nazareth, son of Joseph."
|
|-
|46
|And Nathanael said unto him, Can there any good thing come out of Nazareth? Philip saith unto him, Come and see.
|Nathaniel said to Phillip, "Can any good thing come from Nazareth?" Phillip replied, "Come and see."
|
|-
|47
|Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!
|Jesus saw Nathaniel coming to him, and said of him, "Look! An Israelite indeed, who is incapable of deceit."
|Deceit is a more appropriate translation.
|-
|48
|Nathanael saith unto him, Whence knowest thou me? Jesus answered and said unto him, Before that Philip called thee, when thou wast under the fig tree, I saw thee.
|Nathaniel said to him, "How do you know me?" Jesus answered, saying "Before that Phillip called upon you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you."
|Something about Nathaniels experience under the fig tree was profound enough that he was surprised Jesus would know about it. Praying would make sense, as this would imply the divinity of Jesus, which Nathaniel somehow immediately recognizes by Jesus's response here.
|-
|49
|Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
|Nathaniel answered and said, "Rabbi, you are the Son of God, the King of Israel."
|
|-
|50
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Because I said unto thee, I saw thee under the fig tree, believest thou? thou shalt see greater things than these.
|Jesus replied to him, "Because I said to you, 'I saw you under the fig tree,' you believe? You shall see greater things that this."
|
|-
|51
|And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.
|And Jesus continued to Nathaniel, "Truly I tell you, you shall yet see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man."
|
|}

==Chapter 2==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
|Two days later, there was a wedding in Cana of Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there.
|"Third day" means third day after the question of John the Baptist described in John 1:19-28, counting inclusively with the first day, as in Christ rising on the third day
|-
|2
|And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
|Jesus, and his disciples, were invited to the wedding.
|
|-
|3
|And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
|When they wedding party wanted wine, the mother of Jesus said to him, "They have no wine."
|
|-
|4
|Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
|Jesus said to her, "Dear woman, it is not my time yet. What do I have to do with this?"
|"γυναι" is a respectful form of address for a woman. "ο" could mean "you," but can also mean "this," and in context, the latter makes more sense.
|-
|5
|His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.
|His mother said to the servants, "Do what he tells you to do."
|Despite His apparent refusal in John 2:4, it must have been clear to those present that he intended to grant his mothers request, for no further argument is written.
|-
|6
|And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
|So there were placed six large stone pots, used for washing at Jewish feasts, and these could contain about twenty gallons each.
|Greek "μετρητας," a unit a measure thought to be somewhere between 7 and 9 Imperial gallons.
|-
|7
|Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
|Jesus said to the servants, "Fill the pots with water." And they filled them up to the brim.
|
|-
|8
|And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.
|And he said to them, "Carry them out now to the host of this feast." And so they did.
|
|-
|9
|When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
|When the host of the wedding feast tasted the water, it had been made into wine, and he did not know where the wine had come from (though the servants knew), and so the host of the wedding feast called the groom,
|
|-
|10
|And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
|And said to him, "Usually, a man, at the beginning of a feast, sets out his good wine, and when all have drank their fill, then the poorer quality wine. But you have kept your good wine for last!"
|
|-
|11
|This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
|This was the first of the miracles Jesus did in Cana of Galilee, and by doing showed his glory, and so his disciples believed in him.
|
|-
|12
|After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days.
|After this, he went down to Capernaum, with his mother and brothers and disciples. They stayed there for only a few days.
|
|-
|13
|And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem,
|When the Jews' passover was at hand, Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
|
|-
|14
|And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
|He found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the money changers, all sitting.
|Roman coins were not allowed in the temple; "money changes" refers to those who profited by exchanging coins outside the temple for purer, Jewish coins, which Jews could use inside the temple to purchase animals for sacrifice.
|-
|15
|And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;
|Jesus made a whip out of small ropes, and drove all these people out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen, and poured out the money changers' money, and knocked over the tables.
|
|-
|16
|And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise.
|And said to those who sold doves, "Take these things away; do not make my Father's house a house of business."
|
|-
|17
|And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.
|And his disciples remembered that it was written, "The zeal of your house has eaten me up."
|Specifically, Psalms 69:9
|-
|18
|Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
|The Jews responded to Jesus, "What sign can you show to us, that might justify your actions to us?"
|
|-
|19
|Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
|Jesus answered, saying, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will rebuild it."
|
|-
|20
|Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
|Then the Jews said, "It took forty-six years to build this temple, and you would rebuild it in three days?"
|
|-
|21
|But he spake of the temple of his body.
|But He meant the temple of his body.
|
|-
|22
|When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.
|That is why, when He was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this to them, and they believed the scripture, and the things which Jesus had said.
|
|-
|23
|Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
|When He was in Jerusalem at passover, on the feast day, many believed in Him superficially, when they saw the miracles which He did.
|
|-
|24
|But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
|But Jesus did not commit himself to them, because he knew all men,
|
|-
|25
|And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
|And did not need any man to speak on his behalf, for he knew what was in the hearts of men.
|
|}

==Chapter 3==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
|There was a Pharisee man by the name of Nicodemus, who was a ruler of the Jews:
|
|-
|2
|The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
|This man came to Jesus at night, and said to him, "Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher sent from God: for no man could do the miracles that you do, unless God was with him."
|
|-
|3
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
|Jesus answered him, saying "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a man is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
|Jesus said "born 'anothen'". Difficult to render in English, since it means "again" and "from above". Nicodemus takes it to mean "again". It would seem Jesus meant "from above".
|-
|4
|Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
|Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter again into his mother's womb, and be reborn?"
|
|-
|5
|Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
|Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|6
|That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
|That which is born of flesh, is flesh; but that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
|
|-
|7
|Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
|So you should not be surprised that I say to you that you must be born again.
|
|-
|8
|The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
|The wind blows where it likes, and you may hear the sound of it, but cannot say from where it comes, or where it goes: like this is one who is born of the Spirit."
|
|-
|9
|Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?
|Nicodemus replied, saying to Him, "How can these things be true?"
|
|-
|10
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
|Jesus answered, saying to him, "Are you not a ruler of Israel? Do you not know these things?
|
|-
|11
|Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
|Truly, truly, I say to you, that we speak of things we know, and speak of things we have seen, and yet you do not believe us.
|
|-
|12
|If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
|I have told you of earthly things, and you do not believe me. How, then, will you believe if I tell you of heavenly things?
|
|-
|13
|And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
|No man has gone up to heaven except He that came down from heaven - the Son of man.
|
|-
|14
|And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
|As Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, just in this way must the Son of man be lifted up,
|
|-
|15
|That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|That he who believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|
|-
|16
|For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
|For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that who believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|
|-
|17
|For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
|For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn it, but to save it.
|
|-
|18
|He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
|He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
|
|-
|19
|And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
|And this is the condemnation: that light came into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light, because their actions were evil.
|
|-
|20
|For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
|For all those who do evil things hate the light, and avoid coming to the light, to avoid judgment of their actions.
|
|-
|21
|But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
|But he whose actions are just is drawn to the light, that his actions may be known, for they are done through God."
|
|-
|22
|After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
|After these things, Jesus and his disciples went into the land of Judea, and there he met with them, and baptized.
|
|-
|23
|And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
|And John was also baptizing, in Aenon, near Salim, because there was a good deal of water there, and they came, and were baptized.
|
|-
|24
|For John was not yet cast into prison.
|This was when John had not yet been imprisoned.
|
|-
|25
|Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying.
|There arose a question between some of John's disciples, and the rest of the Jews, about purification.
|
|-
|26
|And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.
|So they came to John, and said, "Rabbi, he that was with you beyond Jordan, to whom you bore witness, now he is baptizing, and all the men go to him."
|
|-
|27
|John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
|John answered them, saying, "All that a man receives is given to him from heaven.
|
|-
|28
|Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him.
|You have seen, that never said I was the Christ, but instead I said that I was sent before him.
|
|-
|29
|He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
|He that has the bride is the groom, but the friend of the groom, who stands by him and hears him, rejoices because of the grooms voice: this is why I am now joyed.
|
|-
|30
|He must increase, but I must decrease.
|He must be greater, but I must then be less than what I am now.
|
|-
|31
|He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
|Jesus, who comes from above is above all, while I who am of the Earth am earthly, and my words are not from Heaven. God is above all."
|
|-
|32
|And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
|And what He has seen and hears He is testifying to; but nobody receives His testimony.
|This appears to be part of the above quote. Difficult to capture the present progressive in marturei without awkwardness, but it's there. Testimony more accurately captures the sense of marturei, which refers to legal evidence.
|-
|33
|He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
|He who hears his words, has acknowledged the truth of God.
|This needs some work.
|-
|34
|For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
|
|
|-
|35
|The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
|
|
|-
|36
|He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 4==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John,
|
|
|-
|2
|(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)
|
|
|-
|3
|He left Judaea, and departed again into Galilee.
|
|
|-
|4
|And he must needs go through Samaria.
|
|
|-
|5
|Then cometh he to a city of Samaria, which is called Sychar, near to the parcel of ground that Jacob gave to his son Joseph.
|
|
|-
|6
|Now Jacob's well was there. Jesus therefore, being wearied with his journey, sat thus on the well: and it was about the sixth hour.
|
|
|-
|7
|There cometh a woman of Samaria to draw water: Jesus saith unto her, Give me to drink.
|
|
|-
|8
|(For his disciples were gone away unto the city to buy meat.)
|
|
|-
|9
|Then saith the woman of Samaria unto him, How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, which am a woman of Samaria? for the Jews have no dealings with the Samaritans.
|
|
|-
|10
|Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
|
|
|-
|11
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?
|
|
|-
|12
|Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
|
|
|-
|13
|Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
|
|
|-
|14
|But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
|
|
|-
|15
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, give me this water, that I thirst not, neither come hither to draw.
|
|
|-
|16
|Jesus saith unto her, Go, call thy husband, and come hither.
|
|
|-
|17
|The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband:
|
|
|-
|18
|For thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidst thou truly.
|
|
|-
|19
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet.
|
|
|-
|20
|Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
|
|
|-
|21
|Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
|
|
|-
|22
|Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
|
|
|-
|23
|But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
|
|
|-
|24
|God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
|
|
|-
|25
|The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
|
|
|-
|26
|Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
|
|
|-
|27
|And upon this came his disciples, and marvelled that he talked with the woman: yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why talkest thou with her?
|
|
|-
|28
|The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men,
|
|
|-
|29
|Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ?
|
|
|-
|30
|Then they went out of the city, and came unto him.
|
|
|-
|31
|In the mean while his disciples prayed him, saying, Master, eat.
|
|
|-
|32
|But he said unto them, I have meat to eat that ye know not of.
|
|
|-
|33
|Therefore said the disciples one to another, Hath any man brought him ought to eat?
|
|
|-
|34
|Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.
|
|
|-
|35
|Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.
|
|
|-
|36
|And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.
|
|
|-
|37
|And herein is that saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth.
|
|
|-
|38
|I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour: other men laboured, and ye are entered into their labours.
|
|
|-
|39
|And many of the Samaritans of that city believed on him for the saying of the woman, which testified, He told me all that ever I did.
|
|
|-
|40
|So when the Samaritans were come unto him, they besought him that he would tarry with them: and he abode there two days.
|
|
|-
|41
|And many more believed because of his own word;
|
|
|-
|42
|And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.
|
|
|-
|43
|Now after two days he departed thence, and went into Galilee.
|
|
|-
|44
|For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honour in his own country.
|
|
|-
|45
|Then when he was come into Galilee, the Galilaeans received him, having seen all the things that he did at Jerusalem at the feast: for they also went unto the feast.
|
|
|-
|46
|So Jesus came again into Cana of Galilee, where he made the water wine. And there was a certain nobleman, whose son was sick at Capernaum.
|
|
|-
|47
|When he heard that Jesus was come out of Judaea into Galilee, he went unto him, and besought him that he would come down, and heal his son: for he was at the point of death.
|
|
|-
|48
|Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.
|
|
|-
|49
|The nobleman saith unto him, Sir, come down ere my child die.
|
|
|-
|50
|Jesus saith unto him, Go thy way; thy son liveth. And the man believed the word that Jesus had spoken unto him, and he went his way.
|
|
|-
|51
|And as he was now going down, his servants met him, and told him, saying, Thy son liveth.
|
|
|-
|52
|Then inquired he of them the hour when he began to amend. And they said unto him, Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him.
|
|
|-
|53
|So the father knew that it was at the same hour, in the which Jesus said unto him, Thy son liveth: and himself believed, and his whole house.
|
|
|-
|54
|This is again the second miracle that Jesus did, when he was come out of Judaea into Galilee.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 5==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After this there was a feast of the Jews; and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
|
|
|-
|2
|Now there is at Jerusalem by the sheep market a pool, which is called in the Hebrew tongue Bethesda, having five porches.
|
|
|-
|3
|In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water.
|
|
|-
|4
|For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.
|
|
|-
|5
|And a certain man was there, which had an infirmity thirty and eight years.
|
|
|-
|6
|When Jesus saw him lie, and knew that he had been now a long time in that case, he saith unto him, Wilt thou be made whole?
|
|
|-
|7
|The impotent man answered him, Sir, I have no man, when the water is troubled, to put me into the pool: but while I am coming, another steppeth down before me.
|
|
|-
|8
|Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk.
|
|
|-
|9
|And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath.
|
|
|-
|10
|The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
|
|
|-
|11
|He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk.
|
|
|-
|12
|Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk?
|
|
|-
|13
|And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
|
|
|-
|15
|The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
|
|
|-
|16
|And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
|
|
|-
|17
|But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
|
|
|-
|18
|Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
|
|
|-
|19
|Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
|
|
|-
|20
|For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel.
|
|
|-
|21
|For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.
|
|
|-
|22
|For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
|
|
|-
|23
|That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
|
|
|-
|24
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
|
|
|-
|25
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
|
|
|-
|26
|For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
|
|
|-
|27
|And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
|
|
|-
|28
|Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
|
|
|-
|29
|And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
|
|
|-
|30
|I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|31
|If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.|
|
|
|-
|32
|There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true.
|
|
|-
|33
|Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth.
|
|
|-
|34
|But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved.
|
|
|-
|35
|He was a burning and a shining light: and ye were willing for a season to rejoice in his light.
|
|
|-
|36
|But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|37
|And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
|
|
|-
|38
|And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
|
|
|-
|39
|Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
|
|
|-
|40
|And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
|
|
|-
|41
|I receive not honour from men.
|
|
|-
|42
|But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
|
|
|-
|43
|I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
|
|
|-
|44
|How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
|
|
|-
|45
|Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
|
|
|-
|46
|For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
|
|
|-
|47
|But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
|
|
|}

==Chapter 6==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After these things Jesus went over the sea of Galilee, which is the sea of Tiberias.
|
|
|-
|2
|And a great multitude followed him, because they saw his miracles which he did on them that were diseased.
|
|
|-
|3
|And Jesus went up into a mountain, and there he sat with his disciples.
|
|
|-
|4
|And the passover, a feast of the Jews, was nigh.
|
|
|-
|5
|When Jesus then lifted up his eyes, and saw a great company come unto him, he saith unto Philip, Whence shall we buy bread, that these may eat?
|
|
|-
|6
|And this he said to prove him: for he himself knew what he would do.
|
|
|-
|7
|Philip answered him, Two hundred pennyworth of bread is not sufficient for them, that every one of them may take a little.
|
|
|-
|8
|One of his disciples, Andrew, Simon Peter's brother, saith unto him,
|
|
|-
|9
|There is a lad here, which hath five barley loaves, and two small fishes: but what are they among so many?
|
|
|-
|10
|And Jesus said, Make the men sit down. Now there was much grass in the place. So the men sat down, in number about five thousand.
|
|
|-
|11
|And Jesus took the loaves; and when he had given thanks, he distributed to the disciples, and the disciples to them that were set down; and likewise of the fishes as much as they would.
|
|
|-
|12
|When they were filled, he said unto his disciples, Gather up the fragments that remain, that nothing be lost.
|
|
|-
|13
|Therefore they gathered them together, and filled twelve baskets with the fragments of the five barley loaves, which remained over and above unto them that had eaten.
|
|
|-
|14
|Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world.
|
|
|-
|15
|When Jesus therefore perceived that they would come and take him by force, to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain himself alone.
|
|
|-
|16
|And when even was now come, his disciples went down unto the sea,
|
|
|-
|17
|And entered into a ship, and went over the sea toward Capernaum. And it was now dark, and Jesus was not come to them.
|
|
|-
|18
|And the sea arose by reason of a great wind that blew.
|
|
|-
|19
|So when they had rowed about five and twenty or thirty furlongs, they see Jesus walking on the sea, and drawing nigh unto the ship: and they were afraid.
|
|
|-
|20
|But he saith unto them, It is I; be not afraid.
|
|
|-
|21
|Then they willingly received him into the ship: and immediately the ship was at the land whither they went.
|
|
|-
|22
|The day following, when the people which stood on the other side of the sea saw that there was none other boat there, save that one whereinto his disciples were entered, and that Jesus went not with his disciples into the boat, but that his disciples were gone away alone;
|
|
|-
|23
|(Howbeit there came other boats from Tiberias nigh unto the place where they did eat bread, after that the Lord had given thanks:)
|
|
|-
|24
|When the people therefore saw that Jesus was not there, neither his disciples, they also took shipping, and came to Capernaum, seeking for Jesus.
|
|
|-
|25
|And when they had found him on the other side of the sea, they said unto him, Rabbi, when camest thou hither?
|
|
|-
|26
|Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled.
|
|
|-
|27
|Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
|
|
|-
|28
|Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
|
|
|-
|29
|Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
|
|
|-
|30
|They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?
|
|
|-
|31
|Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat.
|
|
|-
|32
|Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
|
|
|-
|33
|For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
|
|
|-
|34
|Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
|
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
|
|
|-
|36
|But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
|
|
|-
|37
|All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
|
|
|-
|38
|For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
|
|
|-
|39
|And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
|
|
|-
|40
|And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|41
|The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven.
|
|
|-
|42
|And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven?
|
|
|-
|43
|Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.
|
|
|-
|44
|No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|45
|It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
|
|
|-
|46
|Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
|
|
|-
|47
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
|
|
|-
|48
|I am that bread of life.
|
|
|-
|49
|Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
|
|
|-
|50
|This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
|
|
|-
|51
|I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
|
|
|-
|52
|The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
|
|
|-
|53
|Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
|
|
|-
|54
|Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|55
|For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
|
|
|-
|56
|He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
|
|
|-
|57
|As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
|
|
|-
|58
|This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
|
|
|-
|59
|These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
|
|
|-
|60
|Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
|
|
|-
|61
|When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
|
|
|-
|62
|What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
|
|
|-
|63
|It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
|
|
|-
|64
|But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
|
|
|-
|65
|And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
|
|
|-
|66
|From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
|From then on many disciples abandoned Jesus.
|
|-
|67
|Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
|So Jesus said to the Twelve, "Will you also leave me?"
|
|-
|68
|Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
|Simon Peter replied, "Lord, who else is there? You have the words of eternal life.
|
|-
|69
|And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
|We are certain that you are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
|
|-
|70
|Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
|
|
|-
|71
|He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 7==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him.
|
|
|-
|2
|Now the Jews' feast of tabernacles was at hand.
|
|
|-
|3
|His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest.
|
|
|-
|4
|For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world.
|
|
|-
|5
|For neither did his brethren believe in him.
|
|
|-
|6
|Then Jesus said unto them, My time is not yet come: but your time is always ready.
|
|
|-
|7
|The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.
|
|
|-
|8
|Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast; for my time is not yet full come.
|
|
|-
|9
|When he had said these words unto them, he abode still in Galilee.
|
|
|-
|10
|But when his brethren were gone up, then went he also up unto the feast, not openly, but as it were in secret.
|
|
|-
|11
|Then the Jews sought him at the feast, and said, Where is he?
|
|
|-
|12
|And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said, Nay; but he deceiveth the people.
|
|
|-
|13
|Howbeit no man spake openly of him for fear of the Jews.
|
|
|-
|14
|Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught.
|
|
|-
|15
|And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?
|
|
|-
|16
|Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
|
|
|-
|17

|If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
|
|
|-
|18
|He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.
|
|
|-
|19
|Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?
|
|
|-
|20
|The people answered and said, Thou hast a devil: who goeth about to kill thee?
|
|
|-
|21
|Jesus answered and said unto them, I have done one work, and ye all marvel.
|
|
|-
|22
|Moses therefore gave unto you circumcision; (not because it is of Moses, but of the fathers;) and ye on the sabbath day circumcise a man.
|
|
|-
|23
|If a man on the sabbath day receive circumcision, that the law of Moses should not be broken; are ye angry at me, because I have made a man every whit whole on the sabbath day?
|
|
|-
|24
|Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
|
|
|-
|25
|Then said some of them of Jerusalem, Is not this he, whom they seek to kill?
|
|
|-
|26
|But, lo, he speaketh boldly, and they say nothing unto him. Do the rulers know indeed that this is the very Christ?
|
|
|-
|27
|Howbeit we know this man whence he is: but when Christ cometh, no man knoweth whence he is.
|
|
|-
|28
|Then cried Jesus in the temple as he taught, saying, Ye both know me, and ye know whence I am: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not.
|
|
|-
|29
|But I know him: for I am from him, and he hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|30
|Then they sought to take him: but no man laid hands on him, because his hour was not yet come.
|
|
|-
|31
|And many of the people believed on him, and said, When Christ cometh, will he do more miracles than these which this man hath done?
|
|
|-
|32
|The Pharisees heard that the people murmured such things concerning him; and the Pharisees and the chief priests sent officers to take him.
|
|
|-
|33
|Then said Jesus unto them, Yet a little while am I with you, and then I go unto him that sent me.
|
|
|-
|34
|Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come.
|
|
|-
|35
|Then said the Jews among themselves, Whither will he go, that we shall not find him? will he go unto the dispersed among the Gentiles, and teach the Gentiles?
|
|
|-
|36
|What manner of saying is this that he said, Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come?
|
|
|-
|37
|In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
|
|
|-
|38
|He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
|
|
|-
|39
|(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
|
|
|-
|40
|Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
|
|
|-
|41
|Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
|
|
|-
|42
|Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
|
|
|-
|43
|So there was a division among the people because of him.
|
|
|-
|44
|And some of them would have taken him; but no man laid hands on him.
|
|
|-
|45
|Then came the officers to the chief priests and Pharisees; and they said unto them, Why have ye not brought him?
|
|
|-
|46
|The officers answered, Never man spake like this man.
|
|
|-
|47
|Then answered them the Pharisees, Are ye also deceived?
|
|
|-
|48
|Have any of the rulers or of the Pharisees believed on him?
|
|
|-
|49
|But this people who knoweth not the law are cursed.
|
|
|-
|50
|Nicodemus saith unto them, (he that came to Jesus by night, being one of them,)
|
|
|-
|51
|Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?
|
|
|-
|52
|They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
|
|
|-
|53
|And every man went unto his own house.
|
|
|}

[[Category:Conservative Bible]]

== See also ==

*[[John 8-14 (Translated)]]
*[[Gospel of John (Translated)]]

John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-10-16T13:08:39Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 1==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
|In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
|Logos in the text means Word; aletheia in Greek means truth, and is not in the text.
|-
|2
|The same was in the beginning with God.
|The same one was in the beginning, with God.
|"houtos" is serving as an emphatic form of "autos," placing extra emphasis on "this SAME individual..." The purpose here is to emphasize the personal nature of the logos in verse one.
|-
|3
|All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
|All things were made by Him; not one thing was made without Him.
|"Not one thing" relates the emphatic force of the Greek much best. Conciseness chosen over repetition here.
|-
|4
|In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
|He was the source of life, which is the light of men.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|5
|And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
|In the darkness shined the light, and the darkness could not snuff it out.
|This verse has many different modern translations
|-
|6
|There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
|There was a man sent by God, whose name was John.
|
|-
|7
|The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
|He came as a witness, to bear witness to the Light, so that all men might believe because of him.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|8
|He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
|John was not the Light, but a messenger of the Light.
|Modern phrasing
|-
|9
|That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
|That was the true Light, which animates every man who comes into the world.
|This is the "Quaker verse" and it is where the phrase "inner light" comes from. Animates is a good translation of φωτιζει.
|-
|10
|He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
|He was in the world, and the world was made by Him, but the world did not recognize Him.
|
|-
|11
|He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
|He came among his own, but his own accepted him not.
|Here "his own" refers to the Jewish people, and is implied in the Greek<ref>http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+1%3A11%2CJohn+17%3A6%2CJohn+17%3A9-11&version=ESV</ref>.
|-
|12
|But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
|But many did accept him, and to them he gave power to be the sons of God, even to those who believed in him.
|Emphasizes that the gift granted applies not just to those who received/accepted (as one would a guest), but to any who believe in Jesus.
|-
|13
|Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
|Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
|
|-
|14
|And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth.
|And the spirit was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory, the glory as the only child of the Father, full of grace and truth.
|Greek "λόγος" has multiple meanings, but as John uses it to refer to Jesus, "spirit" seems most appropriate here.
|-
|15
|John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
|John gave witness of Him, and cried, saying, "This was he of whom I spoke, He who comes after me, who is preferred before me, for he was before me."
|Modern phrasing
|-
|16
|And of his fullness have all we received, and grace for grace.
|And by His abundance, all of us have benefited, indeed, with grace and bounty for grace and bounty.
|An unusual translation of ελαβομεν, but most appropriate here.
|-
|17
|For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
|For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
|
|-
|18
|No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
|Never has a man seen God; instead God is spoken of by His only son, who is in the heart of the Father.
|
|-
|19
|And this is the record of John the Baptist, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?
|And this is the testimony John gave to the priests and Levites, who had been sent by the Jews from Jerusalem to ask him, "Who are you?"
|John here refers to John the Baptist, not John the apostle and author of this Gospel.
|-
|20
|And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ.
|And John did not deny who he was, but confessed, and told them, he was not Christ.
|
|-
|21
|And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.
|And they asked him, "Then what are you? Elijah?" And he said, "I am not." They asked, "Are you that prophet?" And he answered, "No."
|
|-
|22
|Then said they unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself?
|So they said to him, "Who are you, what shall we tell the people who sent us. What have you to say for yourself?"
|
|-
|23
|He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias.
|He said, "I am the voice crying in the wilderness, 'Make clear the path of the Lord,' just as the prophet Isaiah was."
|
|-
|24
|And they which were sent were of the Pharisees.
|Those who questioned him were Pharisees.
|
|-
|25
|And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be not that Christ, nor Elias, neither that prophet?
|And so they asked him, "Why do you baptize people, if you are not Christ, nor Elijah, nor another prophet?"
|
|-
|26
|John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;
|John answered them, "I baptize with water, but there is one among you who you do not know,"
|
|-
|27
|He it is, who coming after me is preferred before me, whose shoe's latchet I am not worthy to unloose.
|"and it is he, who is coming after me, who is above me, whose shoe's laces I am not worthy to untie."
|
|-
|28
|These things were done in Bethabara beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing.
|These things happened in Bethabara, beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing.
|
|-
|29
|The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
|The next day, John saw Jesus coming to him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, which takes away the sin of the world."
|Greek "αιρων" means literally two ideas simultaneously: to bear a burden, and to carry that burden away. Here it is translated as "takes away," but this additional implication of burden is lost.
|-
|30
|This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he was before me.
|This is the man I have spoken of when I said, "After me will come a man who is above me, for he existed before me.
|
|-
|31
|And I knew him not: but that he should be made manifest to Israel, therefore am I come baptizing with water.
|I did not know who he was, yet I have come to baptize with water so that He could be revealed to Israel."
|an enigmatic verse; more improvements welcome (see comment page)
|-
|32
|And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.
|And John testified "I saw the Spirit come down like a dove out of heaven, and it stayed upon Jesus."
|
|-
|33
|And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
|"I did not know him who sent me to baptize with water, but that same man said to me, 'The man whom you will see the Spirit descend upon, and remain on, that man is he who will baptize with the Divine Guardian.'"
|As per [[Gospel of Mark (Translated)|Mark 1:8]].
|-
|34
|And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.
|"I saw these things, and testify that this is the Son of God."
|
|-
|35
|Again the next day after John stood, and two of his disciples;
|The next day, John stood again with two of his disciples;
|
|-
|36
|And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!
|and looking upon Jesus as he walked, he said, "Behold! The Lamb of God!"
|
|-
|37
|And the two disciples heard him speak, and they followed Jesus.
|And the two disciples heard this, and they followed Jesus.
|
|-
|38
|Then Jesus turned, and saw them following, and saith unto them, What seek ye? They said unto him, Rabbi, (which is to say, being interpreted, Master,) where dwellest thou?
|Jesus turned, and saw them following him, and said to them, "What do you seek?" They said to him, "Rabbi, where do you live?"
|
|-
|39
|He saith unto them, Come and see. They came and saw where he dwelt, and abode with him that day: for it was about the tenth hour.
|He said to them, "Come and see." They came, and saw where he lived, and stayed with him that day, for it was 10 o'clock.
|
|-
|40
|One of the two which heard John speak, and followed him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother.
|One of these two disciples, who had heard John speak, and followed Jesus, was Andrew, brother of Simon Peter.
|
|-
|41
|He first findeth his own brother Simon, and saith unto him, We have found the Messias, which is, being interpreted, the Christ.
|He first found his brother Simon, and said to him, "We have found the Messiah, the Christ!"
|
|-
|42
|And he brought him to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, Thou art Simon the son of Jona: thou shalt be called Cephas, which is by interpretation, A stone.
|Andrew brought Simon Peter to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, "You are Simon, son of Jonah: you shall be called Cephas, the rock."
|
|-
|43
|The day following Jesus would go forth into Galilee, and findeth Philip, and saith unto him, Follow me.
|The day following, Jesus went forth into Galilee, and finding Phillip, he said to him, "Follow me."
|
|-
|44
|Now Philip was of Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter.
|Phillip was of Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter.
|
|-
|45
|Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.
|Phillip found Nathaniel, and said to him, "We have found him, him of whom Moses and the prophets wrote, Jesus of Nazareth, son of Joseph."
|
|-
|46
|And Nathanael said unto him, Can there any good thing come out of Nazareth? Philip saith unto him, Come and see.
|Nathaniel said to Phillip, "Can any good thing come from Nazareth?" Phillip replied, "Come and see."
|
|-
|47
|Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!
|Jesus saw Nathaniel coming to him, and said of him, "Look! An Israelite indeed, who is incapable of deceit."
|Deceit is a more appropriate translation.
|-
|48
|Nathanael saith unto him, Whence knowest thou me? Jesus answered and said unto him, Before that Philip called thee, when thou wast under the fig tree, I saw thee.
|Nathaniel said to him, "How do you know me?" Jesus answered, saying "Before that Phillip called upon you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you."
|Something about Nathaniels experience under the fig tree was profound enough that he was surprised Jesus would know about it. Praying would make sense, as this would imply the divinity of Jesus, which Nathaniel somehow immediately recognizes by Jesus's response here.
|-
|49
|Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
|Nathaniel answered and said, "Rabbi, you are the Son of God, the King of Israel."
|
|-
|50
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Because I said unto thee, I saw thee under the fig tree, believest thou? thou shalt see greater things than these.
|Jesus replied to him, "Because I said to you, 'I saw you under the fig tree,' you believe? You shall see greater things that this."
|
|-
|51
|And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.
|And Jesus continued to Nathaniel, "Truly I tell you, you shall yet see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man."
|
|}

==Chapter 2==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And the third day there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and the mother of Jesus was there:
|Two days later, there was a wedding in Cana of Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there.
|"Third day" means third day after the question of John the Baptist described in John 1:19-28, counting inclusively with the first day, as in Christ rising on the third day
|-
|2
|And both Jesus was called, and his disciples, to the marriage.
|Jesus, and his disciples, were invited to the wedding.
|
|-
|3
|And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine.
|When they wedding party wanted wine, the mother of Jesus said to him, "They have no wine."
|
|-
|4
|Jesus saith unto her, Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come.
|Jesus said to her, "Dear woman, it is not my time yet. What do I have to do with this?"
|"γυναι" is a respectful form of address for a woman. "ο" could mean "you," but can also mean "this," and in context, the latter makes more sense.
|-
|5
|His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it.
|His mother said to the servants, "Do what he tells you to do."
|Despite His apparent refusal in John 2:4, it must have been clear to those present that he intended to grant his mothers request, for no further argument is written.
|-
|6
|And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece.
|So there were placed six large stone pots, used for washing at Jewish feasts, and these could contain about twenty gallons each.
|Greek "μετρητας," a unit a measure thought to be somewhere between 7 and 9 Imperial gallons.
|-
|7
|Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim.
|Jesus said to the servants, "Fill the pots with water." And they filled them up to the brim.
|
|-
|8
|And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it.
|And he said to them, "Carry them out now to the host of this feast." And so they did.
|
|-
|9
|When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine, and knew not whence it was: (but the servants which drew the water knew;) the governor of the feast called the bridegroom,
|When the host of the wedding feast tasted the water, it had been made into wine, and he did not know where the wine had come from (though the servants knew), and so the host of the wedding feast called the groom,
|
|-
|10
|And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
|And said to him, "Usually, a man, at the beginning of a feast, sets out his good wine, and when all have drank their fill, then the poorer quality wine. But you have kept your good wine for last!"
|
|-
|11
|This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
|This was the first of the miracles Jesus did in Cana of Galilee, and by doing showed his glory, and so his disciples believed in him.
|
|-
|12
|After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days.
|After this, he went down to Capernaum, with his mother and brothers and disciples. They stayed there for only a few days.
|
|-
|13
|And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem,
|When the Jews' passover was at hand, Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
|
|-
|14
|And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
|He found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the money changers, all sitting.
|Roman coins were not allowed in the temple; "money changes" refers to those who profited by exchanging coins outside the temple for purer, Jewish coins, which Jews could use inside the temple to purchase animals for sacrifice.
|-
|15
|And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;
|Jesus made a whip out of small ropes, and drove all these people out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen, and poured out the money changers' money, and knocked over the tables.
|
|-
|16
|And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise.
|And said to those who sold doves, "Take these things away; do not make my Father's house a house of business."
|
|-
|17
|And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.
|And his disciples remembered that it was written, "The zeal of your house has eaten me up."
|Specifically, Psalms 69:9
|-
|18
|Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?
|The Jews responded to Jesus, "What sign can you show to us, that might justify your actions to us?"
|
|-
|19
|Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
|Jesus answered, saying, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will rebuild it."
|
|-
|20
|Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
|Then the Jews said, "It took forty-six years to build this temple, and you would rebuild it in three days?"
|
|-
|21
|But he spake of the temple of his body.
|But He meant the temple of his body.
|
|-
|22
|When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.
|That is why, when He was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this to them, and they believed the scripture, and the things which Jesus had said.
|
|-
|23
|Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
|When He was in Jerusalem at passover, on the feast day, many believed in Him superficially, when they saw the miracles which He did.
|
|-
|24
|But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
|But Jesus did not commit himself to them, because he knew all men,
|
|-
|25
|And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.
|And did not need any man to speak on his behalf, for he knew what was in the hearts of men.
|
|}

==Chapter 3==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
|There was a Pharisee man by the name of Nicodemus, who was a ruler of the Jews:
|
|-
|2
|The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
|This man came to Jesus at night, and said to him, "Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher sent from God: for no man could do the miracles that you do, unless God was with him."
|
|-
|3
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
|Jesus answered him, saying "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a man is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
|
|-
|4
|Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
|Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter again into his mother's womb, and be reborn?"
|
|-
|5
|Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
|Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|6
|That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
|That which is born of flesh, is flesh; but that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
|
|-
|7
|Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
|So you should not be surprised that I say to you that you must be born again.
|
|-
|8
|The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
|The wind blows where it likes, and you may hear the sound of it, but cannot say from where it comes, or where it goes: like this is one who is born of the Spirit."
|
|-
|9
|Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be?
|Nicodemus replied, saying to Him, "How can these things be true?"
|
|-
|10
|Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
|Jesus answered, saying to him, "Are you not a ruler of Israel? Do you not know these things?
|
|-
|11
|Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
|Truly, truly, I say to you, that we speak of things we know, and speak of things we have seen, and yet you do not believe us.
|
|-
|12
|If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
|I have told you of earthly things, and you do not believe me. How, then, will you believe if I tell you of heavenly things?
|
|-
|13
|And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
|No man has gone up to heaven except He that came down from heaven - the Son of man.
|
|-
|14
|And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
|As Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, just in this way must the Son of man be lifted up,
|
|-
|15
|That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|That he who believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|
|-
|16
|For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
|For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that who believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life.
|
|-
|17
|For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
|For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn it, but to save it.
|
|-
|18
|He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
|He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
|
|-
|19
|And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
|And this is the condemnation: that light came into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light, because their actions were evil.
|
|-
|20
|For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
|For all those who do evil things hate the light, and avoid coming to the light, to avoid judgment of their actions.
|
|-
|21
|But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
|But he whose actions are just is drawn to the light, that his actions may be known, for they are done through God."
|
|-
|22
|After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
|After these things, Jesus and his disciples went into the land of Judea, and there he met with them, and baptized.
|
|-
|23
|And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.
|And John was also baptizing, in Aenon, near Salim, because there was a good deal of water there, and they came, and were baptized.
|
|-
|24
|For John was not yet cast into prison.
|This was when John had not yet been imprisoned.
|
|-
|25
|Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying.
|There arose a question between some of John's disciples, and the rest of the Jews, about purification.
|
|-
|26
|And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.
|So they came to John, and said, "Rabbi, he that was with you beyond Jordan, to whom you bore witness, now he is baptizing, and all the men go to him."
|
|-
|27
|John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
|John answered them, saying, "All that a man receives is given to him from heaven.
|
|-
|28
|Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him.
|You have seen, that never said I was the Christ, but instead I said that I was sent before him.
|
|-
|29
|He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
|He that has the bride is the groom, but the friend of the groom, who stands by him and hears him, rejoices because of the grooms voice: this is why I am now joyed.
|
|-
|30
|He must increase, but I must decrease.
|He must be greater, but I must then be less than what I am now.
|
|-
|31
|He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
|Jesus, who comes from above is above all, while I who am of the Earth am earthly, and my words are not from Heaven. God is above all."
|
|-
|32
|And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
|And what He has seen and hears He is testifying to; but nobody receives His testimony.
|This appears to be part of the above quote. Difficult to capture the present progressive in marturei without awkwardness, but it's there. Testimony more accurately captures the sense of marturei, which refers to legal evidence.
|-
|33
|He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
|He who hears his words, has acknowledged the truth of God.
|This needs some work.
|-
|34
|For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
|
|
|-
|35
|The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
|
|
|-
|36
|He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 4==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John,
|
|
|-
|2
|(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)
|
|
|-
|3
|He left Judaea, and departed again into Galilee.
|
|
|-
|4
|And he must needs go through Samaria.
|
|
|-
|5
|Then cometh he to a city of Samaria, which is called Sychar, near to the parcel of ground that Jacob gave to his son Joseph.
|
|
|-
|6
|Now Jacob's well was there. Jesus therefore, being wearied with his journey, sat thus on the well: and it was about the sixth hour.
|
|
|-
|7
|There cometh a woman of Samaria to draw water: Jesus saith unto her, Give me to drink.
|
|
|-
|8
|(For his disciples were gone away unto the city to buy meat.)
|
|
|-
|9
|Then saith the woman of Samaria unto him, How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, which am a woman of Samaria? for the Jews have no dealings with the Samaritans.
|
|
|-
|10
|Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
|
|
|-
|11
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?
|
|
|-
|12
|Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
|
|
|-
|13
|Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
|
|
|-
|14
|But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
|
|
|-
|15
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, give me this water, that I thirst not, neither come hither to draw.
|
|
|-
|16
|Jesus saith unto her, Go, call thy husband, and come hither.
|
|
|-
|17
|The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said, I have no husband:
|
|
|-
|18
|For thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidst thou truly.
|
|
|-
|19
|The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet.
|
|
|-
|20
|Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
|
|
|-
|21
|Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
|
|
|-
|22
|Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
|
|
|-
|23
|But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
|
|
|-
|24
|God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
|
|
|-
|25
|The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
|
|
|-
|26
|Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
|
|
|-
|27
|And upon this came his disciples, and marvelled that he talked with the woman: yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why talkest thou with her?
|
|
|-
|28
|The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men,
|
|
|-
|29
|Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ?
|
|
|-
|30
|Then they went out of the city, and came unto him.
|
|
|-
|31
|In the mean while his disciples prayed him, saying, Master, eat.
|
|
|-
|32
|But he said unto them, I have meat to eat that ye know not of.
|
|
|-
|33
|Therefore said the disciples one to another, Hath any man brought him ought to eat?
|
|
|-
|34
|Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.
|
|
|-
|35
|Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.
|
|
|-
|36
|And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.
|
|
|-
|37
|And herein is that saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth.
|
|
|-
|38
|I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour: other men laboured, and ye are entered into their labours.
|
|
|-
|39
|And many of the Samaritans of that city believed on him for the saying of the woman, which testified, He told me all that ever I did.
|
|
|-
|40
|So when the Samaritans were come unto him, they besought him that he would tarry with them: and he abode there two days.
|
|
|-
|41
|And many more believed because of his own word;
|
|
|-
|42
|And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.
|
|
|-
|43
|Now after two days he departed thence, and went into Galilee.
|
|
|-
|44
|For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honour in his own country.
|
|
|-
|45
|Then when he was come into Galilee, the Galilaeans received him, having seen all the things that he did at Jerusalem at the feast: for they also went unto the feast.
|
|
|-
|46
|So Jesus came again into Cana of Galilee, where he made the water wine. And there was a certain nobleman, whose son was sick at Capernaum.
|
|
|-
|47
|When he heard that Jesus was come out of Judaea into Galilee, he went unto him, and besought him that he would come down, and heal his son: for he was at the point of death.
|
|
|-
|48
|Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.
|
|
|-
|49
|The nobleman saith unto him, Sir, come down ere my child die.
|
|
|-
|50
|Jesus saith unto him, Go thy way; thy son liveth. And the man believed the word that Jesus had spoken unto him, and he went his way.
|
|
|-
|51
|And as he was now going down, his servants met him, and told him, saying, Thy son liveth.
|
|
|-
|52
|Then inquired he of them the hour when he began to amend. And they said unto him, Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him.
|
|
|-
|53
|So the father knew that it was at the same hour, in the which Jesus said unto him, Thy son liveth: and himself believed, and his whole house.
|
|
|-
|54
|This is again the second miracle that Jesus did, when he was come out of Judaea into Galilee.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 5==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After this there was a feast of the Jews; and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
|
|
|-
|2
|Now there is at Jerusalem by the sheep market a pool, which is called in the Hebrew tongue Bethesda, having five porches.
|
|
|-
|3
|In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water.
|
|
|-
|4
|For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.
|
|
|-
|5
|And a certain man was there, which had an infirmity thirty and eight years.
|
|
|-
|6
|When Jesus saw him lie, and knew that he had been now a long time in that case, he saith unto him, Wilt thou be made whole?
|
|
|-
|7
|The impotent man answered him, Sir, I have no man, when the water is troubled, to put me into the pool: but while I am coming, another steppeth down before me.
|
|
|-
|8
|Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk.
|
|
|-
|9
|And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath.
|
|
|-
|10
|The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
|
|
|-
|11
|He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk.
|
|
|-
|12
|Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk?
|
|
|-
|13
|And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
|
|
|-
|15
|The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
|
|
|-
|16
|And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
|
|
|-
|17
|But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
|
|
|-
|18
|Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
|
|
|-
|19
|Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
|
|
|-
|20
|For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel.
|
|
|-
|21
|For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.
|
|
|-
|22
|For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
|
|
|-
|23
|That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
|
|
|-
|24
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
|
|
|-
|25
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
|
|
|-
|26
|For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
|
|
|-
|27
|And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
|
|
|-
|28
|Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
|
|
|-
|29
|And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
|
|
|-
|30
|I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|31
|If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.|
|
|
|-
|32
|There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true.
|
|
|-
|33
|Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth.
|
|
|-
|34
|But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved.
|
|
|-
|35
|He was a burning and a shining light: and ye were willing for a season to rejoice in his light.
|
|
|-
|36
|But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|37
|And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
|
|
|-
|38
|And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
|
|
|-
|39
|Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
|
|
|-
|40
|And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
|
|
|-
|41
|I receive not honour from men.
|
|
|-
|42
|But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
|
|
|-
|43
|I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
|
|
|-
|44
|How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
|
|
|-
|45
|Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
|
|
|-
|46
|For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
|
|
|-
|47
|But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
|
|
|}

==Chapter 6==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After these things Jesus went over the sea of Galilee, which is the sea of Tiberias.
|
|
|-
|2
|And a great multitude followed him, because they saw his miracles which he did on them that were diseased.
|
|
|-
|3
|And Jesus went up into a mountain, and there he sat with his disciples.
|
|
|-
|4
|And the passover, a feast of the Jews, was nigh.
|
|
|-
|5
|When Jesus then lifted up his eyes, and saw a great company come unto him, he saith unto Philip, Whence shall we buy bread, that these may eat?
|
|
|-
|6
|And this he said to prove him: for he himself knew what he would do.
|
|
|-
|7
|Philip answered him, Two hundred pennyworth of bread is not sufficient for them, that every one of them may take a little.
|
|
|-
|8
|One of his disciples, Andrew, Simon Peter's brother, saith unto him,
|
|
|-
|9
|There is a lad here, which hath five barley loaves, and two small fishes: but what are they among so many?
|
|
|-
|10
|And Jesus said, Make the men sit down. Now there was much grass in the place. So the men sat down, in number about five thousand.
|
|
|-
|11
|And Jesus took the loaves; and when he had given thanks, he distributed to the disciples, and the disciples to them that were set down; and likewise of the fishes as much as they would.
|
|
|-
|12
|When they were filled, he said unto his disciples, Gather up the fragments that remain, that nothing be lost.
|
|
|-
|13
|Therefore they gathered them together, and filled twelve baskets with the fragments of the five barley loaves, which remained over and above unto them that had eaten.
|
|
|-
|14
|Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world.
|
|
|-
|15
|When Jesus therefore perceived that they would come and take him by force, to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain himself alone.
|
|
|-
|16
|And when even was now come, his disciples went down unto the sea,
|
|
|-
|17
|And entered into a ship, and went over the sea toward Capernaum. And it was now dark, and Jesus was not come to them.
|
|
|-
|18
|And the sea arose by reason of a great wind that blew.
|
|
|-
|19
|So when they had rowed about five and twenty or thirty furlongs, they see Jesus walking on the sea, and drawing nigh unto the ship: and they were afraid.
|
|
|-
|20
|But he saith unto them, It is I; be not afraid.
|
|
|-
|21
|Then they willingly received him into the ship: and immediately the ship was at the land whither they went.
|
|
|-
|22
|The day following, when the people which stood on the other side of the sea saw that there was none other boat there, save that one whereinto his disciples were entered, and that Jesus went not with his disciples into the boat, but that his disciples were gone away alone;
|
|
|-
|23
|(Howbeit there came other boats from Tiberias nigh unto the place where they did eat bread, after that the Lord had given thanks:)
|
|
|-
|24
|When the people therefore saw that Jesus was not there, neither his disciples, they also took shipping, and came to Capernaum, seeking for Jesus.
|
|
|-
|25
|And when they had found him on the other side of the sea, they said unto him, Rabbi, when camest thou hither?
|
|
|-
|26
|Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled.
|
|
|-
|27
|Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
|
|
|-
|28
|Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
|
|
|-
|29
|Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
|
|
|-
|30
|They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?
|
|
|-
|31
|Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat.
|
|
|-
|32
|Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
|
|
|-
|33
|For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
|
|
|-
|34
|Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
|
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
|
|
|-
|36
|But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
|
|
|-
|37
|All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
|
|
|-
|38
|For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
|
|
|-
|39
|And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
|
|
|-
|40
|And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|41
|The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven.
|
|
|-
|42
|And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven?
|
|
|-
|43
|Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.
|
|
|-
|44
|No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|45
|It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
|
|
|-
|46
|Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
|
|
|-
|47
|Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
|
|
|-
|48
|I am that bread of life.
|
|
|-
|49
|Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
|
|
|-
|50
|This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
|
|
|-
|51
|I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
|
|
|-
|52
|The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
|
|
|-
|53
|Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
|
|
|-
|54
|Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
|
|
|-
|55
|For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
|
|
|-
|56
|He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
|
|
|-
|57
|As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
|
|
|-
|58
|This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
|
|
|-
|59
|These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
|
|
|-
|60
|Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
|
|
|-
|61
|When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
|
|
|-
|62
|What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
|
|
|-
|63
|It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
|
|
|-
|64
|But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
|
|
|-
|65
|And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
|
|
|-
|66
|From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
|From then on many disciples abandoned Jesus.
|
|-
|67
|Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
|So Jesus said to the Twelve, "Will you also leave me?"
|
|-
|68
|Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
|Simon Peter replied, "Lord, who else is there? You have the words of eternal life.
|
|-
|69
|And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
|We are certain that you are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
|
|-
|70
|Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
|
|
|-
|71
|He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 7==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him.
|
|
|-
|2
|Now the Jews' feast of tabernacles was at hand.
|
|
|-
|3
|His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest.
|
|
|-
|4
|For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world.
|
|
|-
|5
|For neither did his brethren believe in him.
|
|
|-
|6
|Then Jesus said unto them, My time is not yet come: but your time is always ready.
|
|
|-
|7
|The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.
|
|
|-
|8
|Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast; for my time is not yet full come.
|
|
|-
|9
|When he had said these words unto them, he abode still in Galilee.
|
|
|-
|10
|But when his brethren were gone up, then went he also up unto the feast, not openly, but as it were in secret.
|
|
|-
|11
|Then the Jews sought him at the feast, and said, Where is he?
|
|
|-
|12
|And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said, Nay; but he deceiveth the people.
|
|
|-
|13
|Howbeit no man spake openly of him for fear of the Jews.
|
|
|-
|14
|Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught.
|
|
|-
|15
|And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?
|
|
|-
|16
|Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
|
|
|-
|17

|If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
|
|
|-
|18
|He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.
|
|
|-
|19
|Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?
|
|
|-
|20
|The people answered and said, Thou hast a devil: who goeth about to kill thee?
|
|
|-
|21
|Jesus answered and said unto them, I have done one work, and ye all marvel.
|
|
|-
|22
|Moses therefore gave unto you circumcision; (not because it is of Moses, but of the fathers;) and ye on the sabbath day circumcise a man.
|
|
|-
|23
|If a man on the sabbath day receive circumcision, that the law of Moses should not be broken; are ye angry at me, because I have made a man every whit whole on the sabbath day?
|
|
|-
|24
|Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
|
|
|-
|25
|Then said some of them of Jerusalem, Is not this he, whom they seek to kill?
|
|
|-
|26
|But, lo, he speaketh boldly, and they say nothing unto him. Do the rulers know indeed that this is the very Christ?
|
|
|-
|27
|Howbeit we know this man whence he is: but when Christ cometh, no man knoweth whence he is.
|
|
|-
|28
|Then cried Jesus in the temple as he taught, saying, Ye both know me, and ye know whence I am: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not.
|
|
|-
|29
|But I know him: for I am from him, and he hath sent me.
|
|
|-
|30
|Then they sought to take him: but no man laid hands on him, because his hour was not yet come.
|
|
|-
|31
|And many of the people believed on him, and said, When Christ cometh, will he do more miracles than these which this man hath done?
|
|
|-
|32
|The Pharisees heard that the people murmured such things concerning him; and the Pharisees and the chief priests sent officers to take him.
|
|
|-
|33
|Then said Jesus unto them, Yet a little while am I with you, and then I go unto him that sent me.
|
|
|-
|34
|Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come.
|
|
|-
|35
|Then said the Jews among themselves, Whither will he go, that we shall not find him? will he go unto the dispersed among the Gentiles, and teach the Gentiles?
|
|
|-
|36
|What manner of saying is this that he said, Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come?
|
|
|-
|37
|In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
|
|
|-
|38
|He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
|
|
|-
|39
|(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
|
|
|-
|40
|Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
|
|
|-
|41
|Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
|
|
|-
|42
|Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
|
|
|-
|43
|So there was a division among the people because of him.
|
|
|-
|44
|And some of them would have taken him; but no man laid hands on him.
|
|
|-
|45
|Then came the officers to the chief priests and Pharisees; and they said unto them, Why have ye not brought him?
|
|
|-
|46
|The officers answered, Never man spake like this man.
|
|
|-
|47
|Then answered them the Pharisees, Are ye also deceived?
|
|
|-
|48
|Have any of the rulers or of the Pharisees believed on him?
|
|
|-
|49
|But this people who knoweth not the law are cursed.
|
|
|-
|50
|Nicodemus saith unto them, (he that came to Jesus by night, being one of them,)
|
|
|-
|51
|Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?
|
|
|-
|52
|They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
|
|
|-
|53
|And every man went unto his own house.
|
|
|}

[[Category:Conservative Bible]]

== See also ==

*[[John 8-14 (Translated)]]
*[[Gospel of John (Translated)]]

Talk:John 1-7 (Translated)

2009-10-16T13:05:19Z

Danielitld: /* Logos = the Word */ new section

== Truth or word ==
While I agree "truth" has too narrow a meaning, at first glance, it may serve the purpose well when explained properly. Sadly, many Christians believe that "word" refers to the Bible itself, rather than the deep concept of ''logos''. Is there a better term than either? Message? [[User:DouglasA|DouglasA]] 22:12, 26 August 2009 (EDT)
:I'm not a Greek scholar, but λογος, as I understand it, had an enormous range of implications in first century Greek, deeply rooted in a Greek culture which held all reality to be logical and ordered, and flowing from logic and order. While truth is being used now, I think we would be hard pressed to find a single word which encompasses all the meaning and implications of λογος. The question we must ask ourselves, is how much of the beauty of the first passage(s) of John are we willing sacrifice to give a completely accurate translation? If we don't care at all for the prose, perhaps John 1:1 might better read, "In the beginning was truth, reason, wisdom, and harmony, and all this was with God for this is what God is." A suggestion. [[User:JacobB|JacobB]] 17:10, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
::Whoops, sorry for putting the comment Re 1:9 in the wrong place. Feel free to just delete it if you want. --[[User:MarkGall|MarkGall]] 17:28, 1 October 2009 (EDT)
:::The more foundational question that needs to be decided here is whether this is going to be a dynamic paraphrase, or a strict translation. In other words, are we attempting to relate what the Greek actually SAYS, or are we attempting to explain what we believe it MEANS? If this is a strict translation, then using "truth" in John 1:1 is not an option, as the word "aletheia" does not appear in that verse. Like it or not, we are stuck with legitimate translations of logos: "word, message, reason, communication, thought, etc." If, however, this is more of a dynamic paraphrase, then we are not restricted by what the Greek actually says, and are free to use whatever words we need to "explain" what the Greek means. In that case, we can describe the force and meaning of logos in our "translation." As it stands right now, this is something of an odd cross between a translation and a paraphrase. So we need a philosophy of translation that goes beyond "conservative" and guides us in how strict or loose we are allowed to be in this re-translation. That alone would settle many of these translation disputes. [[user:Mback|Mback]]

::::We're doing a "thought-for-thought" translation. That's not a paraphrase, but that's not tied down by literalism either.

::::That said, I'm not entirely comfortable with "truth", as it has harsh connotations that are contrary to forgiveness. "Word" does have advantages, but it is so diluted. This debate may continue on.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:06, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:2 ==

The entire purpose of verse two is emphasis, and some of that is lost in this translation. "All this" is not the best translation to relate the force of "houtos" in this construction. In verse 2 "houtos" is serving as an emphatic form of "autos," placing extra emphasis on "this '''SAME''' individual..." The purpose here is to emphasize the personal nature of the logos in verse one. "This same one," or even "this very same one" or something like that would be better. As it stands now, "all this" does exactly the opposite of what the Greek is attempting to relate: it DE-PERSONALIZES the logos from verse one, which is actually a more "liberal" approach to this verse. [[user:Mback|Mback]] 12:08, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: You're a genius, Mback! Changed as suggested.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:09, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:3 ==

P66 has "outen" (nothing) in this verse while P75 has "oute hen" (not one thing), which is simply a more emphatic form of "outen." Our translation suggests we are going with the Greek in P75 (wise choice, given that p66 has 5 times as many copy errors as p75), and if that is the case, we should keep the emphatic nature of the words found there. "Not one thing" or "not one single thing" relates the emphatic force of the Greek much better than "no thing." The repetition of "ginomai" is also a function of emphasis, but, again, depending on how strict we are going to be, we probably can get away with dropping the last "that has been made" in this verse, as this translation does. [[user:Mback|Mback]] 12:21, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Mback, you're obviously brilliant, knowledgeable and meticulous. I made your change here but please feel free to edit any of the translations directly yourself, along with your highly informative comments!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:13, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

:: Wow. I am humbled and honored by your words and confidence. I promise you that anything I do will be done prayerfully and with full consideration to the thoughts and ideas of everyone contributing. Thank you, sir. [[user:Mback|Mback]] 8:25, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:4 ==

I guess I need to know if we are doing a paraphrase or a strict translation, because this verse as it stands is a paraphrase. "He was the source of life" works in terms of relating what the Greek means (paraphrase), but that is NOT what the Greek actually says (strict translation). As a paraphrase, I don't see any reason why we can't do a better job of distinguishing between "dzoe" and "bios." How about something like, "He was the source of real life..." or "Real life was found only in Him, and ..."? [[user:Mback|Mback]] 12:43, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:5 ==

While this verse definitely has many different modern translations, "snuff it out" is an idiom, not a defined "dictionary" word. That phrase gives this a strong "Message paraphrase" feel, as opposed to a more scholarly, exacting translation. Is that what we want? I have no problem with idioms, but in a strict translation, you usually limit the use of idioms in English to places where idioms occur in the Greek (which, admittedly, is fairly common). [[user:Mback|Mback]] 12:52, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

: Interesting point. Thanks. I'll check out your other suggestions also.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:34, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:7 ==

Note that the use of "houtos" in this verse is similar to how John uses it in verse two. John uses it as a more emphatic form of "autos," emphasizing that "this SAME John who was just mentioned in the previous sentence" is the one being referenced here. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 1:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:9 ==

"Animates" is not a good translation of photidzo, but it is a marginally adequate paraphrase, if we are OK with the fact that it changes the flow of John's argument. Strictly speaking, in modern English "animates" references "giving life to" or "bringing to life." It could be argued that this is the effect of the light of God, making it a VERY loose paraphrase of what this verse is talking about, but it is a very poor word choice if the goal is a strict translation. The problem is that our translation takes the REVERSE meaning of verse four, which tells us that the real life He had within Him gave light to men. The current translation of this verse reverses that, and says the light from Him gives life. We could argue that this is still a true statement, but being a true statement, and being an accurate translation of the verse is not the same thing. Reversing the statement of verse four is NOT what the Greek is intending here. This verse is a follow up to the previous verses contrasting light with darkness, and photidzo specifically is "to enlighten, to bring into the light, to illuminate, to shine a light upon." The point of this verse is supposed to be that the true light brings us out of darkness, NOT that it gives us life. There is a difference between translating a verse into an English statement that just happens to be true, versus translating it into an English statement that actually relates what the verse SAYS, and is also true. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 1:55, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:1 and 1:14 ==

Using "Truth" for λογος in 1:1 but then "spirit" in 1:14 is not theologically sound. In the KJV, we have "the Word was God ... and the Word was made flesh" which indisputably places Jesus as being God. Changing from "Truth" to "spirit" breaks that link between the two and can mislead readers into a sub-Arian interpretation where Jesus is the son and messenger of God rather than being God Incarnate in human form.

: I agree completely. Whatever word we use for "logos" in verse 1 HAS to be used here. John's phrasing in this verse is NOT just to make a vague comment about "the spirit" becoming flesh (which is actually a very liberal, new age way of looking at this verse), but rather, specifically that the logos of verse 1, who is both "with" God and "is" God, became flesh. It is my understanding that a conservative translation would emphasize the "incarnate God" aspect of Jesus' birth, as opposed to de-emphasizing it, which is what this translation currently does. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:07, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:16 ==

Translating "lambano" as "benefited" is certainly unusual, but can only be considered "appropriate" if our translation guidelines are "very, very loose paraphrase." This is, again, a discussion of whether or not our goal is to translate the Greek into something that "kind of relates the force and effect" of the Greek versus coming much closer to what the Greek actually SAYS. Lambano never has the meaning of "benefits" anywhere in the New Testament. Is the EFFECT of "receiving" beneficial? Absolutely. But the "effect" of the word and the "meaning" of the word are not the same thing. Even without having seen it explicitly explained, it is becoming very clear that this is some form of a paraphrase, not a strict translation . . . which is fine, as a good paraphrase does serve a purpose, but we need to be up front and clear about that right at the outset. This translation falls into the category of paraphrases currently occupied by such versions as "The Message" and "Good News for Modern Man" and "Today's New International Version" (we just have a different goal: the Conservative Paraphrase). It seems clear at this point that we are NOT attempting a strict "word for word" or even "phrase for phrase" translation, such as that found in the KJV, NIV, NASB, ESV, or any other version that attempts to stick strictly to what the Greek actually SAYS. Again, that is fine so long as that is what we really WANT. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:27, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:18 ==

Using "spoken of" for "exegeomai" is a very surface translation of what this word relates, and has the effect of narrowing the force of this verse. Exegeomai is a much stronger word which is more about "unfolding" or "laying out in detail." It actually relates the idea of presenting something with great depth and breadth, a richer, fuller, more detailed explanation; it is not just "speaking about" something, but more carries the idea of "explaining" that thing. "Explained," or "unfolded" or even "thoroughly presented" would related the idea of this word better in this context. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:38, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:19 ==

"Testimony" is a MUCH, MUCH better translation of "marturia" than "record." Excellent choice here. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:49, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:21 ==

Just as a note here, this is one of the verses that Muslims use to claim that the New Testament foretells the coming of Mohamed. They believe that all references to "that prophet" or "the prophet" are prophesies about the expected FINAL prophet who would set everyone straight: Mohamed. The thing to note here is that John was not denying being a specific prophet, he was actually denying being a prophet of any kind. Whether through humility or because he had a different ministry, John chose NOT to classify himself as a prophet, something that is re-enforced in verse 25 where we render the same Greek construction as "another prophet." Since this seems to be more of a paraphrase than a strict translation, it really would relate the meaning of this verse better to say simply "another prophet" here, as we do in verse 25. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:23 ==

Euthuno means "straight, straightened out", not "clear." The idea is NOT about removing obstacles in the path, but rather, that the path have no turns or side routes. In other words, "there is only ONE path that leads to God, and it has no turns or curves" (which is very much the conservative message, is it not?). While it is true that the Hebrew uses the words "clear" and "smooth" here, this is actually from the Septuagint, which uses "euthus," the substantive form of euthuno, meaning "straight." In other words, John doesn't just quote the OT, by quoting the Septuagint, he uses a quote that actually relates the INTENT or MEANING of the Hebrew. If John believes that was a good choice, I think we should stick with his selection, and translate the Greek found in this verse, NOT the Hebrew found in Isaiah 40:3. This shows that the struggle between "strict translation" and "paraphrase" is a very old one. The translators of the Septuagint actually used a mild Greek paraphrase of the Hebrew in translating Isaiah 40:3, and John gives added authority to the wise choice of that paraphrase by choosing their wording (as opposed to a direct and stricter translation of the Hebrew) for his quotation.

Additionally, I think the ending phrase "just as the prophet Isaiah was" is not quite as clear as it could be. This choice makes the force of the verse be: I am a voice in the wilderness . . . just like Isaiah was. This is true, but it kind of loses the point that this is not just something Isaiah did, but is, in fact, a QUOTATION from Isaiah. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 3:22, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:24 ==

This is a fairly minor point, but this verse does not say those questioning "were Pharisees," it says, εκ των φαρισαιων; that is, they were "from the Pharisees." The implication is that the pharisees themselves were too cowardly to come in person, so they sent others, probably students or servants, to do the questioning for them. I think that is a point worth preserving here. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 7:35, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:27 ==

Both this translation and the KJV lose the startling and contrasting points that John is making here. The Greek is closer to "he is the one coming after me who existed prior to me..." (ος εμπροσθεν μου γεγονεν). John was actually pointing toward the eternal nature of the one coming after him, kind of in line with "before Abraham was, I am." While it is obvious that God is above him, the point is that this is not just "some random guy who is above me," but rather, this person is, in fact, the eternal God in physical form. "Existed before me" or some equivalent phrase would be more accurate, and would be more in line with the startling, worldview altering point (at least to Jews) that John is making here. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 7:58, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:29 ==

Excellent point on the meaning of "airo." A possible solution to this would be "takes away the sinful burden..." or "takes away the burden of sin..." or maybe a more subtle "lifts and carries away the sin..." Any of these would capture at least a little of this extra force found in the Greek. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 8:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:30 ==

Again, John's statement here is closer to "after me comes a man who existed prior to me, because he was before me," which is a very emphatic way of pointing to the pre-existence of Christ, particularly as the last phrase uses "protos," which strictly speaking tells us that John is saying Christ "came first, before me." A strong, emphatic statement. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 8:28, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:31 ==

The tense is wrong here. It is NOT present tense ("I do not know..."), but pluperfect (past completed - "I had not known..."). The construction used here means "I had not (before this very moment) known who He was...". An acceptable translation would be, "I did not know who he was...," but placing this in the present tense completely misses what the Greek is saying. Eido is something of a surface kind of knowing and seeing, thus it is, in this context, about identity, not a deeper kind of "knowing him personally." The point here is that John was preparing the way for one who would take away our sins, but until this very moment, he did not know the exact identity of that man.

Also, in contrast with eido, phaneroo is more "revealed, unveiled, made publicly known," so translating both words with the same English word kind of misses what is going on here. The second half of this sentence is a purpose clause, showing the REASON that John came baptizing. This entire intent of this sentence is more like this: "I did not know who he was, but despite that, I have come to baptize people with water so that He could be revealed to Israel" (and yes, reversing the order of the clauses in this kind of purpose clause for clarity is completely legitimate).
[[User:Mback|Mback]] 9:59, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:33 ==

Same tense and construction as 1:31, but here translated in the correct tense (I did not know...). Eido used in this context really does mean "I did not know '''who''' he was..." as opposed to "I did not know him personally...", and that subtle distinction should probably be preserved in the translation. After all, John knew Jesus, His God and creator, in His spirit, which is why he recognized God in the flesh standing before him. What John did not know was the identity of the man who was God in the flesh.

Redefining the Holy Spirit as the Divine Guardian is a questionable move for several reasons. First, the Greek '''literally''' says "Holy Spirit," and I find the idea of renaming a member of the Trinity completely distasteful. Second, Holy Spirit is NOT a title that has been largely redefined by our culture, so there is no need to redefine it - everyone knows that one part of the Trinity is called the "Holy Spirit." Third, it places a narrow description (guardian) upon the Holy Spirit that simply fails to even come close to all that the Holy Spirit does. Finally, it is a phrase that sounds VERY new age, and would be gladly and wholeheartedly welcomed by the eastern religion/new age element of our culture. We should not be trying to make Christianity easier to ignore because it uses new age terminology (and thus is just "another" way to god), but rather, more distinct and separate from the ideas and titles of false religions. Calling the Holy Spirit by a different name because we are not happy with what the Bible actually says is NOT a conservative thing to do; that simply smacks of liberalism in the extreme.[[User:Mback|Mback]] 10:16, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== 1:42 ==

I would like to suggest here that for clarity, we give BOTH the common transliteration and the translation of "petros": "...you shall be called Cephas or Peter (the Rock)." For those who are new to scripture, that would just bring some clarity as to where the name "Peter" came from. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 10:31, 15 October 2009 (EDT)

== John 2:1 ==

Would 2:1 be a little clearer if it were changed to something along the lines of 'A few days later...'? I took 'third day' to mean either the third day of the week or, possibly, the 3rd day after 1:51.

: Your suggestion is a good one, but I'm reluctant to remove information that is in the Greek. But certainly the reference to the third day could be clarified in some way for the reader, and I encourage you to do so by editing it.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:11, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

:: I slid this down so it falls under the heading for 2:1, and fits more chronologically. I apologize if this is not allowed by a non-administrator. [[User:Mback|Mback]] 2:02, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

Doesn't "''the third day''" mean "'''two''' days later" instead of "'''three''' days later" because of the custom of counting inclusively?
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counting#Inclusive_counting for details.

: Your point is an excellent one, not because of your site, but because Christ rose on the "third day" (which was two days after Friday).--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:08, 7 October 2009 (EDT)

== Logos = the Word ==

There really shouldn't be much of a debate over using "Truth" or "Word" in John 1:1. In the Greek text, the word logos is used, which refers to something being said. Hence "Word" is better than "Truth". Also, truth in Greek is aletheia, and that word is not in the text.

Mark 9-16 (Translated)

2009-10-15T13:37:46Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 9==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
|Jesus said the them, "Truly I tell you, there are some of you who stand here will live to see the kingdom of God come with power."
|Jesus refers here to the founding of the Church, which truly begins with the events of Acts 2:1-4.
|-
|2
|And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
|After six days Jesus took Peter, James, and John, and led them up into a high mountain, and was transfigured before them.
|
|-
|3
|And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
|His clothing was shining, whiter than snow, or anything else on Earth.
|
|-
|4
|And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
|And they saw Elijah and Moses, and they spoke with Jesus.
|
|-
|5
|And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
|Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good for us to be here. Let us make three tents for the blessed, one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah."
|
|-
|6
|For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
|For he was did not know what to say, they were so nervous.
|Perhaps they were afraid, yes, but not as one is afraid of a fire or an animal, but afraid of disrespecting the divine - thoughts on this?
|-
|7
|And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.
|Now a cloud came and cast a shadow all around, and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is my beloved Son: hear His words."
|
|-
|8
|And suddenly, when they had looked round about, they saw no man any more, save Jesus only with themselves.
|When they looked around them, they could not see a single person, except Jesus and themselves.
|
|-
|9
|And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
|As they came down the mountain, he asked them not to tell anyone what they had seen until he, the Son of Man, had risen from the grave.
|
|-
|10
|And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.
|Indeed, they kept his secret, but asked each other what such a resurrection would entail.
|
|-
|11
|And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elias must first come?
|Then they asked Jesus, "Why do the writers say that Elijah will come first?"
|
|-
|12
|And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.
|He responded, "It is true that Elijah must come first to restore everything. Likewise, it is written that the Son of Man must suffer a great deal and be despised."
|
|-
|13
|But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.
|"But Elijah has already come, and the elite did to him whatever they wanted, as was prophesied."
|Clarifying "they" (Herod et. al)
|-
|14
|And when he came to his disciples, he saw a great multitude about them, and the scribes questioning with them.
|Returning to his disciples, he found an enormous crowd had gathered around them, with the intellectuals interrogating them.
|
|-
|15
|And straightway all the people, when they beheld him, were greatly amazed, and running to him saluted him.
|Immediately the whole crowd, seeing Jesus, ran to salute him, amazed by his presence.
|
|-
|16
|And he asked the scribes, What question ye with them?
|Jesus demanded of the intellectuals, "What are you asking the people about?"
|
|-
|17
|And one of the multitude answered and said, Master, I have brought unto thee my son, which hath a dumb spirit;
|But a man from the crowd ran forward and said, "Lord, I've brought you my son, who has a demon of dumbness."
|Even the KJV had some gender-neutral verbiage
|-
|18
|And wheresoever he taketh him, he teareth him: and he foameth, and gnasheth with his teeth, and pineth away: and I spake to thy disciples that they should cast him out; and they could not.
|"And wherever the demon takes him, he claws at himself, foams from the mouth, gnashes his teeth, and his body wastes away. I asked your disciples to exorcise him, but they couldn't."
|
|-
|19
|He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him unto me.
|Jesus responded, "You faithless generation, how long can I be with you? How long will I suffer your sinfulness? Bring your son to me."
|
|-
|20
|And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.
|They brought him. The demon, seeing Jesus, immediately threw the boy to the ground, where he flailed about, and foamed.
|
|-
|21
|And he asked his father, How long is it ago since this came unto him? And he said, Of a child.
|Jesus asked the father, "How long has this afflicted him?" "Since he was a child", the man replied.
|
|-
|22
|And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him: but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us.
|"Sometimes the demon throws him into the fire, other times into water in order to kill him. If it is true that you can do anything, please have compassion on us and help."
|
|-
|23
|Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
|Jesus replied, "If you can believe; anything is possible to the believer."
|
|-
|24
|And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
|The father cried out, tears filling his eyes, "I believe, Lord. Help my closed-mindedness."
|good use of "close-mindedness" here
|-
|25
|When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.
|When Jesus saw the crowd of people, he scolded the evil spirit, telling him, "You deaf and mute spirit, I order to you leave him alone, and to never bother him again".
|
|-
|26
|And the spirit cried, and rent him sore, and came out of him: and he was as one dead; insomuch that many said, He is dead.
|The spirit cried out and violently exited. The boy looked so much like he was dead, that bystanders declared, "He's dead!"
|
|-
|27
|But Jesus took him by the hand, and lifted him up; and he arose.
|But Jesus took his hand and pulled him up, and he stood up.
|
|-
|28
|And when he was come into the house, his disciples asked him privately, Why could not we cast him out?
|When Jesus went indoors, his disciples privately asked him, "Why couldn't we cast him out?"
|
|-
|29
|And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting.
|He told them, "That kind of spirit can only be driven out by prayer and fasting."
|
|-
|30
|And they departed thence, and passed through Galilee; and he would not that any man should know it.
|They moved on, passing through Galilee; Jesus kept a low profile.
|
|-
|31
|For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.
|He taught his disciples, saying, "The Son of man shall be betrayed to men who shall murder him, but afterward he shall rise on the third day.
|
|-
|32
|But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him.
|The disciples did not understand this, and were afraid to ask Jesus.
|
|-
|33
|And he came to Capernaum: and being in the house he asked them, What was it that ye disputed among yourselves by the way?
|They arrived to a home in Capernaum, where Jesus asked the disciples, "What were you arguing about on the road?
|
|-
|34
|But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
|But they were too ashamed to answer because they had been debating who was the greatest among them.
|
|-
|35
|And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, the same shall be last of all, and servant of all.
|Jesus sat down and summoned the Twelve, saying, "If anyone wants the highest rank, then he must first become the lowest of all, serving all."
|tricky, but very important quote
|-
|36
|And he took a child, and set him in the midst of them: and when he had taken him in his arms, he said unto them,
|Jesus then invited a child to join them, and after taking him in His arms, Jesus declared,
|the [[NAB]] calls the child an "it"; question: was this child Mark, and should Mark be referenced here?
|-
|37
|Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.
|Whoever welcomes such a child in my name, welcomes me; and whoever welcomes me, receives not me but He who sent me.
|don't emasculate reference to "he" in "He who sent me"; "receives not me" might be improvable
|-
|38
|And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
|John replied: "Master, we saw a man casting out demons in your Name, who was not one of our group. We told him to stop doing it, because he wasn't one of your disciples.
|Making 'disciples' clear.
|-
|39
|But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
|But Jesus replied: "Do not forbid him! You see, no man who has carried out a good work in my Name can easily turn round and attack me.
|Capitalising 'Name' when referring to Jesus; avoiding 'miracle', which now implies something surprising or unlikely.
|-
|40
|For he that is not against us is on our part.
|Because he who is not our enemy is our ally.
|
|-
|41
|For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
|Anyone who gives you a drink of water in my name, because you follow Christ, will not lose his reward in heaven.
|
|-
|42
|And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
|Anyone who corrupts or deceives a child who believes in me will wish he had had a millstone hung around his neck and had been cast into the sea.
|"offends" has been diluted over time to mean "hurt feelings"
|-
|43
|And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your hand corrupts you, cut if off. Entering eternal life maimed is better than descending to Hell with both hands intact, where the fire burns forever.
|
|-
|44
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|concept of "worm" is difficult, and often mistranslated. Appears to refer to a debased soul.
|-
|45
|And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your foot corrupts you, cut it off. It's better to limp into eternal life than walk steadily into Hell, into that unending fire.
|
|-
|46
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|47
|And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
|If your eye deceives you, remove it. Entering God's kingdom half-blinded is better than entering Hell's fires with sight intact.
|
|-
|48
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|49
|For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
|Everyone will be salted by fire, as every sacrifice will be salted with salt.
|
|-
|50
|Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another.
|Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how will you season the sacrifice? Have salt in yourselves, and have the divine tranquility of mind.
|After years, I still have trouble with verses 49-50. Updating peace to avoid erroneous pacificist connotations.
|}

==Chapter 10==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.
|And he left that place, and went to the coasts of Judea on the far side of the Jordan river, and the people came to Him again, and he taught them again.
|
|-
|2
|And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.
|The Pharisees came to him, and attempted to trick him by asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
|Translator JacobB uses "Pharisees;" see [[Talk:Gospel of Mark (Translated)#"Self-Proclaimed Elite"|this discussion]] regarding the use of "Pharisees."
|-
|3
|And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
|And He answered them, "What did Moses command you?"
|
|-
|4
|And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
|They said, "Moses begrudgingly permitted divorce."
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
|Jesus answered them, saying "He wrote you this law because men are not pure of heart.
|
|-
|6
|But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
|But from the beginning of time, God has made man, male and female.
|
|-
|7
|For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
|For this reason, men leave their parents and cling to a wife,
|
|-
|8
|And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
|and the two shall be one flesh, so that they are no longer two people, but one.
|
|-
|9
|What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
|What God has joined together, let no mean tear apart."
|
|-
|10
|And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
|In his house, later, his disciples the same question again.
|The Pharisees asked Jesus this question to trick him; His disciples asked him out of curiosity.
|-
|11
|And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
|He said to them, "Any man who divorces his wife and marries another has committed adultery.
|
|-
|12
|And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
|And if a woman divorces her husband, and marries another, she commits adultery."
|
|-
|13
|And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.
|Young children were brought to Jesus, that he might teach them. His disciples rebuked those who brought the children,
|
|-
|14
|But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
|but when Jesus saw what his disciples had done, was was very unhappy, and told them, "Do not forbid the children to come to me. Allow them there, for they are so like the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|15
|Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
|Truly I say to you, who ever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child does, he shall not enter into it."
|
|-
|16
|And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|Jesus took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|
|-
|17
|And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
|As he was leaving, a man came running up to him, and kneeled before him, asking, "Blessed master, what shall I do that I may have eternal life?"
|
|-
|18
|And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
|And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call me good? There is no one good but God the Father.
|
|-
|19
|Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
|You know the commandments, 'Do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your parents."
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
|The man answered Him, saying, "Master, I have kept all the commandments, since I was a child."
|
|-
|21
|Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
|Jesus loved him, so He said to him, "You lack one thing: go home, sell all your possessions, giving all you have to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow me."
|
|-
|22
|And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
|The man was sad to hear this, and grieved as he left, for he was very wealthy.
|
|-
|23
|And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
|Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How unlikely it is that those who worship riches will enter the kingdom of God!"
|
|-
|24
|And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
|The disciples were astonished to hear this. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is for those who trust in riches to enter the kingdom of God!
|
|-
|25
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God."
|Plousios (rich man) derived from ploutos (wealth), from which plutocrat is derived
|-
|26
|And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
|They were incredulous, saying to each other, "Who, then, can be saved?"
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
|Jesus looked at them and said, "With man, it is impossible to be saved, but not with God - with God, all things are possible."
|Anthropos refers to mankind in general
|-
|28
|Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
|Peter said to him, "We have left all we had, and followed you."
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
|Jesus answered, "Truly I tell you, every man who has left his house, or siblings, or parents, or family, or lands for my sake and the sake of the gospel
|
|-
|30
|But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
|shall in this life receive a hundred times as much persecution as he gave up in goods. But in the world to come, he shall receive eternal life.
|-
|31
|But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.
|Many who are exalted by man shall be humbled by God, and many who are humiliated by man shall be exalted by God."
|This needs work, advice? Alternative: translate first as "highest rank" or "highest place" or "idolized"
|-
|32
|And they were in the way going up to Jerusalem; and Jesus went before them: and they were amazed; and as they followed, they were afraid. And he took again the twelve, and began to tell them what things should happen unto him,
|Jesus walked ahead of the rest on their way to Jerusalem. His disciples were in amazement while other followers were fearful. Jesus pulled the twelve Apostles aside and began telling them what to expect next.
|
|-
|33
|Saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles:
|"Listen carefully: we will arrive in Jerusalem, where the Son of man shall be betrayed and handed over to the Elites, who shall condemn Him to death for execution by the Gentiles.
|
|-
|34
|And they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.
|They will mock Him, whip Him, spit on him, and murder Him; yet on the third day He shall rise to life again."
|
|-
|35
|And James and John, the sons of Zebedee, come unto him, saying, Master, we would that thou shouldest do for us whatsoever we shall desire.
|Then James and John, Zebedee's sons, approached Jesus to say, "Master, could we ask you for a favor?"
|
|-
|36
|And he said unto them, What would ye that I should do for you?
|Jesus replied, "What would you like?"
|
|-
|37
|They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
|They requested, "Give us the highest seats of honor in your glory, with one of us at your right hand and the other at your left!"
|
|-
|38
|But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
|But Jesus replied to the youngsters, "You do not understand these things. Can you drink the same cup as I, and accept the same baptism that I will endure?
|use "youngsters" to convey their youth?
|-
|39
|And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
|They replied, "Sure we can." Jesus then told them, "You will drink same cup as I, and be baptized as I will."
|seems a bit awkward, could be improved
|-
|40
|But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
|Alas, the seats on my left and right hands are not for me to distribute. They are destined for others, and will be given to them.
|
|-
|41
|And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
|The other ten disciples grew jealous of James and John when they heard this.
|
|-
|42
|But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
|Jesus gathered them together and said, "You know that those who rule over the Gentiles rule like lords over them, and those with great titles exercise authority over them."
|
|-
|43
|But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
|"It will be different for you. Anyone who is truly great among you will serve you."
|Differentiate the truly "great" followers with the so-called "great" of the Gentiles
|-
|44
|And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
|"Whoever has first rank will be the servant of all others."
|
|-
|45
|For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
|"Because even I, the Son of Man, did not come to be served, but to serve others, and give My life as payment for the souls of all."
|
|-
|46
|And they came to Jericho: and as he went out of Jericho with his disciples and a great number of people, blind Bartimaeus, the son of Timaeus, sat by the highway side begging.
|They reached Jericho. As Jesus and His disciples emerged from the city, followed by a large crowd of people, they saw a blind man named Bartimaeus son of Timaeus begging by the side of the road.
|Making clear to today's reader that Jericho was a city.
|-
|47
|And when he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to cry out, and say, Jesus, thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|When heard that Jesus of Nazareth was there, he began to show, "Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me."
|
|-
|48
|And many charged him that he should hold his peace: but he cried the more a great deal, Thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|Others told him to shut up, but he only shouted louder, "You, Son of David, have mercy on me!"
|
|-
|49
|And Jesus stood still, and commanded him to be called. And they call the blind man, saying unto him, Be of good comfort, rise; he calleth thee.
|Jesus stopped in His tracks, asking that he be called over. Followers then welcomed the blind man, telling him, "You've got it made: He's calling you."
|translation is verbose and colloquial; trimming welcome
|-
|50
|And he, casting away his garment, rose, and came to Jesus.
|Arising, the man threw off his coat and came to Jesus.
|
|-
|51
|And Jesus answered and said unto him, What wilt thou that I should do unto thee? The blind man said unto him, Lord, that I might receive my sight.
|Jesus said to the blind man: "What do you want Me to do for you?" The man replied: "My Lord, I want you to make me able to see."
|Is "My Lord" too much of a liberty? It emphasises the personal nature of each person's relationship with God.
|-
|52
|And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.
|Jesus said to him: "Go on your way; you have been healed because of your faith." The man immediately found that he could see, and started to follow Jesus' teachings.
|"in the way" is not immediately clear - presume it means he became a disciple.
|}

==Chapter 11==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when they came nigh to Jerusalem, unto Bethphage and Bethany, at the mount of Olives, he sendeth forth two of his disciples,
|They came to Bethphage and Bethany, near Jerusalem at the Mount of Olives. Jesus sent two of his disciples.
|
|-
|2
|And saith unto them, Go your way into the village over against you: and as soon as ye be entered into it, ye shall find a colt tied, whereon never man sat; loose him, and bring him.
|He told them, "go to the village in front of you. Just inside it, you'll find a tied up colt, which no man has ever sat upon. Untie him and bring him here."
|
|-
|3
|And if any man say unto you, Why do ye this? say ye that the Lord hath need of him; and straightway he will send him hither.
|"If anyone asks you why you're doing so, tell them that the Lord needs the colt, and he will send the colt along."
|
|-
|4
|And they went their way, and found the colt tied by the door without in a place where two ways met; and they loose him.
|They went to complete their task, finding the colt tied up at a street crossing and releasing him.
|
|-
|5
|And certain of them that stood there said unto them, What do ye, loosing the colt?
|Some people loitering there asked, "why are you releasing that colt?"
|
|-
|6
|And they said unto them even as Jesus had commanded: and they let them go.
|The disciples said what Jesus had told them to say, and the people let them pass.
|
|-
|7
|And they brought the colt to Jesus, and cast their garments on him; and he sat upon him.
|They returned to Jesus, put their garments on the colt, and Jesus sat on it.
|Is there a reason the KJV uses "him" referring to an animal?
|-
|8
|And many spread their garments in the way: and others cut down branches off the trees, and strawed them in the way.
|Lots of people put their clothes on Jesus' path, while others cut palm branches down and placed them on the path.
|
|-
|9
|And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
|And all the people along the route sang "Hosanna, he who comes in the name of the Lord is blessed!"
|
|-
|10
|Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest.
|"Blessed is the kingdom of David, our father, which comes in the name of the Lord, Hosanna in the highest."
|-
|11
|And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.
|Jesus entered Jerusalem and went into the temple, and when he had seen everything and it was evening, went to Bethany with the twelve apostles.
|
|-
|12
|And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
|Leaving Bethany the following day, he was hungry.
|
|-
|13
|And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
|He saw a fig tree in the distance, which had leafed, and went to see if there was fruit upon it. But there was nothing but leaves, for the fig season hadn't begun.
|
|-
|14
|And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.
|Jesus declared a parable in the hearing of his disciples, "no man will eat your fruit evermore."
|
|-
|15
|And they come to Jerusalem: and Jesus went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves;
|The entered Jerusalem and Jesus entered the temple. He threw out the vendors and toppled the moneychangers' tables and dove-sellers' seats.
|
|-
|16
|And would not suffer that any man should carry any vessel through the temple.
|He would not let any man their wares through the temple.
|
|-
|17
|And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves.
|He then taught the true doctrine: "Isn't it written that My house will be the house of prayer for all people? But you have turned it into a den of thieves."
|
|-
|18
|And the scribes and chief priests heard it, and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.
|The intellectuals and corrupt priests heard this and conspired to destroy him, fearing him and the people who were amazed by his teaching.
|
|-
|19
|And when even was come, he went out of the city.
|In the evening, Jesus left the city.
|
|-
|20
|And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
|In the morning, they passed a fig tree which had dried from the roots up.
|
|-
|21
|And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
|Peter remembered what Jesus had said, and declared, "Master, look! The fig tree you condemned has withered away!"
|
|-
|22
|And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
|Jesus then provided the answer, "have faith in God."
|
|-
|23
|For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
|"I tell you the truth. Anyone who says to a mountain, 'move out of my way and jump into the sea,' and has no doubts in his soul but believes it will come to pass, that man's words will become true."
|Awkward?
|-
|24
|Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
|"So I tell you, if you pray for whatever you desire, and believe that you'll receieve it, you will."
|
|-
|25
|And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
|"And when you're praying, forgive anyone who is against you, so that your father God in heaven will forgive you your sins as well."
|
|-
|26
|But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.
|"If you don't forgive, God your heavenly father will not forgive you."
|
|-
|27
|And they come again to Jerusalem: and as he was walking in the temple, there come to him the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders,
|When they returned to Jerusalem, the intellectuals (chief priests, scribes, and elders) came to him as He was walking in the temple.
|use intellectuals here? or incumbents, or elites?
|-
|28
|And say unto him, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority to do these things?
|"And they asked him 'Who gave you the authority to do these things?'"
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, I will also ask of you one question, and answer me, and I will tell you by what authority I do these things.
|"Jesus replied, 'If you will answer one question, I'll tell you by whose authority I do these things.'"
|
|-
|30
|The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men? answer me.
|"Tell me. Did John's baptism come from Heaven, or from men?"
|
|-
|31
|And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then did ye not believe him?
|They debated with each other, "If we say 'from heaven,' then He will reply, 'Then why didn't you believe him?'
|
|-
|32
|But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed.
|But if we say, 'of men,' the people will turn against us because they feel John was a prophet.'"
|how to translate "they feared the people"?
|-
|33
|And they answered and said unto Jesus, We cannot tell. And Jesus answering saith unto them, Neither do I tell you by what authority I do these things.
|So the intellectuals replied to Jesus, "We cannot answer." And Jesus responded, "Neither do I reveal to you my authority for my good deeds."
|"these things"? perhaps "good deeds".
|}

==Chapter 12==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he began to speak unto them by parables. A certain man planted a vineyard, and set an hedge about it, and digged a place for the winefat, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country.
|Jesus began to teach them parables. "A businessman planted a vineyard and placed a hedge around it. He dug a place for the juices, built a tower, rented it to workers, and traveled abroad.
|
|-
|2
|And at the season he sent to the husbandmen a servant, that he might receive from the husbandmen of the fruit of the vineyard.
|When the grape season arrived, he sent an employee to them, to return with the fruit of the vineyard.
|
|-
|3
|And they caught him, and beat him, and sent him away empty.
|But they caught him, beat him, and cast him off without the goods.
|
|-
|4
|And again he sent unto them another servant; and at him they cast stones, and wounded him in the head, and sent him away shamefully handled.
|So the owner sent another employee, but they threw stones at him, wounding him in the head. He too was rebuffed, badly treated.
|
|-
|5
|And again he sent another; and him they killed, and many others; beating some, and killing some.
|He sent a third, and they killed him, as well as many others. They beat some, killed some.
|
|-
|6
|Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
|He still had a son, whom he loved, and sent him to them last, thinking they would respect his son.
|
|-
|7
|But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
|But the workers plotted with each other: 'this is his heir. If we kill him, we can take the inheritance.'
|
|-
|8
|And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
|So they killed him and left his body outside the vineyard.
|
|-
|9
|What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others.
|So what should the vineyard owner do? He will return to annihilate the workers and give the vineyard to better workers.
|Clarification of "others"
|-
|10
|And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
|Have you not read in the scripture, 'The stone rejected by the builders becomes the cornerstone,
|
|-
|11
|This was the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
|This is the Lord's way, and it is wonderful to see'?"
|
|-
|12
|And they sought to lay hold on him, but feared the people: for they knew that he had spoken the parable against them: and they left him, and went their way.
|The furious intellectuals wanted to grab him them, but feared the public; they knew this parable was directed at them. They gave up for now and walked out.
|something stronger than "grab him" might work
|-
|13
|And they send unto him certain of the Pharisees and of the Herodians, to catch him in his words.
|
|
|-
|14
|And when they were come, they say unto him, Master, we know that thou art true, and carest for no man: for thou regardest not the person of men, but teachest the way of God in truth: Is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not?
|
|
|-
|15
|Shall we give, or shall we not give? But he, knowing their hypocrisy, said unto them, Why tempt ye me? bring me a penny, that I may see it.
|
|
|-
|16
|And they brought it. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? And they said unto him, Caesar's.
|
|
|-
|17
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him.
|
|
|-
|18
|Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,
|
|
|-
|19
|Master, Moses wrote unto us, If a man's brother die, and leave his wife behind him, and leave no children, that his brother should take his wife, and raise up seed unto his brother.
|
|
|-
|20
|Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed.
|
|
|-
|21
|And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise.
|
|
|-
|22
|And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also.
|
|
|-
|23
|In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
|
|
|-
|24
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
|
|
|-
|25
|For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
|
|
|-
|26
|And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
|
|
|-
|27
|He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
|
|
|-
|28
|And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
|
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
|
|
|-
|30
|And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
|
|
|-
|31
|And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
|
|
|-
|32
|And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
|
|
|-
|33
|And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
|
|
|-
|34
|And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
|
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the Son of David?
|
|
|-
|36
|For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
|
|
|-
|37
|David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
|
|
|-
|38
|And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,
|
|
|-
|39
|And the chief seats in the synagogues, and the uppermost rooms at feasts:
|
|
|-
|40
|Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.
|
|
|-
|41
|And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much.
|
|
|-
|42
|And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing.
|
|
|-
|43
|And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
|
|
|-
|44
|For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 13==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
|As they left the temple, one of Jesus' disciples said, "master, just look at the sort of stone and magnificient buildings are here!"
|
|-
|2
|And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
|Jesus responded, "See these grand buildings? Not one stone will remain atop another which will not be destroyed."
|
|-
|3
|And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
|As Jesus sat atop the Mount of Olives, looking at the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew quietly asked,
|
|-
|4
|Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
|"When will these events take place, and what will be the sign of their fulfillment?"
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:
|Jesus answered them, "Be on guard unless you be fooled by any man's deceit."
|
|-
|6
|For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
|"Many will come shouting my name and say "I am Christ!" Many will be fooled by their deceit."
|
|-
|7
|And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
|When you hear news of war and false rumor about them, don't worry, because they must occur but will not be the end.
|
|-
|8
|For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
|Nations will rise against nations, and nation-states against nation-states. Earthquakes will occur around the works. There will be famines and chaos. These are the beginnings of the sorrow.
|"Troubles" has lost its connotation. Replaced with new conservative term
|-
|9
|But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
|So take care of yourselves, as the masses will give you to the tribunals, you will be beaten in houses of worship, and be hauled before leaders and kings for my sake, to testify against them.
|
|-
|10
|And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
|The good news has to be published among all the nation-states first.
|
|-
|11
|But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
|"But when they drag you or betray you, do not plan what you will say. In that hour, you will speak words inspired by the Divine Guide.
|
|-
|12
|Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
|Brother will betray brother to his death, father to son, children will rebel against their parents, and shall be the death of them.
|
|-
|13
|And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
|And you will be hated by every man for my sake, but you will be saved if you endure to the end.
|
|-
|14
|But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
|
|
|-
|15
|And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
|
|
|-
|16
|And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
|
|
|-
|17
|But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
|
|
|-
|18
|And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
|
|
|-
|19
|For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
|
|
|-
|20
|And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
|
|
|-
|21
|And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
|
|
|-
|22
|For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
|
|
|-
|23
|But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
|
|
|-
|24
|But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
|
|
|-
|25
|And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
|
|
|-
|26
|And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
|
|
|-
|27
|And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
|
|
|-
|28
|Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
|
|
|-
|29
|So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
|
|
|-
|30
|Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
|
|
|-
|31
|Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
|
|
|-
|32
|But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
|
|
|-
|33
|Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
|
|
|-
|34
|For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
|
|
|-
|35
|Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
|
|
|-
|36
|Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
|
|
|-
|37
|And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 14==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After two days was the feast of the passover, and of unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to death.
|Two days later, it was time for the the passover holiday of unleavened bread, and the high priests and scribes were trying to figure out how to catch him by deceit and kill him.
|
|-
|2
|But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar of the people.
|But they said, "Not on the holiday; the mob will get upset."
|
|-
|3
|And being in Bethany in the house of Simon the leper, as he sat at meat, there came a woman having an alabaster box of ointment of spikenard very precious; and she brake the box, and poured it on his head.
|At that time, he was in Bethany at Simon the leper's house, having a meal. A woman came in with an expensive white crystal container of valerian oil, which she opened and poured over his head.
|
|-
|4
|And there were some that had indignation within themselves, and said, Why was this waste of the ointment made?
|Some of the onlookers were shocked, saying "Why did she waste that nice oil like that?
|
|-
|5
|For it might have been sold for more than three hundred pence, and have been given to the poor. And they murmured against her.
|We could have sold that for more than three dollars and charitably donated the money to the poor!" They kept whispering about what a bad thing she had done.
|
|-
|6
|And Jesus said, Let her alone; why trouble ye her? she hath wrought a good work on me.
|But Jesus said, "Leave her alone; why are you bothering her? She had done something good.
|
|-
|7
|For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.
|There will always be poor people around, and whenever you feel like helping them you can, but I am not going to be around forever.
|
|-
|8
|She hath done what she could: she is come aforehand to anoint my body to the burying.
|She did what she could: She came in advance to get my body ready for burial.
|
|-
|9
|Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached throughout the whole world, this also that she hath done shall be spoken of for a memorial of her.
|Truly I tell you: Anywhere in the world that people preach the good news about me, they are also going to remember what she did and talk about it."
|
|-
|10
|And Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve, went unto the chief priests, to betray him unto them.
|After that, Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve apostles, went to betray Jesus to the high priests,
|
|-
|11
|And when they heard it, they were glad, and promised to give him money. And he sought how he might conveniently betray him.
|who were happy to hear it and offered to pay him. So Judas thought about how it would be best to do the deed.
|
|-
|12
|And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?
|So on the first day of the Passover holiday, after they killed the lamb, the disciples of Jesus said to him, "Where do you want us to go and get this lamb ready for you to eat?"
|
|-
|13
|And he sendeth forth two of his disciples, and saith unto them, Go ye into the city, and there shall meet you a man bearing a pitcher of water: follow him.
|He answered by sending two of the disciples to go to town. "Go into the city, and you'll find a man carrying a pitcher of water. Follow him.
|
|-
|14
|And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
|When he goes into a house, tell the man in charge, 'Our master wants to know where the guestroom is, so we can eat our lamb.'
|
|-
|15
|And he will shew you a large upper room furnished and prepared: there make ready for us.
|He will show you a large, furnished room on the second floor: Prepare for us there."
|
|-
|16
|And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
|So the disciples went into town, and it happened exactly like he had told them, so they got the lamb ready to eat.
|
|-
|17
|And in the evening he cometh with the twelve.
|That evening, Jesus and the twelve arrived.
|
|-
|18
|And as they sat and did eat, Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, One of you which eateth with me shall betray me.
|While they were sitting and eating, Jesus said, "Truly I tell you, one of you will who eats here will betray me."
|
|-
|19
|And they began to be sorrowful, and to say unto him one by one, Is it I? and another said, Is it I?
|They became very upset, and one after another said, "Are you talking to me?" "Is it me?"
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto them, It is one of the twelve, that dippeth with me in the dish.
|Jesus told them, "It is one of you - the one who dips his bread in the bowl with me.
|
|-
|21
|The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born.
|The Son of man really walks the earth, as the scriptures said, but as for the man who betrays the Son of man, he would have been better off if he had never been born."
|
|-
|22
|And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.
|And while they were eating, Jesus took the bread, blessed it, broke it, and distributed it, saying "Take this and eat it. This is my body."
|
|-
|23
|And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
|And he took the cup, said a prayer, and passed it around, and everybody drank some.
|
|-
|24
|And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
|Then he said to them, "This is my blood of the new testament, which I bled for the sake of many people.
|
|-
|25
|Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.
|Truly I say to you, I shall not drink wine again until the day I drink it anew in the kingdom of God."
|
|-
|26
|And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.
|Then, after they had sung a hymn, they went out into the Mount of Olives,
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.
|where Jesus told them, "All of you are going to have trouble tonight because of me. It is prophesied, "I will kill the shepherd, and then the sheep will be scattered."
|
|-
|28
|But after that I am risen, I will go before you into Galilee.
|But I shall rise and I shall go into Galilee before you."
|
|-
|29
|But Peter said unto him, Although all shall be offended, yet will not I.
|But Peter said, "Though all shall have trouble, I shall take it."
|
|-
|30
|And Jesus saith unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this day, even in this night, before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice.
|And Jesus said to him, "Hear me when I say that tonight, before the rooster crows twice, you are going to disavow me three times."
|
|-
|31
|But he spake the more vehemently, If I should die with thee, I will not deny thee in any wise. Likewise also said they all.
|But Peter protested, with agitation, "Even if I end up having to die with you, I'll never disavow you." Everyone chimed in to say the same.
|
|-
|32
|And they came to a place which was named Gethsemane: and he saith to his disciples, Sit ye here, while I shall pray.
|By now, they were at a place called Gethsemane. Jesus told his disciples, "Take a seat here, everyone. I want to pray."
|
|-
|33
|And he taketh with him Peter and James and John, and began to be sore amazed, and to be very heavy;
|Then he went away from them, taking Peter, James, and John, and he became very upset and distressed.
|
|-
|34
|And saith unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful unto death: tarry ye here, and watch.
|He said to them, "My soul is dying of sadness. Stay here and keep your eyes open."
|
|-
|35
|And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him.
|He wandered away a little, and fell to the ground. He prayed that if there were any possible way he wouldn't have to go through this tribulation.
|
|-
|36
|And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.
|He said, "Oh Father, anything is possible for you. I don't want this fate. Take it away. But let it be what you want, not what I want."
|
|-
|37
|And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping, and saith unto Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? couldest not thou watch one hour?
|When he came back and found his disciples sleeping, he said to Peter, "Simon are you sleeping? Couldn't you keep your eyes open for an hour?
|
|-
|38
|Watch ye and pray, lest ye enter into temptation. The spirit truly is ready, but the flesh is weak.
|Keep them open and pray, or else you might fall for temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
|
|-
|39
|And again he went away, and prayed, and spake the same words.
|Again, he went away and prayed, and he said the same thing again.
|
|-
|40
|And when he returned, he found them asleep again, (for their eyes were heavy,) neither wist they what to answer him.
|When he got back, he found them asleep again (they were really tired), and they had no idea how to answer him.
|
|-
|41
|And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: it is enough, the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|The third time he came back, he told them, "Just sleep now. I have prayed enough, and the time has come for the Son of man to be betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|
|-
|42
|Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.
|Get up, we must go. Look, the betrayer is here."
|
|-
|43
|And immediately, while he yet spake, cometh Judas, one of the twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and staves, from the chief priests and the scribes and the elders.
|And just as he was saying that, Judas came in, along with a lot of armed people, from the chief priests, scribes, and elders.
|
|-
|44
|And he that betrayed him had given them a token, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he; take him, and lead him away safely.
|The betrayer had made an arrangement with them: "The man I kiss is the man you want. Take him and keep him safe."
|
|-
|45
|And as soon as he was come, he goeth straightway to him, and saith, Master, master; and kissed him.
|And as soon as he was there, he went directly to Jesus, saying "Master, Master!" and kissed him.
|
|-
|46
|And they laid their hands on him, and took him.
|And the armed people grabbed Jesus and took him away.
|
|-
|47
|And one of them that stood by drew a sword, and smote a servant of the high priest, and cut off his ear.
|But Peter, who was standing by, pulled his sword out and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his ear.
|
|-
|48
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, Are ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and with staves to take me?
|Jesus said, "Are you coming to get me with your swords and sticks as you would a thief?
|
|-
|49
|I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.
|I was right there with you, teaching in the temple every single day, and you never came for me then. But the scriptures will have to be fulfilled."
|
|-
|50
|And they all forsook him, and fled.
|Then they all abandoned him and fled.
|
|-
|51
|And there followed him a certain young man, having a linen cloth cast about his naked body; and the young men laid hold on him:
|A young man there following him, with a linen sheet wrapped around his naked body, when he was grabbed by the men.
|While it is likely this boy was Mark, the author, the original text uses the third person.
|-
|52
|And he left the linen cloth, and fled from them naked.
|He ran away naked, leaving the sheet with them.
|
|-
|53
|And they led Jesus away to the high priest: and with him were assembled all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes.
|Then the armed men took Jesus to the high priest, and all the chief priests, elders, and scribes were assembled there.
|
|-
|54
|And Peter followed him afar off, even into the palace of the high priest: and he sat with the servants, and warmed himself at the fire.
|Peter followed from a distance, all the way into the high priest's palace, and he sat down at the fire with the servants and made himself comfortable.
|
|-
|55
|And the chief priests and all the council sought for witness against Jesus to put him to death; and found none.
|The chief priests and the rest of the council asked for truthful testimony against Jesus so they could put him to death, but found none.
|
|-
|56
|For many bare false witness against him, but their witness agreed not together.
|For there was much false testimony, and the witnesses contradicted each other.
|
|-
|57
|And there arose certain, and bare false witness against him, saying,
|The deceitful witnesses said,
|
|-
|58
|We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.
|"We heard him say, 'I will destroy this handmade temple, and within three days I will build another without using my hands."
|
|-
|59
|But neither so did their witness agree together.
|But these witnesses also contradicted each other.
|
|-
|60
|And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
|The high priest stood up and asked Jesus, "Do you have nothing to say? Just what are they saying about you?"
|
|-
|61
|But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
|Jesus kept silent. The high priest started interrogating him again: "Are you the Christ, the son of the blessed?"
|
|-
|62
|And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
|Jesus answered, saying "I am, and you all are going to see the son of man sitting at the right hand side of power and coming in the clouds of heaven."
|
|-
|63
|Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
|The high priest ripped his shirt off, saying "We don't need any more witnesses!
|
|-
|64
|Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
|You all heard the blasphemy, now what do you think about that?" And they all condemned him to death.
|
|-
|65
|And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.
|Some of them spat on him. They put a bag over his head and punched him. They taunted him, "Tell us the future, prophet!", and the servants slapped him.
|
|-
|66
|And as Peter was beneath in the palace, there cometh one of the maids of the high priest:
|Meanwhile, Peter was down in the palace, when one of the high priest's maids came by.
|
|-
|67
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked upon him, and said, And thou also wast with Jesus of Nazareth.
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, "You were with Jesus of Nazareth."
|
|-
|68
|But he denied, saying, I know not, neither understand I what thou sayest. And he went out into the porch; and the cock crew.
|He denied it, saying, "I do not know what you are talking about." And as he went out to the porch, the rooster crowed.
|
|-
|69
|And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them.
|And another maid saw him, and said to the bystanders, "This is one of them."
|
|-
|70
|And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto.
|But he denied it again. And again the bystanders said to Peter, "Surely, you are one of them, for your accent is Galilean."
|
|-
|71
|But he began to curse and to swear, saying, I know not this man of whom ye speak.
|But he began to swear, saying, "I do not know the man you speak of."
|
|-
|72
|And the second time the cock crew. And Peter called to mind the word that Jesus said unto him, Before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice. And when he thought thereon, he wept.
|And again the cock crowed. Peter recalled what Jesus had told him, "Before the cock crows twice, you will deny me three times." And he wept at the thought.
|
|}

==Chapter 15==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And straightway in the morning the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council, and bound Jesus, and carried him away, and delivered him to Pilate.
|In the morning the high priests held an urgent consultations with the elders and scribes, and the council, and decided to take Jesus to Pilate.
|
|-
|2
|And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto him, Thou sayest it.
|Pilate asked him, "Are you the King of the Jews?" And he answered them, saying, "You say that I am."
|
|-
|3
|And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.
|And the high priests accused him of many things, but he did not answer.
|
|-
|4
|And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.
|Pilate asked him again, "Have you nothing to say? Look, how many testify against you."
|
|-
|5
|But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.
|But Jesus said nothing, and Pilate was amazed.
|
|-
|6
|Now at that feast he released unto them one prisoner, whomsoever they desired.
|Now at Passover, Pilate released one prisoner, chosen by the people.
|
|-
|7
|And there was one named Barabbas, which lay bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.
|There was one named Barabbas, who was imprisoned because he had rebelled and committed murder in the rebellion.
|
|-
|8
|And the multitude crying aloud began to desire him to do as he had ever done unto them.
|And the crowds cried aloud, begging Pilate to release a prisoner as he always had.
|
|-
|9
|But Pilate answered them, saying, Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate answered them, saying "Do you wish me to release the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|10
|For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.
|Since he knew the high priests had brought Jesus to him out of envy of His popularity.
|
|-
|11
|But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.
|But the high priests influenced the people to request the release of Barabbas.
|
|-
|12
|And Pilate answered and said again unto them, What will ye then that I shall do unto him whom ye call the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate said to the crowds, "What, then, do you wish me to do to the mean you call the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|13
|And they cried out again, Crucify him.
|And the crowds cried out, "Crucify him."
|
|-
|14
|Then Pilate said unto them, Why, what evil hath he done? And they cried out the more exceedingly, Crucify him.
|So Pilate said to them, "Why? What has he done wrong?" And they cried out louder, "Crucify him!"
|
|-
|15
|And so Pilate, willing to content the people, released Barabbas unto them, and delivered Jesus, when he had scourged him, to be crucified.
|So Pilate, to keep the people content, released Barabbas to them, and had Jesus scourged and sent to be crucified.
|
|-
|16
|And the soldiers led him away into the hall, called Praetorium; and they call together the whole band.
|
|
|-
|17
|And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,
|
|
|-
|18
|And began to salute him, Hail, King of the Jews!
|
|
|-
|19
|And they smote him on the head with a reed, and did spit upon him, and bowing their knees worshipped him.
|
|
|-
|20
|And when they had mocked him, they took off the purple from him, and put his own clothes on him, and led him out to crucify him.
|
|
|-
|21
|And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross.
|
|
|-
|22
|And they bring him unto the place Golgotha, which is, being interpreted, The place of a skull.
|
|
|-
|23
|And they gave him to drink wine mingled with myrrh: but he received it not.
|
|
|-
|24
|And when they had crucified him, they parted his garments, casting lots upon them, what every man should take.
|
|
|-
|25
|And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
|
|
|-
|26
|And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS.
|
|
|-
|27
|And with him they crucify two thieves; the one on his right hand, and the other on his left.
|
|
|-
|28
|And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors.
|
|
|-
|29
|And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days,
|
|
|-
|30
|Save thyself, and come down from the cross.
|
|
|-
|31
|Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.
|
|
|-
|32
|Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.
|
|
|-
|33
|And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
|
|
|-
|34
|And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
|
|
|-
|35
|And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
|
|
|-
|36
|And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
|
|
|-
|37
|And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
|
|
|-
|38
|And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.
|
|
|-
|39
|And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
|
|
|-
|40
|There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;
|
|
|-
|41
|(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
|
|
|-
|42
|And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,
|
|
|-
|43
|Joseph of Arimathaea, and honourable counseller, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
|
|
|-
|44
|And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
|
|
|-
|45
|And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
|
|
|-
|46
|And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
|
|
|-
|47
|And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 16==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
|After the sabbath, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Salome, brought sweet spices to Jesus' body to anoint Him.
|
|-
|2
|And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
|Very early in the morning on the day after the sabbath, as the sun rose, they came to the tomb of Jesus.
|
|-
|3
|And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre?
|And the women said to each other, "Who will roll away the stone blocking the tomb door?"
|
|-
|4
|And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.
|But when the women looked, they saw that the massive stone had been rolled to the side.
|why not use the pronoun "women" here?
|-
|5
|And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
|And as they entered into the tomb, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, wearing a long white garment, and they were afraid.
|
|-
|6
|And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.
|The man said to them, "Do not fear: You seek Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He is risen, he is not here - look at the plase where they laid him.
|
|-
|7
|But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.
|Leave now, and tell Peter and the disciples of Jesus that He has gone ahead of you into Galilee: you will see him there, as he told you."
|
|-
|8
|And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
|
|
|-
|9
|Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
|
|The verses from here on are not in the oldest manuscripts, and are not likely to be authentic.<ref>http://www.bible-researcher.com/endmark.html</ref>
|-
|10
|And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.
|
|
|-
|11
|And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
|
|
|-
|12
|After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
|
|
|-
|13
|And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
|
|
|-
|15
|And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
|
|
|-
|16
|He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
|
|
|-
|17
|And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
|
|
|-
|18
|They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
|
|
|-
|19
|So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
|
|
|-
|20
|And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
|
|
|}

== References ==

<references/>

Mark 9-16 (Translated)

2009-10-15T13:31:23Z

Danielitld:

==Chapter 9==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
|Jesus said the them, "Truly I tell you, there are some of you who stand here will live to see the kingdom of God come with power."
|Jesus refers here to the founding of the Church, which truly begins with the events of Acts 2:1-4.
|-
|2
|And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
|After six days Jesus took Peter, James, and John, and led them up into a high mountain, and was transfigured before them.
|
|-
|3
|And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
|His clothing was shining, whiter than snow, or anything else on Earth.
|
|-
|4
|And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
|And they saw Elijah and Moses, and they spoke with Jesus.
|
|-
|5
|And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
|Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good for us to be here. Let us make three tents for the blessed, one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah."
|
|-
|6
|For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
|For he was did not know what to say, they were so nervous.
|Perhaps they were afraid, yes, but not as one is afraid of a fire or an animal, but afraid of disrespecting the divine - thoughts on this?
|-
|7
|And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.
|Now a cloud came and cast a shadow all around, and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is my beloved Son: hear His words."
|
|-
|8
|And suddenly, when they had looked round about, they saw no man any more, save Jesus only with themselves.
|When they looked around them, they could not see a single person, except Jesus and themselves.
|
|-
|9
|And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
|As they came down the mountain, he asked them not to tell anyone what they had seen until he, the Son of Man, had risen from the grave.
|
|-
|10
|And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.
|Indeed, they kept his secret, but asked each other what such a resurrection would entail.
|
|-
|11
|And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elias must first come?
|Then they asked Jesus, "Why do the writers say that Elijah will come first?"
|
|-
|12
|And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.
|He responded, "It is true that Elijah must come first to restore everything. Likewise, it is written that the Son of Man must suffer a great deal and be despised."
|
|-
|13
|But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.
|"But Elijah has already come, and the elite did to him whatever they wanted, as was prophesied."
|Clarifying "they" (Herod et. al)
|-
|14
|And when he came to his disciples, he saw a great multitude about them, and the scribes questioning with them.
|Returning to his disciples, he found an enormous crowd had gathered around them, with the intellectuals interrogating them.
|
|-
|15
|And straightway all the people, when they beheld him, were greatly amazed, and running to him saluted him.
|Immediately the whole crowd, seeing Jesus, ran to salute him, amazed by his presence.
|
|-
|16
|And he asked the scribes, What question ye with them?
|Jesus demanded of the intellectuals, "What are you asking the people about?"
|
|-
|17
|And one of the multitude answered and said, Master, I have brought unto thee my son, which hath a dumb spirit;
|But a man from the crowd ran forward and said, "Lord, I've brought you my son, who has a demon of dumbness."
|Even the KJV had some gender-neutral verbiage
|-
|18
|And wheresoever he taketh him, he teareth him: and he foameth, and gnasheth with his teeth, and pineth away: and I spake to thy disciples that they should cast him out; and they could not.
|"And wherever the demon takes him, he claws at himself, foams from the mouth, gnashes his teeth, and his body wastes away. I asked your disciples to exorcise him, but they couldn't."
|
|-
|19
|He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him unto me.
|Jesus responded, "You faithless generation, how long can I be with you? How long will I suffer your sinfulness? Bring your son to me."
|
|-
|20
|And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.
|They brought him. The demon, seeing Jesus, immediately threw the boy to the ground, where he flailed about, and foamed.
|
|-
|21
|And he asked his father, How long is it ago since this came unto him? And he said, Of a child.
|Jesus asked the father, "How long has this afflicted him?" "Since he was a child", the man replied.
|
|-
|22
|And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him: but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us.
|"Sometimes the demon throws him into the fire, other times into water in order to kill him. If it is true that you can do anything, please have compassion on us and help."
|
|-
|23
|Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
|Jesus replied, "If you can believe; anything is possible to the believer."
|
|-
|24
|And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
|The father cried out, tears filling his eyes, "I believe, Lord. Help my closed-mindedness."
|good use of "close-mindedness" here
|-
|25
|When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.
|When Jesus saw the crowd of people, he scolded the evil spirit, telling him, "You deaf and mute spirit, I order to you leave him alone, and to never bother him again".
|
|-
|26
|And the spirit cried, and rent him sore, and came out of him: and he was as one dead; insomuch that many said, He is dead.
|The spirit cried out and violently exited. The boy looked so much like he was dead, that bystanders declared, "He's dead!"
|
|-
|27
|But Jesus took him by the hand, and lifted him up; and he arose.
|But Jesus took his hand and pulled him up, and he stood up.
|
|-
|28
|And when he was come into the house, his disciples asked him privately, Why could not we cast him out?
|When Jesus went indoors, his disciples privately asked him, "Why couldn't we cast him out?"
|
|-
|29
|And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting.
|He told them, "That kind of spirit can only be driven out by prayer and fasting."
|
|-
|30
|And they departed thence, and passed through Galilee; and he would not that any man should know it.
|They moved on, passing through Galilee; Jesus kept a low profile.
|
|-
|31
|For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.
|He taught his disciples, saying, "The Son of man shall be betrayed to men who shall murder him, but afterward he shall rise on the third day.
|
|-
|32
|But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him.
|The disciples did not understand this, and were afraid to ask Jesus.
|
|-
|33
|And he came to Capernaum: and being in the house he asked them, What was it that ye disputed among yourselves by the way?
|They arrived to a home in Capernaum, where Jesus asked the disciples, "What were you arguing about on the road?
|
|-
|34
|But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
|But they were too ashamed to answer because they had been debating who was the greatest among them.
|
|-
|35
|And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, the same shall be last of all, and servant of all.
|Jesus sat down and summoned the Twelve, saying, "If anyone wants the highest rank, then he must first become the lowest of all, serving all."
|tricky, but very important quote
|-
|36
|And he took a child, and set him in the midst of them: and when he had taken him in his arms, he said unto them,
|Jesus then invited a child to join them, and after taking him in His arms, Jesus declared,
|the [[NAB]] calls the child an "it"; question: was this child Mark, and should Mark be referenced here?
|-
|37
|Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.
|Whoever welcomes such a child in my name, welcomes me; and whoever welcomes me, receives not me but He who sent me.
|don't emasculate reference to "he" in "He who sent me"; "receives not me" might be improvable
|-
|38
|And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
|John replied: "Master, we saw a man casting out demons in your Name, who was not one of our group. We told him to stop doing it, because he wasn't one of your disciples.
|Making 'disciples' clear.
|-
|39
|But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
|But Jesus replied: "Do not forbid him! You see, no man who has carried out a good work in my Name can easily turn round and attack me.
|Capitalising 'Name' when referring to Jesus; avoiding 'miracle', which now implies something surprising or unlikely.
|-
|40
|For he that is not against us is on our part.
|Because he who is not our enemy is our ally.
|
|-
|41
|For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
|Anyone who gives you a drink of water in my name, because you follow Christ, will not lose his reward in heaven.
|
|-
|42
|And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
|Anyone who corrupts or deceives a child who believes in me will wish he had had a millstone hung around his neck and had been cast into the sea.
|"offends" has been diluted over time to mean "hurt feelings"
|-
|43
|And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your hand corrupts you, cut if off. Entering eternal life maimed is better than descending to Hell with both hands intact, where the fire burns forever.
|
|-
|44
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|concept of "worm" is difficult, and often mistranslated. Appears to refer to a debased soul.
|-
|45
|And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your foot corrupts you, cut it off. It's better to limp into eternal life than walk steadily into Hell, into that unending fire.
|
|-
|46
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|47
|And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
|If your eye deceives you, remove it. Entering God's kingdom half-blinded is better than entering Hell's fires with sight intact.
|
|-
|48
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|49
|For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
|Everyone will be salted by fire, as every sacrifice will be salted with salt.
|
|-
|50
|Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another.
|Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how will you season the sacrifice? Have salt in yourselves, and have the divine tranquility of mind.
|After years, I still have trouble with verses 49-50. Updating peace to avoid erroneous pacificist connotations.
|}

==Chapter 10==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.
|And he left that place, and went to the coasts of Judea on the far side of the Jordan river, and the people came to Him again, and he taught them again.
|
|-
|2
|And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.
|The Pharisees came to him, and attempted to trick him by asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
|Translator JacobB uses "Pharisees;" see [[Talk:Gospel of Mark (Translated)#"Self-Proclaimed Elite"|this discussion]] regarding the use of "Pharisees."
|-
|3
|And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
|And He answered them, "What did Moses command you?"
|
|-
|4
|And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
|They said, "Moses begrudgingly permitted divorce."
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
|Jesus answered them, saying "He wrote you this law because men are not pure of heart.
|
|-
|6
|But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
|But from the beginning of time, God has made man, male and female.
|
|-
|7
|For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
|For this reason, men leave their parents and cling to a wife,
|
|-
|8
|And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
|and the two shall be one flesh, so that they are no longer two people, but one.
|
|-
|9
|What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
|What God has joined together, let no mean tear apart."
|
|-
|10
|And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
|In his house, later, his disciples the same question again.
|The Pharisees asked Jesus this question to trick him; His disciples asked him out of curiosity.
|-
|11
|And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
|He said to them, "Any man who divorces his wife and marries another has committed adultery.
|
|-
|12
|And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
|And if a woman divorces her husband, and marries another, she commits adultery."
|
|-
|13
|And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.
|Young children were brought to Jesus, that he might teach them. His disciples rebuked those who brought the children,
|
|-
|14
|But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
|but when Jesus saw what his disciples had done, was was very unhappy, and told them, "Do not forbid the children to come to me. Allow them there, for they are so like the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|15
|Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
|Truly I say to you, who ever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child does, he shall not enter into it."
|
|-
|16
|And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|Jesus took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|
|-
|17
|And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
|As he was leaving, a man came running up to him, and kneeled before him, asking, "Blessed master, what shall I do that I may have eternal life?"
|
|-
|18
|And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
|And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call me good? There is no one good but God the Father.
|
|-
|19
|Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
|You know the commandments, 'Do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your parents."
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
|The man answered Him, saying, "Master, I have kept all the commandments, since I was a child."
|
|-
|21
|Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
|Jesus loved him, so He said to him, "You lack one thing: go home, sell all your possessions, giving all you have to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow me."
|
|-
|22
|And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
|The man was sad to hear this, and grieved as he left, for he was very wealthy.
|
|-
|23
|And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
|Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How unlikely it is that those who worship riches will enter the kingdom of God!"
|
|-
|24
|And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
|The disciples were astonished to hear this. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is for those who trust in riches to enter the kingdom of God!
|
|-
|25
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God."
|Plousios (rich man) derived from ploutos (wealth), from which plutocrat is derived
|-
|26
|And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
|They were incredulous, saying to each other, "Who, then, can be saved?"
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
|Jesus looked at them and said, "With men, it is impossible to be saved, but not with God - with God, all things are possible."
|reject the emasculation of the reference to "men" found in modern translations, such as by [[TNIV]] translators who plan to replace [[NIV]]
|-
|28
|Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
|Peter said to him, "We have left all we had, and followed you."
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
|Jesus answered, "Truly I tell you, every man who has left his house, or siblings, or parents, or family, or lands for my sake and the sake of the gospel
|
|-
|30
|But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
|shall in this life receive a hundred times as much persecution as he gave up in goods. But in the world to come, he shall receive eternal life.
|-
|31
|But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.
|Many who are exalted by man shall be humbled by God, and many who are humiliated by man shall be exalted by God."
|This needs work, advice? Alternative: translate first as "highest rank" or "highest place" or "idolized"
|-
|32
|And they were in the way going up to Jerusalem; and Jesus went before them: and they were amazed; and as they followed, they were afraid. And he took again the twelve, and began to tell them what things should happen unto him,
|Jesus walked ahead of the rest on their way to Jerusalem. His disciples were in amazement while other followers were fearful. Jesus pulled the twelve Apostles aside and began telling them what to expect next.
|
|-
|33
|Saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles:
|"Listen carefully: we will arrive in Jerusalem, where the Son of man shall be betrayed and handed over to the Elites, who shall condemn Him to death for execution by the Gentiles.
|
|-
|34
|And they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.
|They will mock Him, whip Him, spit on him, and murder Him; yet on the third day He shall rise to life again."
|
|-
|35
|And James and John, the sons of Zebedee, come unto him, saying, Master, we would that thou shouldest do for us whatsoever we shall desire.
|Then James and John, Zebedee's sons, approached Jesus to say, "Master, could we ask you for a favor?"
|
|-
|36
|And he said unto them, What would ye that I should do for you?
|Jesus replied, "What would you like?"
|
|-
|37
|They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
|They requested, "Give us the highest seats of honor in your glory, with one of us at your right hand and the other at your left!"
|
|-
|38
|But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
|But Jesus replied to the youngsters, "You do not understand these things. Can you drink the same cup as I, and accept the same baptism that I will endure?
|use "youngsters" to convey their youth?
|-
|39
|And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
|They replied, "Sure we can." Jesus then told them, "You will drink same cup as I, and be baptized as I will."
|seems a bit awkward, could be improved
|-
|40
|But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
|Alas, the seats on my left and right hands are not for me to distribute. They are destined for others, and will be given to them.
|
|-
|41
|And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
|The other ten disciples grew jealous of James and John when they heard this.
|
|-
|42
|But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
|Jesus gathered them together and said, "You know that those who rule over the Gentiles rule like lords over them, and those with great titles exercise authority over them."
|
|-
|43
|But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
|"It will be different for you. Anyone who is truly great among you will serve you."
|Differentiate the truly "great" followers with the so-called "great" of the Gentiles
|-
|44
|And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
|"Whoever has first rank will be the servant of all others."
|
|-
|45
|For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
|"Because even I, the Son of Man, did not come to be served, but to serve others, and give My life as payment for the souls of all."
|
|-
|46
|And they came to Jericho: and as he went out of Jericho with his disciples and a great number of people, blind Bartimaeus, the son of Timaeus, sat by the highway side begging.
|They reached Jericho. As Jesus and His disciples emerged from the city, followed by a large crowd of people, they saw a blind man named Bartimaeus son of Timaeus begging by the side of the road.
|Making clear to today's reader that Jericho was a city.
|-
|47
|And when he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to cry out, and say, Jesus, thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|When heard that Jesus of Nazareth was there, he began to show, "Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me."
|
|-
|48
|And many charged him that he should hold his peace: but he cried the more a great deal, Thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|Others told him to shut up, but he only shouted louder, "You, Son of David, have mercy on me!"
|
|-
|49
|And Jesus stood still, and commanded him to be called. And they call the blind man, saying unto him, Be of good comfort, rise; he calleth thee.
|Jesus stopped in His tracks, asking that he be called over. Followers then welcomed the blind man, telling him, "You've got it made: He's calling you."
|translation is verbose and colloquial; trimming welcome
|-
|50
|And he, casting away his garment, rose, and came to Jesus.
|Arising, the man threw off his coat and came to Jesus.
|
|-
|51
|And Jesus answered and said unto him, What wilt thou that I should do unto thee? The blind man said unto him, Lord, that I might receive my sight.
|Jesus said to the blind man: "What do you want Me to do for you?" The man replied: "My Lord, I want you to make me able to see."
|Is "My Lord" too much of a liberty? It emphasises the personal nature of each person's relationship with God.
|-
|52
|And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.
|Jesus said to him: "Go on your way; you have been healed because of your faith." The man immediately found that he could see, and started to follow Jesus' teachings.
|"in the way" is not immediately clear - presume it means he became a disciple.
|}

==Chapter 11==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when they came nigh to Jerusalem, unto Bethphage and Bethany, at the mount of Olives, he sendeth forth two of his disciples,
|They came to Bethphage and Bethany, near Jerusalem at the Mount of Olives. Jesus sent two of his disciples.
|
|-
|2
|And saith unto them, Go your way into the village over against you: and as soon as ye be entered into it, ye shall find a colt tied, whereon never man sat; loose him, and bring him.
|He told them, "go to the village in front of you. Just inside it, you'll find a tied up colt, which no man has ever sat upon. Untie him and bring him here."
|
|-
|3
|And if any man say unto you, Why do ye this? say ye that the Lord hath need of him; and straightway he will send him hither.
|"If anyone asks you why you're doing so, tell them that the Lord needs the colt, and he will send the colt along."
|
|-
|4
|And they went their way, and found the colt tied by the door without in a place where two ways met; and they loose him.
|They went to complete their task, finding the colt tied up at a street crossing and releasing him.
|
|-
|5
|And certain of them that stood there said unto them, What do ye, loosing the colt?
|Some people loitering there asked, "why are you releasing that colt?"
|
|-
|6
|And they said unto them even as Jesus had commanded: and they let them go.
|The disciples said what Jesus had told them to say, and the people let them pass.
|
|-
|7
|And they brought the colt to Jesus, and cast their garments on him; and he sat upon him.
|They returned to Jesus, put their garments on the colt, and Jesus sat on it.
|Is there a reason the KJV uses "him" referring to an animal?
|-
|8
|And many spread their garments in the way: and others cut down branches off the trees, and strawed them in the way.
|Lots of people put their clothes on Jesus' path, while others cut palm branches down and placed them on the path.
|
|-
|9
|And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
|And all the people along the route sang "Hosanna, he who comes in the name of the Lord is blessed!"
|
|-
|10
|Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest.
|"Blessed is the kingdom of David, our father, which comes in the name of the Lord, Hosanna in the highest."
|-
|11
|And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.
|Jesus entered Jerusalem and went into the temple, and when he had seen everything and it was evening, went to Bethany with the twelve apostles.
|
|-
|12
|And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
|Leaving Bethany the following day, he was hungry.
|
|-
|13
|And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
|He saw a fig tree in the distance, which had leafed, and went to see if there was fruit upon it. But there was nothing but leaves, for the fig season hadn't begun.
|
|-
|14
|And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.
|Jesus declared a parable in the hearing of his disciples, "no man will eat your fruit evermore."
|
|-
|15
|And they come to Jerusalem: and Jesus went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves;
|The entered Jerusalem and Jesus entered the temple. He threw out the vendors and toppled the moneychangers' tables and dove-sellers' seats.
|
|-
|16
|And would not suffer that any man should carry any vessel through the temple.
|He would not let any man their wares through the temple.
|
|-
|17
|And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves.
|He then taught the true doctrine: "Isn't it written that My house will be the house of prayer for all people? But you have turned it into a den of thieves."
|
|-
|18
|And the scribes and chief priests heard it, and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.
|The intellectuals and corrupt priests heard this and conspired to destroy him, fearing him and the people who were amazed by his teaching.
|
|-
|19
|And when even was come, he went out of the city.
|In the evening, Jesus left the city.
|
|-
|20
|And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
|In the morning, they passed a fig tree which had dried from the roots up.
|
|-
|21
|And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
|Peter remembered what Jesus had said, and declared, "Master, look! The fig tree you condemned has withered away!"
|
|-
|22
|And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
|Jesus then provided the answer, "have faith in God."
|
|-
|23
|For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
|"I tell you the truth. Anyone who says to a mountain, 'move out of my way and jump into the sea,' and has no doubts in his soul but believes it will come to pass, that man's words will become true."
|Awkward?
|-
|24
|Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
|"So I tell you, if you pray for whatever you desire, and believe that you'll receieve it, you will."
|
|-
|25
|And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
|"And when you're praying, forgive anyone who is against you, so that your father God in heaven will forgive you your sins as well."
|
|-
|26
|But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.
|"If you don't forgive, God your heavenly father will not forgive you."
|
|-
|27
|And they come again to Jerusalem: and as he was walking in the temple, there come to him the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders,
|When they returned to Jerusalem, the intellectuals (chief priests, scribes, and elders) came to him as He was walking in the temple.
|use intellectuals here? or incumbents, or elites?
|-
|28
|And say unto him, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority to do these things?
|"And they asked him 'Who gave you the authority to do these things?'"
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, I will also ask of you one question, and answer me, and I will tell you by what authority I do these things.
|"Jesus replied, 'If you will answer one question, I'll tell you by whose authority I do these things.'"
|
|-
|30
|The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men? answer me.
|"Tell me. Did John's baptism come from Heaven, or from men?"
|
|-
|31
|And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then did ye not believe him?
|They debated with each other, "If we say 'from heaven,' then He will reply, 'Then why didn't you believe him?'
|
|-
|32
|But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed.
|But if we say, 'of men,' the people will turn against us because they feel John was a prophet.'"
|how to translate "they feared the people"?
|-
|33
|And they answered and said unto Jesus, We cannot tell. And Jesus answering saith unto them, Neither do I tell you by what authority I do these things.
|So the intellectuals replied to Jesus, "We cannot answer." And Jesus responded, "Neither do I reveal to you my authority for my good deeds."
|"these things"? perhaps "good deeds".
|}

==Chapter 12==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he began to speak unto them by parables. A certain man planted a vineyard, and set an hedge about it, and digged a place for the winefat, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country.
|Jesus began to teach them parables. "A businessman planted a vineyard and placed a hedge around it. He dug a place for the juices, built a tower, rented it to workers, and traveled abroad.
|
|-
|2
|And at the season he sent to the husbandmen a servant, that he might receive from the husbandmen of the fruit of the vineyard.
|When the grape season arrived, he sent an employee to them, to return with the fruit of the vineyard.
|
|-
|3
|And they caught him, and beat him, and sent him away empty.
|But they caught him, beat him, and cast him off without the goods.
|
|-
|4
|And again he sent unto them another servant; and at him they cast stones, and wounded him in the head, and sent him away shamefully handled.
|So the owner sent another employee, but they threw stones at him, wounding him in the head. He too was rebuffed, badly treated.
|
|-
|5
|And again he sent another; and him they killed, and many others; beating some, and killing some.
|He sent a third, and they killed him, as well as many others. They beat some, killed some.
|
|-
|6
|Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
|He still had a son, whom he loved, and sent him to them last, thinking they would respect his son.
|
|-
|7
|But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
|But the workers plotted with each other: 'this is his heir. If we kill him, we can take the inheritance.'
|
|-
|8
|And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
|So they killed him and left his body outside the vineyard.
|
|-
|9
|What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others.
|So what should the vineyard owner do? He will return to annihilate the workers and give the vineyard to better workers.
|Clarification of "others"
|-
|10
|And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
|Have you not read in the scripture, 'The stone rejected by the builders becomes the cornerstone,
|
|-
|11
|This was the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
|This is the Lord's way, and it is wonderful to see'?"
|
|-
|12
|And they sought to lay hold on him, but feared the people: for they knew that he had spoken the parable against them: and they left him, and went their way.
|The furious intellectuals wanted to grab him them, but feared the public; they knew this parable was directed at them. They gave up for now and walked out.
|something stronger than "grab him" might work
|-
|13
|And they send unto him certain of the Pharisees and of the Herodians, to catch him in his words.
|
|
|-
|14
|And when they were come, they say unto him, Master, we know that thou art true, and carest for no man: for thou regardest not the person of men, but teachest the way of God in truth: Is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not?
|
|
|-
|15
|Shall we give, or shall we not give? But he, knowing their hypocrisy, said unto them, Why tempt ye me? bring me a penny, that I may see it.
|
|
|-
|16
|And they brought it. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? And they said unto him, Caesar's.
|
|
|-
|17
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him.
|
|
|-
|18
|Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,
|
|
|-
|19
|Master, Moses wrote unto us, If a man's brother die, and leave his wife behind him, and leave no children, that his brother should take his wife, and raise up seed unto his brother.
|
|
|-
|20
|Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed.
|
|
|-
|21
|And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise.
|
|
|-
|22
|And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also.
|
|
|-
|23
|In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
|
|
|-
|24
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
|
|
|-
|25
|For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
|
|
|-
|26
|And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
|
|
|-
|27
|He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
|
|
|-
|28
|And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
|
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
|
|
|-
|30
|And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
|
|
|-
|31
|And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
|
|
|-
|32
|And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
|
|
|-
|33
|And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
|
|
|-
|34
|And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
|
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the Son of David?
|
|
|-
|36
|For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
|
|
|-
|37
|David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
|
|
|-
|38
|And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,
|
|
|-
|39
|And the chief seats in the synagogues, and the uppermost rooms at feasts:
|
|
|-
|40
|Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.
|
|
|-
|41
|And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much.
|
|
|-
|42
|And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing.
|
|
|-
|43
|And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
|
|
|-
|44
|For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 13==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
|As they left the temple, one of Jesus' disciples said, "master, just look at the sort of stone and magnificient buildings are here!"
|
|-
|2
|And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
|Jesus responded, "See these grand buildings? Not one stone will remain atop another which will not be destroyed."
|
|-
|3
|And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
|As Jesus sat atop the Mount of Olives, looking at the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew quietly asked,
|
|-
|4
|Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
|"When will these events take place, and what will be the sign of their fulfillment?"
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:
|Jesus answered them, "Be on guard unless you be fooled by any man's deceit."
|
|-
|6
|For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
|"Many will come shouting my name and say "I am Christ!" Many will be fooled by their deceit."
|
|-
|7
|And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
|When you hear news of war and false rumor about them, don't worry, because they must occur but will not be the end.
|
|-
|8
|For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
|Nations will rise against nations, and nation-states against nation-states. Earthquakes will occur around the works. There will be famines and chaos. These are the beginnings of the sorrow.
|"Troubles" has lost its connotation. Replaced with new conservative term
|-
|9
|But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
|So take care of yourselves, as the masses will give you to the tribunals, you will be beaten in houses of worship, and be hauled before leaders and kings for my sake, to testify against them.
|
|-
|10
|And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
|The good news has to be published among all the nation-states first.
|
|-
|11
|But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
|"But when they drag you or betray you, do not plan what you will say. In that hour, you will speak words inspired by the Divine Guide.
|
|-
|12
|Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
|Brother will betray brother to his death, father to son, children will rebel against their parents, and shall be the death of them.
|
|-
|13
|And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
|And you will be hated by every man for my sake, but you will be saved if you endure to the end.
|
|-
|14
|But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
|
|
|-
|15
|And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
|
|
|-
|16
|And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
|
|
|-
|17
|But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
|
|
|-
|18
|And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
|
|
|-
|19
|For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
|
|
|-
|20
|And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
|
|
|-
|21
|And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
|
|
|-
|22
|For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
|
|
|-
|23
|But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
|
|
|-
|24
|But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
|
|
|-
|25
|And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
|
|
|-
|26
|And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
|
|
|-
|27
|And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
|
|
|-
|28
|Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
|
|
|-
|29
|So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
|
|
|-
|30
|Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
|
|
|-
|31
|Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
|
|
|-
|32
|But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
|
|
|-
|33
|Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
|
|
|-
|34
|For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
|
|
|-
|35
|Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
|
|
|-
|36
|Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
|
|
|-
|37
|And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 14==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After two days was the feast of the passover, and of unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to death.
|Two days later, it was time for the the passover holiday of unleavened bread, and the high priests and scribes were trying to figure out how to catch him by deceit and kill him.
|
|-
|2
|But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar of the people.
|But they said, "Not on the holiday; the mob will get upset."
|
|-
|3
|And being in Bethany in the house of Simon the leper, as he sat at meat, there came a woman having an alabaster box of ointment of spikenard very precious; and she brake the box, and poured it on his head.
|At that time, he was in Bethany at Simon the leper's house, having a meal. A woman came in with an expensive white crystal container of valerian oil, which she opened and poured over his head.
|
|-
|4
|And there were some that had indignation within themselves, and said, Why was this waste of the ointment made?
|Some of the onlookers were shocked, saying "Why did she waste that nice oil like that?
|
|-
|5
|For it might have been sold for more than three hundred pence, and have been given to the poor. And they murmured against her.
|We could have sold that for more than three dollars and charitably donated the money to the poor!" They kept whispering about what a bad thing she had done.
|
|-
|6
|And Jesus said, Let her alone; why trouble ye her? she hath wrought a good work on me.
|But Jesus said, "Leave her alone; why are you bothering her? She had done something good.
|
|-
|7
|For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.
|There will always be poor people around, and whenever you feel like helping them you can, but I am not going to be around forever.
|
|-
|8
|She hath done what she could: she is come aforehand to anoint my body to the burying.
|She did what she could: She came in advance to get my body ready for burial.
|
|-
|9
|Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached throughout the whole world, this also that she hath done shall be spoken of for a memorial of her.
|Truly I tell you: Anywhere in the world that people preach the good news about me, they are also going to remember what she did and talk about it."
|
|-
|10
|And Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve, went unto the chief priests, to betray him unto them.
|After that, Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve apostles, went to betray Jesus to the high priests,
|
|-
|11
|And when they heard it, they were glad, and promised to give him money. And he sought how he might conveniently betray him.
|who were happy to hear it and offered to pay him. So Judas thought about how it would be best to do the deed.
|
|-
|12
|And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?
|So on the first day of the Passover holiday, after they killed the lamb, the disciples of Jesus said to him, "Where do you want us to go and get this lamb ready for you to eat?"
|
|-
|13
|And he sendeth forth two of his disciples, and saith unto them, Go ye into the city, and there shall meet you a man bearing a pitcher of water: follow him.
|He answered by sending two of the disciples to go to town. "Go into the city, and you'll find a man carrying a pitcher of water. Follow him.
|
|-
|14
|And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
|When he goes into a house, tell the man in charge, 'Our master wants to know where the guestroom is, so we can eat our lamb.'
|
|-
|15
|And he will shew you a large upper room furnished and prepared: there make ready for us.
|He will show you a large, furnished room on the second floor: Prepare for us there."
|
|-
|16
|And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
|So the disciples went into town, and it happened exactly like he had told them, so they got the lamb ready to eat.
|
|-
|17
|And in the evening he cometh with the twelve.
|That evening, Jesus and the twelve arrived.
|
|-
|18
|And as they sat and did eat, Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, One of you which eateth with me shall betray me.
|While they were sitting and eating, Jesus said, "Truly I tell you, one of you will who eats here will betray me."
|
|-
|19
|And they began to be sorrowful, and to say unto him one by one, Is it I? and another said, Is it I?
|They became very upset, and one after another said, "Are you talking to me?" "Is it me?"
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto them, It is one of the twelve, that dippeth with me in the dish.
|Jesus told them, "It is one of you - the one who dips his bread in the bowl with me.
|
|-
|21
|The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born.
|The Son of man really walks the earth, as the scriptures said, but as for the man who betrays the Son of man, he would have been better off if he had never been born."
|
|-
|22
|And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.
|And while they were eating, Jesus took the bread, blessed it, broke it, and distributed it, saying "Take this and eat it. This is my body."
|
|-
|23
|And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
|And he took the cup, said a prayer, and passed it around, and everybody drank some.
|
|-
|24
|And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
|Then he said to them, "This is my blood of the new testament, which I bled for the sake of many people.
|
|-
|25
|Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.
|Truly I say to you, I shall not drink wine again until the day I drink it anew in the kingdom of God."
|
|-
|26
|And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.
|Then, after they had sung a hymn, they went out into the Mount of Olives,
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.
|where Jesus told them, "All of you are going to have trouble tonight because of me. It is prophesied, "I will kill the shepherd, and then the sheep will be scattered."
|
|-
|28
|But after that I am risen, I will go before you into Galilee.
|But I shall rise and I shall go into Galilee before you."
|
|-
|29
|But Peter said unto him, Although all shall be offended, yet will not I.
|But Peter said, "Though all shall have trouble, I shall take it."
|
|-
|30
|And Jesus saith unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this day, even in this night, before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice.
|And Jesus said to him, "Hear me when I say that tonight, before the rooster crows twice, you are going to disavow me three times."
|
|-
|31
|But he spake the more vehemently, If I should die with thee, I will not deny thee in any wise. Likewise also said they all.
|But Peter protested, with agitation, "Even if I end up having to die with you, I'll never disavow you." Everyone chimed in to say the same.
|
|-
|32
|And they came to a place which was named Gethsemane: and he saith to his disciples, Sit ye here, while I shall pray.
|By now, they were at a place called Gethsemane. Jesus told his disciples, "Take a seat here, everyone. I want to pray."
|
|-
|33
|And he taketh with him Peter and James and John, and began to be sore amazed, and to be very heavy;
|Then he went away from them, taking Peter, James, and John, and he became very upset and distressed.
|
|-
|34
|And saith unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful unto death: tarry ye here, and watch.
|He said to them, "My soul is dying of sadness. Stay here and keep your eyes open."
|
|-
|35
|And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him.
|He wandered away a little, and fell to the ground. He prayed that if there were any possible way he wouldn't have to go through this tribulation.
|
|-
|36
|And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.
|He said, "Oh Father, anything is possible for you. I don't want this fate. Take it away. But let it be what you want, not what I want."
|
|-
|37
|And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping, and saith unto Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? couldest not thou watch one hour?
|When he came back and found his disciples sleeping, he said to Peter, "Simon are you sleeping? Couldn't you keep your eyes open for an hour?
|
|-
|38
|Watch ye and pray, lest ye enter into temptation. The spirit truly is ready, but the flesh is weak.
|Keep them open and pray, or else you might fall for temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
|
|-
|39
|And again he went away, and prayed, and spake the same words.
|Again, he went away and prayed, and he said the same thing again.
|
|-
|40
|And when he returned, he found them asleep again, (for their eyes were heavy,) neither wist they what to answer him.
|When he got back, he found them asleep again (they were really tired), and they had no idea how to answer him.
|
|-
|41
|And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: it is enough, the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|The third time he came back, he told them, "Just sleep now. I have prayed enough, and the time has come for the Son of man to be betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|
|-
|42
|Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.
|Get up, we must go. Look, the betrayer is here."
|
|-
|43
|And immediately, while he yet spake, cometh Judas, one of the twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and staves, from the chief priests and the scribes and the elders.
|And just as he was saying that, Judas came in, along with a lot of armed people, from the chief priests, scribes, and elders.
|
|-
|44
|And he that betrayed him had given them a token, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he; take him, and lead him away safely.
|The betrayer had made an arrangement with them: "The man I kiss is the man you want. Take him and keep him safe."
|
|-
|45
|And as soon as he was come, he goeth straightway to him, and saith, Master, master; and kissed him.
|And as soon as he was there, he went directly to Jesus, saying "Master, Master!" and kissed him.
|
|-
|46
|And they laid their hands on him, and took him.
|And the armed people grabbed Jesus and took him away.
|
|-
|47
|And one of them that stood by drew a sword, and smote a servant of the high priest, and cut off his ear.
|But Peter, who was standing by, pulled his sword out and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his ear.
|
|-
|48
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, Are ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and with staves to take me?
|Jesus said, "Are you coming to get me with your swords and sticks as you would a thief?
|
|-
|49
|I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.
|I was right there with you, teaching in the temple every single day, and you never came for me then. But the scriptures will have to be fulfilled."
|
|-
|50
|And they all forsook him, and fled.
|Then they all abandoned him and fled.
|
|-
|51
|And there followed him a certain young man, having a linen cloth cast about his naked body; and the young men laid hold on him:
|A young man there following him, with a linen sheet wrapped around his naked body, when he was grabbed by the men.
|While it is likely this boy was Mark, the author, the original text uses the third person.
|-
|52
|And he left the linen cloth, and fled from them naked.
|He ran away naked, leaving the sheet with them.
|
|-
|53
|And they led Jesus away to the high priest: and with him were assembled all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes.
|Then the armed men took Jesus to the high priest, and all the chief priests, elders, and scribes were assembled there.
|
|-
|54
|And Peter followed him afar off, even into the palace of the high priest: and he sat with the servants, and warmed himself at the fire.
|Peter followed from a distance, all the way into the high priest's palace, and he sat down at the fire with the servants and made himself comfortable.
|
|-
|55
|And the chief priests and all the council sought for witness against Jesus to put him to death; and found none.
|The chief priests and the rest of the council asked for truthful testimony against Jesus so they could put him to death, but found none.
|
|-
|56
|For many bare false witness against him, but their witness agreed not together.
|For there was much false testimony, and the witnesses contradicted each other.
|
|-
|57
|And there arose certain, and bare false witness against him, saying,
|The deceitful witnesses said,
|
|-
|58
|We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.
|"We heard him say, 'I will destroy this handmade temple, and within three days I will build another without using my hands."
|
|-
|59
|But neither so did their witness agree together.
|But these witnesses also contradicted each other.
|
|-
|60
|And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
|The high priest stood up and asked Jesus, "Do you have nothing to say? Just what are they saying about you?"
|
|-
|61
|But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
|Jesus kept silent. The high priest started interrogating him again: "Are you the Christ, the son of the blessed?"
|
|-
|62
|And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
|Jesus answered, saying "I am, and you all are going to see the son of man sitting at the right hand side of power and coming in the clouds of heaven."
|
|-
|63
|Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
|The high priest ripped his shirt off, saying "We don't need any more witnesses!
|
|-
|64
|Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
|You all heard the blasphemy, now what do you think about that?" And they all condemned him to death.
|
|-
|65
|And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.
|Some of them spat on him. They put a bag over his head and punched him. They taunted him, "Tell us the future, prophet!", and the servants slapped him.
|
|-
|66
|And as Peter was beneath in the palace, there cometh one of the maids of the high priest:
|Meanwhile, Peter was down in the palace, when one of the high priest's maids came by.
|
|-
|67
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked upon him, and said, And thou also wast with Jesus of Nazareth.
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, "You were with Jesus of Nazareth."
|
|-
|68
|But he denied, saying, I know not, neither understand I what thou sayest. And he went out into the porch; and the cock crew.
|He denied it, saying, "I do not know what you are talking about." And as he went out to the porch, the rooster crowed.
|
|-
|69
|And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them.
|And another maid saw him, and said to the bystanders, "This is one of them."
|
|-
|70
|And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto.
|But he denied it again. And again the bystanders said to Peter, "Surely, you are one of them, for your accent is Galilean."
|
|-
|71
|But he began to curse and to swear, saying, I know not this man of whom ye speak.
|But he began to swear, saying, "I do not know the man you speak of."
|
|-
|72
|And the second time the cock crew. And Peter called to mind the word that Jesus said unto him, Before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice. And when he thought thereon, he wept.
|And again the cock crowed. Peter recalled what Jesus had told him, "Before the cock crows twice, you will deny me three times." And he wept at the thought.
|
|}

==Chapter 15==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And straightway in the morning the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council, and bound Jesus, and carried him away, and delivered him to Pilate.
|In the morning the high priests held an urgent consultations with the elders and scribes, and the council, and decided to take Jesus to Pilate.
|
|-
|2
|And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto him, Thou sayest it.
|Pilate asked him, "Are you the King of the Jews?" And he answered them, saying, "You say that I am."
|
|-
|3
|And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.
|And the high priests accused him of many things, but he did not answer.
|
|-
|4
|And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.
|Pilate asked him again, "Have you nothing to say? Look, how many testify against you."
|
|-
|5
|But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.
|But Jesus said nothing, and Pilate was amazed.
|
|-
|6
|Now at that feast he released unto them one prisoner, whomsoever they desired.
|Now at Passover, Pilate released one prisoner, chosen by the people.
|
|-
|7
|And there was one named Barabbas, which lay bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.
|There was one named Barabbas, who was imprisoned because he had rebelled and committed murder in the rebellion.
|
|-
|8
|And the multitude crying aloud began to desire him to do as he had ever done unto them.
|And the crowds cried aloud, begging Pilate to release a prisoner as he always had.
|
|-
|9
|But Pilate answered them, saying, Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate answered them, saying "Do you wish me to release the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|10
|For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.
|Since he knew the high priests had brought Jesus to him out of envy of His popularity.
|
|-
|11
|But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.
|But the high priests influenced the people to request the release of Barabbas.
|
|-
|12
|And Pilate answered and said again unto them, What will ye then that I shall do unto him whom ye call the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate said to the crowds, "What, then, do you wish me to do to the mean you call the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|13
|And they cried out again, Crucify him.
|And the crowds cried out, "Crucify him."
|
|-
|14
|Then Pilate said unto them, Why, what evil hath he done? And they cried out the more exceedingly, Crucify him.
|So Pilate said to them, "Why? What has he done wrong?" And they cried out louder, "Crucify him!"
|
|-
|15
|And so Pilate, willing to content the people, released Barabbas unto them, and delivered Jesus, when he had scourged him, to be crucified.
|So Pilate, to keep the people content, released Barabbas to them, and had Jesus scourged and sent to be crucified.
|
|-
|16
|And the soldiers led him away into the hall, called Praetorium; and they call together the whole band.
|
|
|-
|17
|And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,
|
|
|-
|18
|And began to salute him, Hail, King of the Jews!
|
|
|-
|19
|And they smote him on the head with a reed, and did spit upon him, and bowing their knees worshipped him.
|
|
|-
|20
|And when they had mocked him, they took off the purple from him, and put his own clothes on him, and led him out to crucify him.
|
|
|-
|21
|And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross.
|
|
|-
|22
|And they bring him unto the place Golgotha, which is, being interpreted, The place of a skull.
|
|
|-
|23
|And they gave him to drink wine mingled with myrrh: but he received it not.
|
|
|-
|24
|And when they had crucified him, they parted his garments, casting lots upon them, what every man should take.
|
|
|-
|25
|And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
|
|
|-
|26
|And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS.
|
|
|-
|27
|And with him they crucify two thieves; the one on his right hand, and the other on his left.
|
|
|-
|28
|And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors.
|
|
|-
|29
|And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days,
|
|
|-
|30
|Save thyself, and come down from the cross.
|
|
|-
|31
|Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.
|
|
|-
|32
|Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.
|
|
|-
|33
|And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
|
|
|-
|34
|And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
|
|
|-
|35
|And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
|
|
|-
|36
|And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
|
|
|-
|37
|And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
|
|
|-
|38
|And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.
|
|
|-
|39
|And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
|
|
|-
|40
|There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;
|
|
|-
|41
|(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
|
|
|-
|42
|And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,
|
|
|-
|43
|Joseph of Arimathaea, and honourable counseller, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
|
|
|-
|44
|And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
|
|
|-
|45
|And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
|
|
|-
|46
|And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
|
|
|-
|47
|And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 16==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
|After the sabbath, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Salome, brought sweet spices to Jesus' body to anoint Him.
|
|-
|2
|And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
|Very early in the morning on the day after the sabbath, as the sun rose, they came to the tomb of Jesus.
|
|-
|3
|And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre?
|And the women said to each other, "Who will roll away the stone blocking the tomb door?"
|
|-
|4
|And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.
|But when the women looked, they saw that the massive stone had been rolled to the side.
|why not use the pronoun "women" here?
|-
|5
|And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
|And as they entered into the tomb, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, wearing a long white garment, and they were afraid.
|
|-
|6
|And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.
|The man said to them, "Do not fear: You seek Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He is risen, he is not here - look at the plase where they laid him.
|
|-
|7
|But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.
|Leave now, and tell Peter and the disciples of Jesus that He has gone ahead of you into Galilee: you will see him there, as he told you."
|
|-
|8
|And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
|
|
|-
|9
|Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
|
|The verses from here on are not in the oldest manuscripts, and are not likely to be authentic.<ref>http://www.bible-researcher.com/endmark.html</ref>
|-
|10
|And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.
|
|
|-
|11
|And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
|
|
|-
|12
|After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
|
|
|-
|13
|And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
|
|
|-
|15
|And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
|
|
|-
|16
|He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
|
|
|-
|17
|And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
|
|
|-
|18
|They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
|
|
|-
|19
|So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
|
|
|-
|20
|And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
|
|
|}

== References ==

<references/>

Mark 9-16 (Translated)

2009-10-14T04:03:11Z

Danielitld: Mark uses the word husterei, which means to lack

==Chapter 9==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
|Jesus said the them, "Truly I tell you, there are some of you who stand here will live to see the kingdom of God come with power."
|Jesus refers here to the founding of the Church, which truly begins with the events of Acts 2:1-4.
|-
|2
|And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
|After six days Jesus took Peter, James, and John, and led them up into a high mountain, and was transfigured before them.
|
|-
|3
|And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
|His clothing was shining, whiter than snow, or anything else on Earth.
|
|-
|4
|And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
|And they saw Elijah and Moses, and they spoke with Jesus.
|
|-
|5
|And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
|Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good for us to be here. Let us make three tents for the blessed, one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah."
|
|-
|6
|For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
|For he was did not know what to say, they were so nervous.
|Perhaps they were afraid, yes, but not as one is afraid of a fire or an animal, but afraid of disrespecting the divine - thoughts on this?
|-
|7
|And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.
|Now a cloud came and cast a shadow all around, and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is my beloved Son: hear His words."
|
|-
|8
|And suddenly, when they had looked round about, they saw no man any more, save Jesus only with themselves.
|When they looked around them, they could not see a single person, except Jesus and themselves.
|
|-
|9
|And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
|As they came down the mountain, he asked them not to tell anyone what they had seen until he, the Son of Man, had risen from the grave.
|
|-
|10
|And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.
|Indeed, they kept his secret, but asked each other what such a resurrection would entail.
|
|-
|11
|And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elias must first come?
|Then they asked Jesus, "why do the writers say that Elijah will come first?"
|
|-
|12
|And he answered and told them, Elias verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.
|He responded, "it is true that Elijah must come first to restore everything. Likewise, it is written that the Son of Man must suffer a great deal and be despised."
|
|-
|13
|But I say unto you, That Elias is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.
|"But Elijah has already come, and the elite did to him whatever they wanted, as was prophesied."
|Clarifying "they" (Herod et. al)
|-
|14
|And when he came to his disciples, he saw a great multitude about them, and the scribes questioning with them.
|Returning to his disciples, he found an enormous crowd had gathered around them, with the intellectuals interrogating them.
|
|-
|15
|And straightway all the people, when they beheld him, were greatly amazed, and running to him saluted him.
|Immediately the whole crowd, seeing Jesus, ran to salute him, amazed by his presence.
|
|-
|16
|And he asked the scribes, What question ye with them?
|Jesus demanded of the intellectuals, "what are you asking the people about?"
|
|-
|17
|And one of the multitude answered and said, Master, I have brought unto thee my son, which hath a dumb spirit;
|But a man from the crowd ran forward and said, "Lord, I've brought you my son, who has a demon of dumbness."
|Even the KJV had some gender-neutral verbiage
|-
|18
|And wheresoever he taketh him, he teareth him: and he foameth, and gnasheth with his teeth, and pineth away: and I spake to thy disciples that they should cast him out; and they could not.
|"And wherever the demon takes him, he claws at himself, foams from the mouth, gnashes his teeth, and his body wastes away. I asked your disciples to exorcise him, but they couldn't."
|
|-
|19
|He answereth him, and saith, O faithless generation, how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him unto me.
|Jesus responded, "You faithless generation, how long can I be with you? How long will I suffer your sinfulness? Bring your sun to me."
|
|-
|20
|And they brought him unto him: and when he saw him, straightway the spirit tare him; and he fell on the ground, and wallowed foaming.
|They brought him. The demon saw Jesus and immediately threw the boy to the ground, who flailed, foaming.
|
|-
|21
|And he asked his father, How long is it ago since this came unto him? And he said, Of a child.
|Jesus asked the father, "how long has this afflicted him?" "Since he was a child."
|
|-
|22
|And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him: but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us.
|"Sometimes the demon throws him into the fire, other times into water in order to kill him. If it is true that you can do anything, please have compassion on us and help."
|
|-
|23
|Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
|Jesus replied, "If you can believe; anything is possible to the believer."
|
|-
|24
|And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
|The father cried out, tears filling his eyes, "I believe, Lord. Help my closed-mindedness."
|good use of "close-mindedness" here
|-
|25
|When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.
|When Jesus saw the crowd of people, he scolded the evil spirit, telling him, "you deaf and mute spirit, I order to you leave him alone, and to never bother him again".
|
|-
|26
|And the spirit cried, and rent him sore, and came out of him: and he was as one dead; insomuch that many said, He is dead.
|The spirit cried out and violently exited. The boy looked so much like he was dead, that bystanders declared, "He's dead!"
|
|-
|27
|But Jesus took him by the hand, and lifted him up; and he arose.
|But Jesus took his hand and pulled him up, and he stood up.
|
|-
|28
|And when he was come into the house, his disciples asked him privately, Why could not we cast him out?
|When Jesus went indoors, his disciples privately asked him, "Why couldn't we cast him out?"
|
|-
|29
|And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting.
|He told them, "that kind of spirit can only be driven out by prayer and fasting."
|
|-
|30
|And they departed thence, and passed through Galilee; and he would not that any man should know it.
|They moved on, passing through Galilee; Jesus kept a low profile.
|
|-
|31
|For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day.
|He taught his disciples, saying, "The Son of man shall be betrayed to men who shall murder him, but afterward he shall rise on the third day.
|
|-
|32
|But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him.
|The disciples did not understand this, and were afraid to ask Jesus.
|
|-
|33
|And he came to Capernaum: and being in the house he asked them, What was it that ye disputed among yourselves by the way?
|They arrived to a home in Capernaum, where Jesus asked the disciples, "What were you arguing about on the road?
|
|-
|34
|But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
|But they were too ashamed to answer because they had been debating who was the greatest among them.
|
|-
|35
|And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, the same shall be last of all, and servant of all.
|Jesus sat down and summoned the Twelve, saying, "If anyone wants the highest rank, then he must first become the lowest of all, serving all."
|tricky, but very important quote
|-
|36
|And he took a child, and set him in the midst of them: and when he had taken him in his arms, he said unto them,
|Jesus then invited a child to join them, and after taking him in His arms, Jesus declared,
|the [[NAB]] calls the child an "it"; question: was this child Mark, and should Mark be referenced here?
|-
|37
|Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me.
|Whoever welcomes such a child in my name, welcomes me; and whoever welcomes me, receives not me but He who sent me.
|don't emasculate reference to "he" in "He who sent me"; "receives not me" might be improvable
|-
|38
|And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.
|John replied: "Master, we saw a man casting out demons in your Name, who was not one of our group. We told him to stop doing it, because he wasn't one of your disciples.
|Making 'disciples' clear.
|-
|39
|But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.
|But Jesus replied: "Do not forbid him! You see, no man who has carried out a good work in my Name can easily turn round and attack me.
|Capitalising 'Name' when referring to Jesus; avoiding 'miracle', which now implies something surprising or unlikely.
|-
|40
|For he that is not against us is on our part.
|Because he who is not our enemy is our ally.
|
|-
|41
|For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
|Anyone who gives you a drink of water in my name, because you follow Christ, will not lose his reward in heaven.
|
|-
|42
|And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
|Anyone who corrupts or deceives a child who believes in me will wish he had had a millstone hung around his neck and had been cast into the sea.
|"offends" has been diluted over time to mean "hurt feelings"
|-
|43
|And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your hand corrupts you, cut if off. Entering eternal life maimed is better than descending to Hell with both hands intact, where the fire burns forever.
|
|-
|44
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|concept of "worm" is difficult, and often mistranslated. Appears to refer to a debased soul.
|-
|45
|And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
|If your foot corrupts you, cut it off. It's better to limp into eternal life than walk steadily into Hell, into that unending fire.
|
|-
|46
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|47
|And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
|If your eye deceives you, remove it. Entering God's kingdom half-blinded is better than entering Hell's fires with sight intact.
|
|-
|48
|Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
|There, the condemned soul does not die, but burns forever.
|
|-
|49
|For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.
|Everyone will be salted by fire, as every sacrifice will be salted with salt.
|
|-
|50
|Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another.
|Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how will you season the sacrifice? Have salt in yourselves, and have the divine tranquility of mind.
|After years, I still have trouble with verses 49-50. Updating peace to avoid erroneous pacificist connotations.
|}

==Chapter 10==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he arose from thence, and cometh into the coasts of Judaea by the farther side of Jordan: and the people resort unto him again; and, as he was wont, he taught them again.
|And he left that place, and went to the coasts of Judea on the far side of the Jordan river, and the people came to Him again, and he taught them again.
|
|-
|2
|And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.
|The Pharisees came to him, and attempted to trick him by asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
|Translator JacobB uses "Pharisees;" see [[Talk:Gospel of Mark (Translated)#"Self-Proclaimed Elite"|this discussion]] regarding the use of "Pharisees."
|-
|3
|And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
|And He answered them, "What did Moses command you?"
|
|-
|4
|And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
|They said, "Moses begrudgingly permitted divorce."
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
|Jesus answered them, saying "He wrote you this law because men are not pure of heart.
|
|-
|6
|But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
|But from the beginning of time, God has made man, male and female.
|
|-
|7
|For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
|For this reason, men leave their parents and cling to a wife,
|
|-
|8
|And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
|and the two shall be one flesh, so that they are no longer two people, but one.
|
|-
|9
|What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
|What God has joined together, let no mean tear apart."
|
|-
|10
|And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
|In his house, later, his disciples the same question again.
|The Pharisees asked Jesus this question to trick him; His disciples asked him out of curiosity.
|-
|11
|And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
|He said to them, "Any man who divorces his wife and marries another has committed adultery.
|
|-
|12
|And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
|And if a woman divorces her husband, and marries another, she commits adultery."
|
|-
|13
|And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them.
|Young children were brought to Jesus, that he might teach them. His disciples rebuked those who brought the children,
|
|-
|14
|But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
|but when Jesus saw what his disciples had done, was was very unhappy, and told them, "Do not forbid the children to come to me. Allow them there, for they are so like the kingdom of God.
|
|-
|15
|Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
|Truly I say to you, who ever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child does, he shall not enter into it."
|
|-
|16
|And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|Jesus took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
|
|-
|17
|And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
|As he was leaving, a man came running up to him, and kneeled before him, asking, "Blessed master, what shall I do that I may have eternal life?"
|
|-
|18
|And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
|And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call me good? There is no one good but God the Father.
|
|-
|19
|Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
|You know the commandments, 'Do not commit adultery, do not kill, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your parents."
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
|The man answered Him, saying, "Master, I have kept all the commandments, since I was a child."
|
|-
|21
|Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
|Jesus loved him, so He said to him, "You lack one thing: go home, sell all your possessions, giving all you have to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow me."
|
|-
|22
|And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
|The man was sad to hear this, and grieved as he left, for he was very wealthy.
|
|-
|23
|And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
|Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How unlikely it is that those who worship riches will enter the kingdom of God!"
|
|-
|24
|And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
|The disciples were astonished to hear this. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is for those who trust in riches to enter the kingdom of God!
|
|-
|25
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
|It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a man who cares only for money to enter into the kingdom of God."
|very nice improvement on the imprecise term "rich"
|-
|26
|And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
|They were incredulous, saying to each other, "Who, then, can be saved?"
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
|Jesus looked at them and said, "With men, it is impossible to be saved, but not with God - with God, all things are possible."
|reject the emasculation of the reference to "men" found in modern translations, such as by [[TNIV]] translators who plan to replace [[NIV]]
|-
|28
|Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
|Peter said to him, "We have left all we had, and followed you."
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
|Jesus answered, "Truly I tell you, every man who has left his house, or siblings, or parents, or family, or lands for my sake and the sake of the gospel
|
|-
|30
|But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
|shall in this life receive a hundred times as much persecution as he gave up in goods. But in the world to come, he shall receive eternal life.
|-
|31
|But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.
|Many who are exalted by man shall be humbled by God, and many who are humiliated by man shall be exalted by God."
|This needs work, advice? Alternative: translate first as "highest rank" or "highest place" or "idolized"
|-
|32
|And they were in the way going up to Jerusalem; and Jesus went before them: and they were amazed; and as they followed, they were afraid. And he took again the twelve, and began to tell them what things should happen unto him,
|Jesus walked ahead of the rest on their way to Jerusalem. His disciples were in amazement while other followers were fearful. Jesus pulled the twelve Apostles aside and began telling them what to expect next.
|
|-
|33
|Saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles:
|"Listen carefully: we will arrive in Jerusalem, where the Son of man shall be betrayed and handed over to the Elites, who shall condemn Him to death for execution by the Gentiles.
|
|-
|34
|And they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.
|They will mock Him, whip Him, spit on him, and murder Him; yet on the third day He shall rise to life again."
|
|-
|35
|And James and John, the sons of Zebedee, come unto him, saying, Master, we would that thou shouldest do for us whatsoever we shall desire.
|Then James and John, Zebedee's sons, approached Jesus to say, "Master, could we ask you for a favor?"
|
|-
|36
|And he said unto them, What would ye that I should do for you?
|Jesus replied, "What would you like?"
|
|-
|37
|They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
|They requested, "Give us the highest seats of honor in your glory, with one of us at your right hand and the other at your left!"
|
|-
|38
|But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
|But Jesus replied to the youngsters, "You do not understand these things. Can you drink the same cup as I, and accept the same baptism that I will endure?
|use "youngsters" to convey their youth?
|-
|39
|And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
|They replied, "Sure we can." Jesus then told them, "You will drink same cup as I, and be baptized as I will."
|seems a bit awkward, could be improved
|-
|40
|But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
|Alas, the seats on my left and right hands are not for me to distribute. They are destined for others, and will be given to them.
|
|-
|41
|And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
|The other ten disciples grew jealous of James and John when they heard this.
|
|-
|42
|But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
|Jesus gathered them together and said, "You know that those who rule over the Gentiles rule like lords over them, and those with great titles exercise authority over them."
|
|-
|43
|But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
|"It will be different for you. Anyone who is truly great among you will serve you."
|Differentiate the truly "great" followers with the so-called "great" of the Gentiles
|-
|44
|And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
|"Whoever has first rank will be the servant of all others."
|
|-
|45
|For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.
|"Because even I, the Son of Man, did not come to be served, but to serve others, and give My life as payment for the souls of all."
|
|-
|46
|And they came to Jericho: and as he went out of Jericho with his disciples and a great number of people, blind Bartimaeus, the son of Timaeus, sat by the highway side begging.
|They reached Jericho. As Jesus and His disciples emerged from the city, followed by a large crowd of people, they saw a blind man named Bartimaeus son of Timaeus begging by the side of the road.
|Making clear to today's reader that Jericho was a city.
|-
|47
|And when he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to cry out, and say, Jesus, thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|When heard that Jesus of Nazareth was there, he began to show, "Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me."
|
|-
|48
|And many charged him that he should hold his peace: but he cried the more a great deal, Thou Son of David, have mercy on me.
|Others told him to shut up, but he only shouted louder, "You, Son of David, have mercy on me!"
|
|-
|49
|And Jesus stood still, and commanded him to be called. And they call the blind man, saying unto him, Be of good comfort, rise; he calleth thee.
|Jesus stopped in His tracks, asking that he be called over. Followers then welcomed the blind man, telling him, "You've got it made: He's calling you."
|translation is verbose and colloquial; trimming welcome
|-
|50
|And he, casting away his garment, rose, and came to Jesus.
|Arising, the man threw off his coat and came to Jesus.
|
|-
|51
|And Jesus answered and said unto him, What wilt thou that I should do unto thee? The blind man said unto him, Lord, that I might receive my sight.
|
|
|-
|52
|And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 11==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when they came nigh to Jerusalem, unto Bethphage and Bethany, at the mount of Olives, he sendeth forth two of his disciples,
|They came to Bethphage and Bethany, near Jerusalem at the Mount of Olives. Jesus sent two of his disciples.
|
|-
|2
|And saith unto them, Go your way into the village over against you: and as soon as ye be entered into it, ye shall find a colt tied, whereon never man sat; loose him, and bring him.
|He told them, "go to the village in front of you. Just inside it, you'll find a tied up colt, which no man has ever sat upon. Untie him and bring him here."
|
|-
|3
|And if any man say unto you, Why do ye this? say ye that the Lord hath need of him; and straightway he will send him hither.
|"If anyone asks you why you're doing so, tell them that the Lord needs the colt, and he will send the colt along."
|
|-
|4
|And they went their way, and found the colt tied by the door without in a place where two ways met; and they loose him.
|They went to complete their task, finding the colt tied up at a street crossing and releasing him.
|
|-
|5
|And certain of them that stood there said unto them, What do ye, loosing the colt?
|Some people loitering there asked, "why are you releasing that colt?"
|
|-
|6
|And they said unto them even as Jesus had commanded: and they let them go.
|The disciples said what Jesus had told them to say, and the people let them pass.
|
|-
|7
|And they brought the colt to Jesus, and cast their garments on him; and he sat upon him.
|They returned to Jesus, put their garments on the colt, and Jesus sat on it.
|Is there a reason the KJV uses "him" referring to an animal?
|-
|8
|And many spread their garments in the way: and others cut down branches off the trees, and strawed them in the way.
|Lots of people put their clothes on Jesus' path, while others cut palm branches down and placed them on the path.
|
|-
|9
|And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
|And all the people along the route sang "Hosanna, he who comes in the name of the Lord is blessed!"
|
|-
|10
|Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest.
|"Blessed is the kingdom of David, our father, which comes in the name of the Lord, Hosanna in the highest."
|-
|11
|And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve.
|Jesus entered Jerusalem and went into the temple, and when he had seen everything and it was evening, went to Bethany with the twelve apostles.
|
|-
|12
|And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry:
|Leaving Bethany the following day, he was hungry.
|
|-
|13
|And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
|He saw a fig tree in the distance, which had leafed, and went to see if there was fruit upon it. But there was nothing but leaves, for the fig season hadn't begun.
|
|-
|14
|And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.
|Jesus declared a parable in the hearing of his disciples, "no man will eat your fruit evermore."
|
|-
|15
|And they come to Jerusalem: and Jesus went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves;
|The entered Jerusalem and Jesus entered the temple. He threw out the vendors and toppled the moneychangers' tables and dove-sellers' seats.
|
|-
|16
|And would not suffer that any man should carry any vessel through the temple.
|He would not let any man their wares through the temple.
|
|-
|17
|And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves.
|He then taught the true doctrine: "Isn't it written that My house will be the house of prayer for all people? But you have turned it into a den of thieves."
|
|-
|18
|And the scribes and chief priests heard it, and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.
|The intellectuals and corrupt priests heard this and conspired to destroy him, fearing him and the people who were amazed by his teaching.
|
|-
|19
|And when even was come, he went out of the city.
|In the evening, Jesus left the city.
|
|-
|20
|And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
|In the morning, they passed a fig tree which had dried from the roots up.
|
|-
|21
|And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
|Peter remembered what Jesus had said, and declared, "Master, look! The fig tree you condemned has withered away!"
|
|-
|22
|And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
|Jesus then provided the answer, "have faith in God."
|
|-
|23
|For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
|"I tell you the truth. Anyone who says to a mountain, 'move out of my way and jump into the sea,' and has no doubts in his soul but believes it will come to pass, that man's words will become true."
|Awkward?
|-
|24
|Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
|"So I tell you, if you pray for whatever you desire, and believe that you'll receieve it, you will."
|
|-
|25
|And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
|"And when you're praying, forgive anyone who is against you, so that your father God in heaven will forgive you your sins as well."
|
|-
|26
|But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.
|"If you don't forgive, God your heavenly father will not forgive you."
|
|-
|27
|And they come again to Jerusalem: and as he was walking in the temple, there come to him the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders,
|"When they returned to Jerusalem, the chief priests, scribes, and elders came to him as He was walking in the temple"
|
|-
|28
|And say unto him, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority to do these things?
|"And they asked him 'Who gave you the authority to do these things?'"
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, I will also ask of you one question, and answer me, and I will tell you by what authority I do these things.
|"Jesus replied, 'If you will answer one question, I'll tell you by whose authority I do these things.'"
|
|-
|30
|The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men? answer me.
|"Tell me. Did John's baptism come from Heaven, or from men?"
|
|-
|31
|And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then did ye not believe him?
|
|
|-
|32
|But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed.
|
|
|-
|33
|And they answered and said unto Jesus, We cannot tell. And Jesus answering saith unto them, Neither do I tell you by what authority I do these things.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 12==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And he began to speak unto them by parables. A certain man planted a vineyard, and set an hedge about it, and digged a place for the winefat, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country.
|
|
|-
|2
|And at the season he sent to the husbandmen a servant, that he might receive from the husbandmen of the fruit of the vineyard.
|
|
|-
|3
|And they caught him, and beat him, and sent him away empty.
|
|
|-
|4
|And again he sent unto them another servant; and at him they cast stones, and wounded him in the head, and sent him away shamefully handled.
|
|
|-
|5
|And again he sent another; and him they killed, and many others; beating some, and killing some.
|
|
|-
|6
|Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
|
|
|-
|7
|But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
|
|
|-
|8
|And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
|
|
|-
|9
|What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others.
|
|
|-
|10
|And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
|
|
|-
|11
|This was the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
|
|
|-
|12
|And they sought to lay hold on him, but feared the people: for they knew that he had spoken the parable against them: and they left him, and went their way.
|
|
|-
|13
|And they send unto him certain of the Pharisees and of the Herodians, to catch him in his words.
|
|
|-
|14
|And when they were come, they say unto him, Master, we know that thou art true, and carest for no man: for thou regardest not the person of men, but teachest the way of God in truth: Is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not?
|
|
|-
|15
|Shall we give, or shall we not give? But he, knowing their hypocrisy, said unto them, Why tempt ye me? bring me a penny, that I may see it.
|
|
|-
|16
|And they brought it. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? And they said unto him, Caesar's.
|
|
|-
|17
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him.
|
|
|-
|18
|Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,
|
|
|-
|19
|Master, Moses wrote unto us, If a man's brother die, and leave his wife behind him, and leave no children, that his brother should take his wife, and raise up seed unto his brother.
|
|
|-
|20
|Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed.
|
|
|-
|21
|And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise.
|
|
|-
|22
|And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also.
|
|
|-
|23
|In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
|
|
|-
|24
|And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
|
|
|-
|25
|For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
|
|
|-
|26
|And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
|
|
|-
|27
|He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
|
|
|-
|28
|And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
|
|
|-
|29
|And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
|
|
|-
|30
|And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
|
|
|-
|31
|And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
|
|
|-
|32
|And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
|
|
|-
|33
|And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
|
|
|-
|34
|And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
|
|
|-
|35
|And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the Son of David?
|
|
|-
|36
|For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The Lord said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
|
|
|-
|37
|David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
|
|
|-
|38
|And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,
|
|
|-
|39
|And the chief seats in the synagogues, and the uppermost rooms at feasts:
|
|
|-
|40
|Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.
|
|
|-
|41
|And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much.
|
|
|-
|42
|And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing.
|
|
|-
|43
|And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
|
|
|-
|44
|For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 13==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
|As they left the temple, one of Jesus' disciples said, "master, just look at the sort of stone and magnificient buildings are here!"
|
|-
|2
|And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
|Jesus responded, "See these grand buildings? Not one stone will remain atop another which will not be destroyed."
|
|-
|3
|And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
|As Jesus sat atop the Mount of Olives, looking at the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew quietly asked,
|
|-
|4
|Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
|"When will these events take place, and what will be the sign of their fulfillment?"
|
|-
|5
|And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:
|Jesus answered them, "Be on guard unless you be fooled by any man's deceit."
|
|-
|6
|For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
|"Many will come shouting my name and say "I am Christ!" Many will be fooled by their deceit."
|
|-
|7
|And when ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars, be ye not troubled: for such things must needs be; but the end shall not be yet.
|When you hear news of war and false rumor about them, don't worry, because they must occur but will not be the end.
|
|-
|8
|For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.
|Nations will rise against nations, and nation-states against nation-states. Earthquakes will occur around the works. There will be famines and chaos. These are the beginnings of the sorrow.
|"Troubles" has lost its connotation. Replaced with new conservative term
|-
|9
|But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
|So take care of yourselves, as the masses will give you to the tribunals, you will be beaten in houses of worship, and be hauled before leaders and kings for my sake, to testify against them.
|
|-
|10
|And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
|The good news has to be published among all the nation-states first.
|
|-
|11
|But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
|"But when they drag you or betray you, do not plan what you will say. In that hour, you will speak words inspired by the Divine Guide.
|
|-
|12
|Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
|Brother will betray brother to his death, father to son, children will rebel against their parents, and shall be the death of them.
|
|-
|13
|And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
|And you will be hated by every man for my sake, but you will be saved if you endure to the end.
|
|-
|14
|But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
|
|
|-
|15
|And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
|
|
|-
|16
|And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
|
|
|-
|17
|But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
|
|
|-
|18
|And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
|
|
|-
|19
|For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
|
|
|-
|20
|And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
|
|
|-
|21
|And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
|
|
|-
|22
|For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
|
|
|-
|23
|But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
|
|
|-
|24
|But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
|
|
|-
|25
|And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
|
|
|-
|26
|And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
|
|
|-
|27
|And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
|
|
|-
|28
|Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
|
|
|-
|29
|So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
|
|
|-
|30
|Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
|
|
|-
|31
|Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
|
|
|-
|32
|But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
|
|
|-
|33
|Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
|
|
|-
|34
|For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
|
|
|-
|35
|Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
|
|
|-
|36
|Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
|
|
|-
|37
|And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 14==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|After two days was the feast of the passover, and of unleavened bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to death.
|Two days later, it was time for the the passover holiday of unleavened bread, and the high priests and scribes were trying to figure out how to catch him by deceit and kill him.
|
|-
|2
|But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar of the people.
|But they said, "Not on the holiday; the mob will get upset."
|
|-
|3
|And being in Bethany in the house of Simon the leper, as he sat at meat, there came a woman having an alabaster box of ointment of spikenard very precious; and she brake the box, and poured it on his head.
|At that time, he was in Bethany at Simon the leper's house, having a meal. A woman came in with an expensive white crystal container of valerian oil, which she opened and poured over his head.
|
|-
|4
|And there were some that had indignation within themselves, and said, Why was this waste of the ointment made?
|Some of the onlookers were shocked, saying "Why did she waste that nice oil like that?
|
|-
|5
|For it might have been sold for more than three hundred pence, and have been given to the poor. And they murmured against her.
|We could have sold that for more than three dollars and charitably donated the money to the poor!" They kept whispering about what a bad thing she had done.
|
|-
|6
|And Jesus said, Let her alone; why trouble ye her? she hath wrought a good work on me.
|But Jesus said, "Leave her alone; why are you bothering her? She had done something good.
|
|-
|7
|For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.
|There will always be poor people around, and whenever you feel like helping them you can, but I am not going to be around forever.
|
|-
|8
|She hath done what she could: she is come aforehand to anoint my body to the burying.
|She did what she could: She came in advance to get my body ready for burial.
|
|-
|9
|Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached throughout the whole world, this also that she hath done shall be spoken of for a memorial of her.
|Truly I tell you: Anywhere in the world that people preach the good news about me, they are also going to remember what she did and talk about it."
|
|-
|10
|And Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve, went unto the chief priests, to betray him unto them.
|After that, Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve apostles, went to betray Jesus to the high priests,
|
|-
|11
|And when they heard it, they were glad, and promised to give him money. And he sought how he might conveniently betray him.
|who were happy to hear it and offered to pay him. So Judas thought about how it would be best to do the deed.
|
|-
|12
|And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?
|So on the first day of the Passover holiday, after they killed the lamb, the disciples of Jesus said to him, "Where do you want us to go and get this lamb ready for you to eat?"
|
|-
|13
|And he sendeth forth two of his disciples, and saith unto them, Go ye into the city, and there shall meet you a man bearing a pitcher of water: follow him.
|He answered by sending two of the disciples to go to town. "Go into the city, and you'll find a man carrying a pitcher of water. Follow him.
|
|-
|14
|And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
|When he goes into a house, tell the man in charge, 'Our master wants to know where the guestroom is, so we can eat our lamb.'
|
|-
|15
|And he will shew you a large upper room furnished and prepared: there make ready for us.
|He will show you a large, furnished room on the second floor: Prepare for us there."
|
|-
|16
|And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover.
|So the disciples went into town, and it happened exactly like he had told them, so they got the lamb ready to eat.
|
|-
|17
|And in the evening he cometh with the twelve.
|That evening, Jesus and the twelve arrived.
|
|-
|18
|And as they sat and did eat, Jesus said, Verily I say unto you, One of you which eateth with me shall betray me.
|While they were sitting and eating, Jesus said, "Truly I tell you, one of you will who eats here will betray me."
|
|-
|19
|And they began to be sorrowful, and to say unto him one by one, Is it I? and another said, Is it I?
|They became very upset, and one after another said, "Are you talking to me?" "Is it me?"
|
|-
|20
|And he answered and said unto them, It is one of the twelve, that dippeth with me in the dish.
|Jesus told them, "It is one of you - the one who dips his bread in the bowl with me.
|
|-
|21
|The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born.
|The Son of man really walks the earth, as the scriptures said, but as for the man who betrays the Son of man, he would have been better off if he had never been born."
|
|-
|22
|And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.
|And while they were eating, Jesus took the bread, blessed it, broke it, and distributed it, saying "Take this and eat it. This is my body."
|
|-
|23
|And he took the cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them: and they all drank of it.
|And he took the cup, said a prayer, and passed it around, and everybody drank some.
|
|-
|24
|And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
|Then he said to them, "This is my blood of the new testament, which I bled for the sake of many people.
|
|-
|25
|Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.
|Truly I say to you, I shall not drink wine again until the day I drink it anew in the kingdom of God."
|
|-
|26
|And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.
|Then, after they had sung a hymn, they went out into the Mount of Olives,
|
|-
|27
|And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.
|where Jesus told them, "All of you are going to have trouble tonight because of me. It is prophesied, "I will kill the shepherd, and then the sheep will be scattered."
|
|-
|28
|But after that I am risen, I will go before you into Galilee.
|But I shall rise and I shall go into Galilee before you."
|
|-
|29
|But Peter said unto him, Although all shall be offended, yet will not I.
|But Peter said, "Though all shall have trouble, I shall take it."
|
|-
|30
|And Jesus saith unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this day, even in this night, before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice.
|And Jesus said to him, "Hear me when I say that tonight, before the rooster crows twice, you are going to disavow me three times."
|
|-
|31
|But he spake the more vehemently, If I should die with thee, I will not deny thee in any wise. Likewise also said they all.
|But Peter protested, with agitation, "Even if I end up having to die with you, I'll never disavow you." Everyone chimed in to say the same.
|
|-
|32
|And they came to a place which was named Gethsemane: and he saith to his disciples, Sit ye here, while I shall pray.
|By now, they were at a place called Gethsemane. Jesus told his disciples, "Take a seat here, everyone. I want to pray."
|
|-
|33
|And he taketh with him Peter and James and John, and began to be sore amazed, and to be very heavy;
|Then he went away from them, taking Peter, James, and John, and he became very upset and distressed.
|
|-
|34
|And saith unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful unto death: tarry ye here, and watch.
|He said to them, "My soul is dying of sadness. Stay here and keep your eyes open."
|
|-
|35
|And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him.
|He wandered away a little, and fell to the ground. He prayed that if there were any possible way he wouldn't have to go through this tribulation.
|
|-
|36
|And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.
|He said, "Oh Father, anything is possible for you. I don't want this fate. Take it away. But let it be what you want, not what I want."
|
|-
|37
|And he cometh, and findeth them sleeping, and saith unto Peter, Simon, sleepest thou? couldest not thou watch one hour?
|When he came back and found his disciples sleeping, he said to Peter, "Simon are you sleeping? Couldn't you keep your eyes open for an hour?
|
|-
|38
|Watch ye and pray, lest ye enter into temptation. The spirit truly is ready, but the flesh is weak.
|Keep them open and pray, or else you might fall for temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
|
|-
|39
|And again he went away, and prayed, and spake the same words.
|Again, he went away and prayed, and he said the same thing again.
|
|-
|40
|And when he returned, he found them asleep again, (for their eyes were heavy,) neither wist they what to answer him.
|When he got back, he found them asleep again (they were really tired), and they had no idea how to answer him.
|
|-
|41
|And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: it is enough, the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|The third time he came back, he told them, "Just sleep now. I have prayed enough, and the time has come for the Son of man to be betrayed into the hands of sinners.
|
|-
|42
|Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.
|Get up, we must go. Look, the betrayer is here."
|
|-
|43
|And immediately, while he yet spake, cometh Judas, one of the twelve, and with him a great multitude with swords and staves, from the chief priests and the scribes and the elders.
|And just as he was saying that, Judas came in, along with a lot of armed people, from the chief priests, scribes, and elders.
|
|-
|44
|And he that betrayed him had given them a token, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he; take him, and lead him away safely.
|The betrayer had made an arrangement with them: "The man I kiss is the man you want. Take him and keep him safe."
|
|-
|45
|And as soon as he was come, he goeth straightway to him, and saith, Master, master; and kissed him.
|And as soon as he was there, he went directly to Jesus, saying "Master, Master!" and kissed him.
|
|-
|46
|And they laid their hands on him, and took him.
|And the armed people grabbed Jesus and took him away.
|
|-
|47
|And one of them that stood by drew a sword, and smote a servant of the high priest, and cut off his ear.
|But Peter, who was standing by, pulled his sword out and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his ear.
|
|-
|48
|And Jesus answered and said unto them, Are ye come out, as against a thief, with swords and with staves to take me?
|Jesus said, "Are you coming to get me with your swords and sticks as you would a thief?
|
|-
|49
|I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.
|I was right there with you, teaching in the temple every single day, and you never came for me then. But the scriptures will have to be fulfilled."
|
|-
|50
|And they all forsook him, and fled.
|Then they all abandoned him and fled.
|
|-
|51
|And there followed him a certain young man, having a linen cloth cast about his naked body; and the young men laid hold on him:
|A young man there following him, with a linen sheet wrapped around his naked body, when he was grabbed by the men.
|While it is likely this boy was Mark, the author, the original text uses the third person.
|-
|52
|And he left the linen cloth, and fled from them naked.
|He ran away naked, leaving the sheet with them.
|
|-
|53
|And they led Jesus away to the high priest: and with him were assembled all the chief priests and the elders and the scribes.
|Then the armed men took Jesus to the high priest, and all the chief priests, elders, and scribes were assembled there.
|
|-
|54
|And Peter followed him afar off, even into the palace of the high priest: and he sat with the servants, and warmed himself at the fire.
|Peter followed from a distance, all the way into the high priest's palace, and he sat down at the fire with the servants and made himself comfortable.
|
|-
|55
|And the chief priests and all the council sought for witness against Jesus to put him to death; and found none.
|The chief priests and the rest of the council asked for truthful testimony against Jesus so they could put him to death, but found none.
|
|-
|56
|For many bare false witness against him, but their witness agreed not together.
|For there was much false testimony, and the witnesses contradicted each other.
|
|-
|57
|And there arose certain, and bare false witness against him, saying,
|The deceitful witnesses said,
|
|-
|58
|We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.
|"We heard him say, 'I will destroy this handmade temple, and within three days I will build another without using my hands."
|
|-
|59
|But neither so did their witness agree together.
|But these witnesses also contradicted each other.
|
|-
|60
|And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
|The high priest stood up and asked Jesus, "Do you have nothing to say? Just what are they saying about you?"
|
|-
|61
|But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
|Jesus kept silent. The high priest started interrogating him again: "Are you the Christ, the son of the blessed?"
|
|-
|62
|And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
|Jesus answered, saying "I am, and you all are going to see the son of man sitting at the right hand side of power and coming in the clouds of heaven."
|
|-
|63
|Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
|The high priest ripped his shirt off, saying "We don't need any more witnesses!
|
|-
|64
|Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.
|You all heard the blasphemy, now what do you think about that?" And they all condemned him to death.
|
|-
|65
|And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands.
|Some of them spat on him. They put a bag over his head and punched him. They taunted him, "Tell us the future, prophet!", and the servants slapped him.
|
|-
|66
|And as Peter was beneath in the palace, there cometh one of the maids of the high priest:
|Meanwhile, Peter was down in the palace, when one of the high priest's maids came by.
|
|-
|67
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked upon him, and said, And thou also wast with Jesus of Nazareth.
|And when she saw Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, "You were with Jesus of Nazareth."
|
|-
|68
|But he denied, saying, I know not, neither understand I what thou sayest. And he went out into the porch; and the cock crew.
|He denied it, saying, "I do not know what you are talking about." And as he went out to the porch, the rooster crowed.
|
|-
|69
|And a maid saw him again, and began to say to them that stood by, This is one of them.
|And another maid saw him, and said to the bystanders, "This is one of them."
|
|-
|70
|And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art one of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth thereto.
|But he denied it again. And again the bystanders said to Peter, "Surely, you are one of them, for your accent is Galilean."
|
|-
|71
|But he began to curse and to swear, saying, I know not this man of whom ye speak.
|But he began to swear, saying, "I do not know the man you speak of."
|
|-
|72
|And the second time the cock crew. And Peter called to mind the word that Jesus said unto him, Before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice. And when he thought thereon, he wept.
|And again the cock crowed. Peter recalled what Jesus had told him, "Before the cock crows twice, you will deny me three times." And he wept at the thought.
|
|}

==Chapter 15==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And straightway in the morning the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council, and bound Jesus, and carried him away, and delivered him to Pilate.
|In the morning the high priests held an urgent consultations with the elders and scribes, and the council, and decided to take Jesus to Pilate.
|
|-
|2
|And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto him, Thou sayest it.
|Pilate asked him, "Are you the King of the Jews?" And he answered them, saying, "You say that I am."
|
|-
|3
|And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.
|And the high priests accused him of many things, but he did not answer.
|
|-
|4
|And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.
|Pilate asked him again, "Have you nothing to say? Look, how many testify against you."
|
|-
|5
|But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.
|But Jesus said nothing, and Pilate was amazed.
|
|-
|6
|Now at that feast he released unto them one prisoner, whomsoever they desired.
|Now at Passover, Pilate released one prisoner, chosen by the people.
|
|-
|7
|And there was one named Barabbas, which lay bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.
|There was one named Barabbas, who was imprisoned because he had rebelled and committed murder in the rebellion.
|
|-
|8
|And the multitude crying aloud began to desire him to do as he had ever done unto them.
|And the crowds cried aloud, begging Pilate to release a prisoner as he always had.
|
|-
|9
|But Pilate answered them, saying, Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate answered them, saying "Do you wish me to release the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|10
|For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.
|Since he knew the high priests had brought Jesus to him out of envy of His popularity.
|
|-
|11
|But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.
|But the high priests influenced the people to request the release of Barabbas.
|
|-
|12
|And Pilate answered and said again unto them, What will ye then that I shall do unto him whom ye call the King of the Jews?
|So Pilate said to the crowds, "What, then, do you wish me to do to the mean you call the King of the Jews?"
|
|-
|13
|And they cried out again, Crucify him.
|And the crowds cried out, "Crucify him."
|
|-
|14
|Then Pilate said unto them, Why, what evil hath he done? And they cried out the more exceedingly, Crucify him.
|So Pilate said to them, "Why? What has he done wrong?" And they cried out louder, "Crucify him!"
|
|-
|15
|And so Pilate, willing to content the people, released Barabbas unto them, and delivered Jesus, when he had scourged him, to be crucified.
|So Pilate, to keep the people content, released Barabbas to them, and had Jesus scourged and sent to be crucified.
|
|-
|16
|And the soldiers led him away into the hall, called Praetorium; and they call together the whole band.
|
|
|-
|17
|And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,
|
|
|-
|18
|And began to salute him, Hail, King of the Jews!
|
|
|-
|19
|And they smote him on the head with a reed, and did spit upon him, and bowing their knees worshipped him.
|
|
|-
|20
|And when they had mocked him, they took off the purple from him, and put his own clothes on him, and led him out to crucify him.
|
|
|-
|21
|And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross.
|
|
|-
|22
|And they bring him unto the place Golgotha, which is, being interpreted, The place of a skull.
|
|
|-
|23
|And they gave him to drink wine mingled with myrrh: but he received it not.
|
|
|-
|24
|And when they had crucified him, they parted his garments, casting lots upon them, what every man should take.
|
|
|-
|25
|And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
|
|
|-
|26
|And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS.
|
|
|-
|27
|And with him they crucify two thieves; the one on his right hand, and the other on his left.
|
|
|-
|28
|And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors.
|
|
|-
|29
|And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days,
|
|
|-
|30
|Save thyself, and come down from the cross.
|
|
|-
|31
|Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.
|
|
|-
|32
|Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.
|
|
|-
|33
|And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.
|
|
|-
|34
|And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
|
|
|-
|35
|And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.
|
|
|-
|36
|And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.
|
|
|-
|37
|And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.
|
|
|-
|38
|And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.
|
|
|-
|39
|And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
|
|
|-
|40
|There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;
|
|
|-
|41
|(Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
|
|
|-
|42
|And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,
|
|
|-
|43
|Joseph of Arimathaea, and honourable counseller, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
|
|
|-
|44
|And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
|
|
|-
|45
|And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
|
|
|-
|46
|And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
|
|
|-
|47
|And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
|
|
|}

==Chapter 16==

{| class="wikitable"
|-
!Verse
!King James Version
!Proposed Conservative Translation
!Analysis
|-
|1
|And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
|After the sabbath, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Salome, brought sweet spices to Jesus' body to anoint Him.
|
|-
|2
|And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
|Very early in the morning on the day after the sabbath, as the sun rose, they came to the tomb of Jesus.
|
|-
|3
|And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre?
|And the women said to each other, "Who will roll away the stone blocking the tomb door?"
|
|-
|4
|And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.
|But when the women looked, they saw that the massive stone had been rolled to the side.
|why not use the pronoun "women" here?
|-
|5
|And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
|And as they entered into the tomb, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, wearing a long white garment, and they were afraid.
|
|-
|6
|And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.
|The man said to them, "Do not fear: You seek Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He is risen, he is not here - look at the plase where they laid him.
|
|-
|7
|But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.
|Leave now, and tell Peter and the disciples of Jesus that He has gone ahead of you into Galilee: you will see him there, as he told you."
|
|-
|8
|And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
|
|
|-
|9
|Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
|
|The verses from here on are not in the oldest manuscripts, and are not likely to be authentic.<ref>http://www.bible-researcher.com/endmark.html</ref>
|-
|10
|And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.
|
|
|-
|11
|And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
|
|
|-
|12
|After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
|
|
|-
|13
|And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
|
|
|-
|14
|Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
|
|
|-
|15
|And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
|
|
|-
|16
|He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
|
|
|-
|17
|And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
|
|
|-
|18
|They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
|
|
|-
|19
|So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
|
|
|-
|20
|And they went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
|
|
|}

== References ==

<references/>